MovieChat Forums > Steve Jobs Discussion > Talentless hack.

Talentless hack.

posted 5 months ago by chumbawampa (857)
26 replies | jump to latest

Why Steve Jobs Sucks:

Steve Jobs is the reason we got the iPhone. Are we happier since then? Hell no, and everyone knows it. All Steve Jobs did with the iPhone was put an internet browser in our pockets. It's made us less happy and less social, and the only reason Jobs did it was to dominate the smartphone market. That's it. He didn't invent the internet, or even innovate the web at all. He just took other people's ideas and put them together into something, we didn't really need and wasn't new or original at all. That's exactly what Elon Musk does.

Now, everyone is depressed and far less happy than 15 years ago by all statistics , and alot of evidence points directly to smartphone, and social media which came with the smartphone. All thanks to a megalomaniac named Steve Jobs who never innovated in his life, all he's done is make the world more antisocial and taken away all our face-to-face interaction and taken away our conversational skills.

He's also made the internet worse by essentially dumbing it down and turning the whole internet into one big social media blog.

[–] AnthonySocksss (1564) 10 days ago

Jobs was more of a salesman and marketer than he was a true innovator. Most of the technical successes he was involved with were just him taking the credit for others’ work. His actual talent lied in connecting the customer perspective to the appeal of their product.

He made computers seem cool and fun instead of intimidating and dorky. Most of the iconic Apple advertisements of the era wouldn’t have aired without his input, like the 1984 Super Bowl ad or the “Think Different” campaign. He could sell an Apple product like no one else could, and as a spokesperson had next-level charisma, unlike his peers.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 9 days ago

Yeah, except even in 1984 Apple computers were struggling to reach the consumer market.

In the 1990s Apple PC's were only in schools at teacher's desks.

Windows 95 was lightyears ahead of Apple's OS. If it wasn't for Microsoft windows, we wouldn't have 90% of the applications we have . All we would have is proprietary Apple software. Like Clarisworks. That's it. Oh, and you can forget PC gaming. Or being able to upgrade your pc hardware or put new PCI cards in.

Yes, they made a few catchy advertising campaigns... but that's all they are. Advertising... commercials. That's all Steve Jobs ever did successfully. Advertise things.

[–] Keelai (36123) 9 days ago

Not true. Apple computers were used by advertising, graphics and publishing companies because they were more powerful than PCs at the time therefore could handle the memory intensive software programs. PCs couldn't run programs like Photoshop, Illustrator or Quark-Xpress at that time. 90% of Apple users were commercial artists. Apple was more powerful and user-friendly.

Yep, Apple 1984 commercial was considered the best ad in history. It won every major ad award. Ridley Scott created it.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 7 days ago

" they were more powerful than PCs at the time therefore could handle the memory intensive software programs."

More powerful than PC's at the time?

So Mac's were faster than intel's Pentium II's? Hell no.
Mac's struggled to even run 3D PC games of the time. They didn't even have changeable graphics cards in their computers. All the innovation in PC gaming in the late 90s was happening on Windows PC's.

Photoshop was widely used on Windows for basically anything. Windows 95-98 couldn't run Photoshop? In what universe?? Everyone used Photoshop back then, even in windows. Adobe released everything on Windows. Where are you getting this fantasy that PC's couldnt run Photoshop?

[–] Keelai (36123) 6 days ago

Late 90s? No, earlier...

iMac was for consumers. I'm not talking about it:
https://images.saymedia-content.com/.image/t_share/MTg4NDIxODIxMzI0ODYzMjgx/vintagemacintosh.jpg

I'm specifically talking about Macintosh 2 and PowerMac for professional commercial artists and were used in agencies, studios and offices.

PowerMac was faster than Pentium 2:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LVCCpcPsjdc

Photoshop was originally used exclusively on PowerMac and Mac2:

"Photoshop 1.0 was released on February 19, 1990, for Macintosh exclusively."
"Photoshop was initially only available on Macintosh."
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Photoshop

George Lucas used Photoshop on Macintosh for his ILM company.

Early PCs couldn't run Photoshop and other graphic intensive programs. Graphic intensive games weren't a thing back then. I played pixelated 2d games. 90% of Apple computers were used by professional commercial artists. That's how Apple survived.

At the time, Photoshop was packaged with Illustrator and Pagemaker costing $1,000 and sold as the Adobe Creative Suite.

Eventually, PCs became more powerful and were able to run Photoshop which had still cost a grand for a long time.

Eventually Macintosh switched their processor to the same as PC.

Originally, Apple was the better computer. More powerful, better graphics, rarely infected, rarely crashed. The downside was that they were very expensive and not compatible with most software. I'm a gamer and very few were available for the Mac until they switched processors.

I've worked on Macs but I've never personally owned any Apple product mainly because of the lack of compatibility and features. I buy Dell and Samsung.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 4 days ago

"Originally, Apple was the better computer. "

Debatable. In 1993 Doom came out..
FOR MS-DOS.

Not for Mac. They didn't even release it on Mac. Because PC's were already more powerful, and could run more 3D intensive games.
All Mac had was a nice GUI and some paint programs but there was more power in MS-DOS.

What did Half Life come out on, again? Oh yeah: Windows. Sure, It came out on macOS too. In 2013. It only took Apple FIFTEEN years to release it on their platform.

[–] Keelai (36123) 4 days ago

You can't provide links like I have because you're full of nonsense.

You're confused. My links already proved that Macs were more powerful.

Now you're basically arguing with yourself since I already said games and most software were rarely released on Macintosh. The reason was because Mac's operating system wasn't compatible with most software which ran on MS-DOS. I already wrote that was a main reason why I never bought an Apple. Manufacturers weren't going to release most software for Macs when there were fewer consumers using them and Jobs wanted control over software so he charged them money to allow software use on Macs. PCs were open-source, unlike Macs, which allowed programmers free access. If you read the old computer magazines from the early 1990s like I used to do, you would know this since it was common knowledge.

Clearly you never worked on both PCs and Macs in the early 90s, therefore you don't know what you're talking about.

I doubt that you worked on a PC without any gui like I have or you wouldn't take the important development for granted.

BTW, Doom was a shitty pixelated game in 1993. I played the first levels on my PC.

I programmed games too. Android allowed anyone to upload games for free while Apple charged a fee. Same anal retentive greedy crap that discouraged programming for Apple in the early days.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 4 days ago

"BTW, Doom was a shitty pixelated game in 1993. "

Okay, you just lost all credibility.
If Apple had it's way, graphics cards wouldn't even exist. That's why they make their computers impossible to open or get into, because Steve Jobs never wanted any one to be able to change any cards out. He just wanted you to be stuck with whatever Apple gave you. No actual motherboard with PCI cards or extra drive slots that you could install new graphics and sound chips, put new disc drives in , etc.

if Apple had full domination of the PC market, we wouldn't have the market competitition that drives Nvidia vs AMD to push their chips to new limits, we would just have one, lame proprietary Apple graphics chip in our computers that we can't change out. You call that powerful computing?

[–] Keelai (36123) 4 days ago

Today's games are much better!

You:
"Steve Jobs never wanted any one to be able to change any cards out. He just wanted you to be stuck with whatever Apple gave you."

"we wouldn't have the market competitition that drives Nvidia vs AMD to push their chips to new limits"

Again, you're arguing to argue. I already wrote that a few comments ago:

Me:
"I've never personally owned any Apple product mainly because of the lack of compatibility and features."

You're confusing Apple's lack of features, compatibility and Jobs' anal retentive control over the Macs with its power. I already provided plenty of links proving the Macs were a more powerful computer whereas you provided zip because you're wrong.

I'll also state that you're a hypocrite because you use computers with gui and I bet you have a smartphone. Unless you're planning to give them up, I suggest you show Jobs who brought both and other innovations to the masses some respect.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 3 days ago

Okay, so Macs were a more powerful computer than what? All the PC's on the market?
Which Macs were more powerful? The PowerMac 1? More powerful than the PC's of the time from 1999-2006? You're telling me the PowerMac was faster and more capable than the most powerful gaming rigs of that time? Like Alienware?

The Mac II from 1987? That was more powerful than what, all the other PC's? It's not any better than the compaq 386 released a year earlier.

[–] Keelai (36123) 3 days ago

Yes. The early Mac II and PowerMac were more powerful than PCs. I suggest you click on my links for confirmation and details.

Alienware didn't exist in the 80s and early 90s.

I get the impression you were born in the 90s while I was actually using these computers.

[–] Keelai (36123) 3 days ago

Also, the PCs and portable phone companies all adapted their products from Apple innovations (ex gui, files and folders, icons, smartphones with touchscreen, etc).

[–] Keelai (36123) 6 days ago

I'll add that Windows 95 was a POS that crashed ALL THE FREAKING TIME!!!!!!!!! Apple OS was much better.

But, I agree with you about Apple struggling to reach consumers which is the reason I had bought up it as a commercial artists product. The art industry likely saved Apple.

And I also agree about Apple's lack of compatibility - one of the main reasons I never bought one.

But, Steve Jobs was an innovator who revolutionized multiple products. He was able to take ideas and actually use them when others refused to do so.

He revolutionized computers which had no graphics interface.

He created the small portable music player- iPod

And portable computer, in which the public and news people laughed and made fun of it as a useless product - iPad

He created the small portable phone - iPhone

He would've still been innovating if he had lived.

"he's done is make the world more antisocial"

Young people are very antisocial. But, I won't blame Jobs. And it's not worldwide because I see people in other countries not constantly on smartphones.

People are going to need to learn to limit their time on the smartphone and begin to interact in person. Parents should have limited their kids access to smartphones a long time ago.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 3 days ago

"He revolutionized computers which had no graphics interface."
Steve Jobs himself? No reference to Steve Wozniak? The guy who actually knew how a computer worked?

"He created the small portable music player- iPod"
MP3 players existed before the iPod... There were plenty of them. iPod wasn't the first Mp3 player on the market... They just made a better mp3 player, they didn't invent it.

"And portable computer, in which the public and news people laughed and made fun of it as a useless product - iPad"

What?? Steve Jobs invented the portable computer ? What about laptops?
Laptops aren't portable??

iPad wasn't the first portable computer - there were Palm Pilots, laptops, blackberries, etc.
So, we already had portable computers. In plenty of different forms.

Claiming the iPad is somehow a milestone in portable computing? Now you're just not being serious.
Tablets are useless. I don't even use mine, it sits on a shelf running a digital clock all day. It serves zero other purpose. A 1985 alarm clock could do the same job.

This whole Mac vs PC thing is an age old argument, we're each in our camps, probably won't ever agree. But it seems to me like you're pretty squarely in Apple's camp and it's down to personal preference.

I can't agree with you that Apple is an innovator, I just don't see it. MP3 players were already invented, typing on touch screen keyboards is a big step backwards imo, the iPad was a useless invention. We already had TV's. I just don't see the innovation in anything they do.

They make shiny smartphones which attract stupid people. And 90% of the apps we have on our phones, we never even use.

The internet was an innovation. iPads and iPods are not. They are useless gimmicky gadgets designed to get people to buy them. Not to mention the fact that no one uses either of those anymore.

[–] Keelai (36123) 2 days ago

Actually, Jobs took a tour of Xerox where a few computer techies created revolutionary innovations like gui, icons, folders, etc but management refused to use them. Jobs took notes and incorporated them into Apple.
Jobs discusses Xerox tour and product importance:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=b7aUJyJbJMw

Wozniak was an extremely shy computer techie literally working in his basement who would've remained unknown without Jobs' ambition and salesmanship. They complemented each other's strengths and weaknesses and made the perfect team!!!

"made a better mp3 player"

There was the extremely popular Sony Walkman, then CD portable players and then iPod. iPod replaced the faulty CD players which skipped music when walking. You could literally jog with an iPod.

Everyone laughed at Jobs iPad idea (including me) calling it useless since laptops were popular. Then iPad sales became huge!!!!! iPad is more portable than laptops and versatile than everything else on the market at the time. I use my tablet everyday to watch movies, shows and read books during lunch at work. Cellphones are too small.

iPad scaled down and became the iPhone then the smartphone. 95% use smartphones including you.

"Mac vs PC thing is an age old argument, we're each in our camps, probably won't ever agree."

I already said you were only arguing with yourself since I'm not in any camp. I only pointed out that you were wrong about early PCs being more powerful than Macs. I like both PCs and Macs for different reasons.

Jobs basically thought outside the box which allowed him to revolutionize several industries.

You believe Jobs was a hack, but you use his products.

Jobs hired a biographer to be brutally honest. I was able to read only the first 100 pages before returning it to the library. Anyway it may be a good book for you to read and may give you a different perspective about him. Steve Jobs by Isaacson

[–] Jes' Sayin' (6543) 10 days ago

Social media pre-dated the smartphone. Myspace, for example

[–] chumbawampa (857) 9 days ago

.........Myspace?

Anyone who was actually alive during that time knows, Myspace was never widely adopted, it was only emo kids and camwhore teenage girls. Nobody took it seriously and it eventually failed because it was an atrocious clusterf*ck of a website.
It wasn't really a social media site, it was more a homepage for you to post random attention getting images and embed a ton of gifs, SFX and nonsense.

[–] EleazarHisSon (769) 9 days ago

JULY 19, 2005
NEWS ANALYSIS
By Steve Rosenbush

In less than two years, MySpace has emerged as one of the hottest sites on the Web. It has more page views than Google (GOOG ).

https://web.archive.org/web/20110324060951/http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/jul2005/tc20050719_5427_tc119.htm

[–] chumbawampa (857) 7 days ago

"In less than two years, MySpace has emerged as one of the hottest sites on the Web."

...Myspace the hottest site on the web?

In 2005?

Are you joking? You must not have been alive in 2005. Myspace was never, ever one of the hottest sites on the Web. It was a giant steaming pile of human feces. That's all it ever was, and it only grew to a bigger pile of excrement.

Also, I don't think Steve Rosenbush, the man who wrote that article, a 42 year old man in 2005 (62 now) would know what was "hot" on the internet at the time. I somehow find it hard to believe that 42 year old men in 2005 had their fingers on the pulse of pop culture. Although, he works for the Wall Street Journal. So... he must be smart. Surely the WSJ has never published anything fallacious before!

[–] EleazarHisSon (769) 7 days ago

You must not have been alive in 2005.

I was, but I was a teenager and did not get accustomed to MySpace. The social media that we kids used here in Sweden during that time was Lunarstorm (90% of high school students were on it). Then MSN Messenger if that counts.

[–] chumbawampa (857) 4 days ago

Myspace sucked. It only exists as a precursor to Facebook, which is even worse. They both exist just to encourage people to be attention-whores, and negativity rises above all other comments. Everyone is negative on those kinds of sites because the way those sites are designed is to make you depressed and dependent. It's just like a drug addiction. The same chemical centers in your brain are being used.

[–] Jes' Sayin' (6543) 9 days ago

This is entirely beside the point.

[–] EleazarHisSon (769) 9 days ago

SixDegrees was the first social media website, launching in 1997. Well, technically, even before that, you had GeoCities and Tripod, but SixDegrees was the first with personal user profiles, I think.

[–] EleazarHisSon (769) 9 days ago

I'm certainly not a fan of nor an apologist for Steve Jobs and Apple, but Jobs didn't invent the smartphone. He also did not envision the iPhone to become what smartphones are today. To him, the iPhone was just a sleek cellphone.

[–] mikethemartian (6992) 6 days ago

Jobs skill was understanding the connection between technology and people.

[–] stickman38 (3439) 3 days ago

How dare you speak like that about a deceased person. Jobs was a great man, what the hell have you ever accomplished in your pathetic lifetime?