MovieChat Forums > It's a Wonderful Life (1947) Discussion > So what should Mary have been up to, if ...

So what should Mary have been up to, if George wasn't around?

posted 2 years ago by Otter (24464)
17 replies | jump to latest

I've been complaining about the one scene in the movie I dislike, where George sees what Mary would have become without him, and sees she's a mousy and virginal librarian. Which isn't believable, a girl like Mary would logically have married someone else or left that ratty town entirely, gone to the big city and used her college education to get a decent job.

I think they should have shown Mary unhappily married to someone else, have George look in the window of an ugly little house, where he could see some drunken oaf yelling at poor Mary, while her children cried in terror. That would not only be a much worse life for Mary than the peaceful life of a librarian, it'd make George feel much more threatened and disturbed.

[–] strntz (12225) a year ago

You are absolutely correct, but it was the times this movie was filmed.

In this movie, the only reason Mary didn't marry Sam Wainright is because she loved George, and had loved him from when they were kids. If there was never any George, she'd certainly have ended up with Sam or any other of the many (presumably) young men who would have courted this very pretty and very personable lady.

So why the virginal librarian? Because back in post WWII movie-going America, it was better to think that she was unsullied by another man than "cheat" on George, even though he never existed. If she was married to someone else, she was having (horrors) sex! That whore!

As another example, in 1954's Christmas Carol (Alastair Sim - probably the best filmed version of this venerable story IMO), Scrooge gets a look at his former fiance goings on years after they split and she's a spinster in this version. In the novella, Dickens had his fiance happily married to a good man with a several children - "fancy, they could have been mine" ~ Ebenezer Scrooge. In the 1954 movie however, "Alice" is an old maid who spends her Christmas doing charity work because she has nothing else in her otherwise miserable life. In the 1984 version with George C. Scott, they get this right and show his former fiance happily married with children.

I think they should have either shown Mary married or not shown her at all. If married, she could have been widowed (say) struggling to get by if they wanted to show her life as not being great for not having George in her life, but to show her as unloved and unwanted in the alternate reality doesn't really work for you or me.

[–] Otter (24464) a year ago

I think you're right, the filmmakers believed that Mary would be "cheating" or dishonored or unsympathetic or something, if there was any hint that she'd have sex with someone else if George had never existed.

Which is silly and unrealistic, but well. This is a Capra film.

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

I disagree.

I feel there's more to Mary's alternate life than we're seeing:

Figure, for example, that a library in Pottersville is a difficult place to maintain, though necessary. Kind of like the Building and Loan in actual time. I think that, absent of the Bailey family and the B&L, Mary has taken their place as the one who stands against Potter. She does it by maintaining a quiet, peaceful spot in this loud, superficial town, where money is spent on things that don't last. A library is a haven, where you can spend all day reading, thinking, being quiet and thoughtful. It is not a place of profit, and it wouldn't surprise me if Potter were after it in a similar way that he is after the B&L. In this world, Mary has no time for marriage because she is George Bailey here. But it's even harder for her than it is for George.

[–] strntz (12225) 6 months ago

A few points;

You're assuming Mary cared at all about Potter other than generally despising him like everyone else in Bedford Falls including Potters' own flunkies. Out of the several thousand people living there, why would Mary necessarily sacrifice a life of happy marriage and family to take on Potter? She never knew George so it wouldn't be like George transferred his feeling for Potter to Mary.

Would Mary have even known about the Bailey Building and Loan other than hearing it's name mentioned?

The only reason George himself ran the building and loan after his father died was because his father and his uncle Billy started it, and he worked there.

Alternate timeline Pottersville seemed to be doing just fine even with Mary's "fight" against Potter. She seemed to have no effect after 20 years of spinsterhood.

To me, there's no doubt Mary would have married Sam Wainwright.

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

Thanks!

Of course this entire conversation is assumption and speculation, so I feel free to go at it.....

If Mary is at all alert in the former Bedford Falls/Pottersville, she would be aware of Potter, what he is, what he wants and how he gets it. If she has any of the integrity we see of her in the actual timeline, she wouldn't approve of Potter or what he has done. She would be that one out thousands for the same reason that Peter Bailey was. Peter Bailey could also have been far more comfortable and probably have lived longer without the B&L, and fighting Potter, but he did anyway. Why him among the thousands in Bedford Falls? Because he understood injustice and thought he had a way to counter it. Who's to say that alternate Mary, in the absence of the Baileys, didn't fall into this slot?

The B&L need not exist for a person to form a sense of outrage against Potter: Mary would not necessarily have needed the inspiration or example of the B&L to form her own outlook and ideas of counteracting.

Mary, though, is not George, and she need not be walking the down the same path of reluctance and obligation. We don't know how or why she reached whatever decision she made or rejected in the alternate time. Maybe she *is* resentful of her position. Or maybe she isn't: we don't see enough of her to know what she's truly feeling here. You may be right; or I may be right; or, in this little fan fiction (as this feels to be!), maybe there's something completely different motivating her. We know, in the actual timeline, that she is happy in Bedford Falls, is comfortable in a small town setting, and loves old, broken things that can be made whole. She may have seen this sort of life disintegrate as Bedford Falls turns into Pottersville, and maybe this is the start of her crusade.

Potter is also doing pretty well despite the B&L. In any case, it isn't necessarily the certainty of victory that can propel a fight, but (need to do part II)

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

But letting the opposition understand that opposition exists.

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

Oh. Something else occurred to me: In the absence of George, why was little Harry at the ice pond? From what George announces, it sounds as if there are mostly older boys there. If that's the case, Harry isn't tagging after his brother but after someone else. Maybe joky, funny, Hee-Haw Sam Wainwright. In which case, Sam is indirectly responsible for the death of the Bailey's only child. Perhaps indirectly responsible therefore for an early death for Peter Bailey. It may be, then, that this preys on Sam's emotional state of mind, and there may not be a fun, successful Sam for Mary to consider for marriage.

How's THAT for speculation...?!

[–] strntz (12225) 6 months ago

Try it this way - what are the odds that Mary, having never met George, is the only other person in Bedord Falls to take on Potter? But even that is getting off the point.

In what way is she equipped to harm him at all? If her degree was in law and she turned out to be a state prosecutor, then maybe she could take him down if he did anything illegal, but nothing was shown to say Potter was anything more than just a miserable Scrooge-like skunk - he was working within the laws of the state if not the laws of decency and morality.

Finally, we see Mary not only working as a librarian, but as a miserable unmarried woman. Considering that even though Potter was doing well with George's interference, he was doing far better with Mary's (again, assuming she was). Wouldn't she pull the plug on her crusade to take down Potter at some point instead of living the rest of her life as a miserable spinster with a crappy job in the den of iniquity that was now Pottersville?

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

I don't say that Mary is trying to take Potter down. By the same token, in the actual timeline, the Baileys aren't trying to take him down either. They are simply attempting to offer a viable alternative to his slums and economic control. Similarly Mary would not necessarily be trying to take Potter down but to offer a viable alternative to that loud, messy, greedy world thriving under his hand: a place where a person can simple *be*; think; perhaps formulate a way out of Pottersville.

Also, of course, a place where a person can read, absorb ideas, think critically, argue intelligently. Perhaps it is in this way that Mary does the most harm to Potter, if harm she intends.

We assume she is miserable; we do not know. We see she is guarded, and protective against this world as she ventures outside, but this doesn't have to add up to miserable, unmarried woman. It can add up to a woman who knows she has to be on her guard on these streets - I'm a New Yorker; similarly, I also know I need to be on my guard in some areas of this city. That doesn't make me miserable, and I certainly don't consider myself such.

[–] mikethemartian (6708) 6 months ago

Fighting the Dewey Decimal system due to its sexism.

[–] Gd5150 (11747) 6 months ago

Clearly a system full of systematic misogyny.

[–] Gd5150 (11747) 6 months ago

It’s absolutely possible. The entire town would’ve been different. A uninspired, miserable cess pool with no opportunities.

[–] strntz (12225) 6 months ago

Yes, but the town wouldn't have gone to crap and turned into Pottersville until after Peter Bailey died causing the B&L to collapse - at this point both Mary and Sam were coming back to lovely Bedford Falls from college. Without George, Mary would have married Sam or one of the eligible young men certainly lined up for someone like Mary right about the time Peter Bailey died.

[–] Gd5150 (11747) 6 months ago

Yeah but Mr. Gower poisoned the kid when George was a kid so even then the town would’ve been going down the toilet.

Peter’s death could have had a big impact on the town.

Maybe George or Peter had a big influence on Sam Wainright or the other kids. It’s hard to say.

Look what happened to Violet. And Gower. And the Mom. And Nick. And Burt and Earnie.

You see, George really did have a wonderful life.

[–] strntz (12225) 6 months ago

You see, George really did have a wonderful life.

Hmmm...

[–] ejbronte (60) 6 months ago

I'm thinking the Bailey family may have gone into its own crisis after Harry's death (and my mind is kind of embroidering on my idea that Sam Wainwright may have carried guilt over encouraging little Harry). It might be that Peter Bailey (and Ma Bailey, for sure) started declining after the death of their only child; Peter may not have had the wherewithal to fight Potter, and may have either given up the B&L or may have died earlier than in the actual timeline. We don't know of course; but for sure the Baileys would have been horribly affected, and they wouldn't have been the people we know in the actual timeline.

Here's a little character note for Mary, incidentally: she is a witness to the Gower-capsule scene. George isn't the only one who kept Mr. Gower's secret.

[–] GolfnGuitars (2886) 6 months ago

I see everyone's points who has posted here...I enjoyed reading through this!

For me, the original ending (that we see in the film) works fine. I'm fine with Mary being an "old maid." One of my older sisters never married and she was very attractive, educated (PhD), nice person, etc. It happens a lot more than you think.

I know this is kind of "dark," but, given Mary's reaction when she sees George in Pottersville, it makes one wonder if she had been sexually assaulted previously, or something along those lines. Pottersville was such a "rough and tumble town" & the testosterone was definitely flowing in the guys' bloodstream there. It's obviously just speculation on my part... but I do like the original ending and think it still holds up even today.