MovieChat Forums > Politics > Roe v Wade [Texas Edition]

Roe v Wade [Texas Edition]

posted 3 years ago by Rorikon (18355)
60 replies | jump to latest

https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/01/politics/roe-v-wade-future-supreme-court/index.html
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/02/us-supreme-court-refuses-to-block-radical-texas-abortion-law

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/01/roe-v-wade-abortion-ruling-what-to-do-world-without

- The law allows private individuals to sue violators of a ban on abortion after a fetal heartbeat can be detected, usually at around six weeks of pregnancy
- Anyone who provides or assists prohibited abortions can be sued and plaintiffs are entitled to $10,000 in damages
- The law makes no exceptions for pregnancies resulting from incest or rape
- Supreme Court precedents forbid states from banning abortion before a fetus would be viable outside the womb, usually around 22 to 24 weeks

The Supreme Court early on Wednesday allowed Texas' six-week abortion ban to go into effect despite the fact that it violates Roe v. Wade, the landmark opinion -- still on the books -- that legalized abortion nationwide prior to viability, which can occur at around 24 weeks of pregnancy.

The justices have yet to explain their thinking. In fact, they didn't even issue a ruling. Instead, they allowed a midnight deadline to pass without responding to an emergency request filed by abortion providers to block the law. The justices left that request on the table and the law went into effect.

Some supporters of abortion rights held out hope on Wednesday that they could still win at the Supreme Court and that the justices were taking their time to weed through the complexities of the case. That is still a possibility, as the court may not feel it has to heed a legislature's deadline.

But as things stand, the act of inaction by the 6-3 conservative majority court sent extremely strong signals not only about the future of Roe v. Wade, but about abortion jurisprudence going forward. And it also allowed a ban on abortion before most women know they are pregnant to go into force.

While the justices were silent Wednesday, key conservatives such as Justice Clarence Thomas have not been shy in the past to vociferously express their opinion on the court's abortion docket. In 2019, Thomas, who has publicly said Roe was wrongly decided, declared that abortion jurisprudence has "spiraled out of control." And last year Justice Neil Gorsuch did not mince his words about the court and abortion: "We have lost our way."

Christ, 6 weeks?!? Most don't even know they're pregnant until a month. That's as extreme as allowing abortion in the 3rd/final trimester. Totally not okay with this. At most, 12-15 weeks would be my limit on abortion based on brain, body, pain receptor, and sex formation. Reminds me of the "My body, my choice" on abortion/vaccination.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E-NGP_UXIAACvqX?format=jpg&name=orig

Found this pic amusing in that regard for anti-abortion folk.

[–] ultravioletx (10237) 3 years ago

If nobody deserves the right to have an abortion after six weeks because it harms an embryo...

Then nobody should have the right to be unvaccinated or maskless around children who are living and breathing outside their mothers.

No more complaining, righties. Time to give up your rights for the greater good.

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

Yep, pretty much what I mentioned at the end. The hypocrisy people use to excuse the stuff they do. Okay for me, not for thee shtick.

[–] ultravioletx (10237) 3 years ago

Agreed.

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

I just noticed now it also makes no exception to rape/incest...

[–] B1cKsurN (17795) 3 years ago

Yeah no. Children are not tax paying citizens...they can stay at home to be safe until they get jobs.

Do you support allowing natural humans to no longer pay taxes if they are to be removed from society?

[–] ultravioletx (10237) 3 years ago

Paying taxes doesn't apply here. Embryos are not tax-paying citizens either. They aren't even fetuses yet. If they aren't allowed to be harmed while doing their thing inside their mother, then children aren't allowed to be harmed by COVID while doing their thing at school.

Simple as that.

[–] B1cKsurN (17795) 3 years ago

Paying taxes most definitely applies here.

If I live in a state where my taxes are distributed to places like planned parenthood, abortions are now my problem and I have a say. Just like removing the unvaxed from society. Since my taxes pay for society, do I still have to pay them if I'm being removed?

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

[–] ultravioletx (10237) 3 years ago

Planned Parenthood receiving your tax dollars doesn't apply here.

Abortions do not need tax funding to exist. Not even close.

That's why the whole "my taxes are going to abortion" argument was stupid to begin with. The tax dollars Planned Parenthood gets goes to healthcare costs far more expensive than abortions, usually pertaining to helping women carry their babies to term.

Abortions are dirt cheap in comparison.

[–] B1cKsurN (17795) 3 years ago

You better read up on where you live because where I live, my tax money DOES go to planned parenthood so yes, I do have a say in abortions. Even if its only 1 fucking penny, that penny earns me the right to an opinion.

And I'm not against abortion, I'm against single parenthood.

Also, if a single fucking penny of mine goes towards public services/funding of private business by government, that also entitles me access to those services. If those services begin to be denied to me over an injection I do not need, then I should no longer be required to pay those taxes...

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

If the government doesn’t have the right to deny you an abortion then the government doesn’t have the right to force me to have the vaccine. Also under the law women may still have abortions, they just can’t have an abortion after a heartbeat is detected because that would make it murder.

No more complaining, lefties, it’s my body my choice and I can have the vaccine if I want and its none of your business. Time to stop killing babies.

EDIT: Also a big problem with your premise is it wasn’t the right who attempted to establish these seemingly contradicting standards, that was all the left

1st: The left says “My body my choice”
2nd: The left shames anyone who doesn’t get the vaccine
3rd: The right calls out their hypocrisy

You are trying to pass off your own double standard to the people who called you out on your double standard. Yeah your debate strategy is very cowardly, at least attempt to stand on your own two feet and stand by your original premise.

Another problem with your premise is with the vaccine the issue is completely one persons body, with abortion it isn’t, it’s also the body of the baby. False equivalence on your part.

[–] elcamino (15540) 3 years ago

You know you are pregnant at 6 weeks unless you are really whack. But in most cases a hooker girl using pregnant to con a guy into marriage needs more than 6 weeks for he deciding on it.12 is better as really she should give up and move on from him.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Now, I know you're an incel! Many women don't have regular cycles.

[–] elcamino (15540) 3 years ago

It is fact that at 6 weeks a child forms the heart,brain and spinal column.
https://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/pregnancy-week-by-week/in-depth/prenatal-care/art-20045302

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

"You know you are pregnant at 6 weeks unless you are really whack."

Missing a period is how most women know if they're pregnant. Many women don't have regular cycles. If there was a woman in your life, you would know that.

[–] Bloodshot77 (14216) 3 years ago

Oooh, burn.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Abortion pill is available through the mail.
https://apnews.com/article/us-news-medication-abortion-coronavirus-pandemic-covid-19-pandemic-1bd5c161f8e0f9f80e98b63002f50d37

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

Will it be in plain envelope though? If the GQP gets wind of this they'll just make sure those companies get banned as well. Wait, contraception isn't banned though so it should be alright then. I kept thinking they banned contraceptives as well.

Also, this is only in Texas, pretty sure you can travel outside and get an abortion in other states that support it.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E-MrqaxXIAQucAa?format=jpg&name=orig
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E-Lv89oWQAEza5S?format=jpg&name=orig

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Poor women can't afford to travel. The abortion ban targets them, not rich or middle-class women who can afford other options like travel.

I doubt the abortion pill is considered contraception.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

If they can’t travel to get an abortion then maybe they should think long and hard (no pun intended) before having sex. Also if they are too poor to travel I doubt they’d be able to pay for an abortion.

The law isn’t targeting poor people, it is protecting the rights of babies.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

You have an odd desire to punish women.

If you cared about babies, then you'd be happy to pay for prenatal care and welfare when they're born. You don't so it's obvious you just hate women.

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

ahem

Do you, erm, have any weird baby or abortion fetishes? Just wondering... Now this is just roleplay of course and the use of plan B of sort will be used.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Your kinky sex role play fantasy comment is not appropriate.

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

Lol... Can't even take a bad joke.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

What irony since you just showed you can't take a joke.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

No one is punishing women, how in your deluded mind having to have a baby that she half created after it has been demonstrated to have a heartbeat is punishment is a new one for me.

And the parents should have to pay for prenatal care and welfare, it’s their baby. Or give the baby up for adoption.

Typical libtard, always passing on your responsibility to someone else. If your cult truly cared about women they wouldn’t have allowed Afghanistan to fall to the Taliban who are now denying women their basic human rights and turning young girls into sex slaves, but your cult is strangely silent on that.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

More babies die without prenatal care. You don't want to pay, therefore you don't really care about babies. You just hate women.

Trump invited his terrorist Taliban pals to Camp David on 9/11 to sign a Surrender Agreement. Continue to support your 4x draft-dodging death cult leader.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

It's not my responsibility to pay for it, its the parents responsibility to pay for it because they created the baby and they should be expected to (if they can't then they should go to jail). You are the one who wants to kill babies so clearly I care more about babies than you do.

I guess if we go by your backwards ass logic since you care so much about covid victims why aren't you donating all your money into covid 19 research? I guess it's just easier to sit on your lazy ass and bitch.

Biden gave Afghanistan to the Taliban and now they are the 3rd most heavily armed army in the world because he also gave them our guns and military equipment, that never would have happened under Trump.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

I proudly support covid research and vaccine distribution with my taxes.

You're the hypocrite who refuses to help support pregnant poor pregnant women. You just hate women.

Actually, I supported the invasion and I support keeping an American presence in Afghanistan. I also support Massoud as I did his brave father 20 years ago. If you read my posts, you'd know that.

The GQP is the American Taliban which is why Trump invited the Taliban to lunch at Camp David on 9/11 and signed a Surrender Agreement. Both Talibans hate women.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

As does everyone else, if you truly cared you would be giving more than just the bare minimum much like how you expect me to take care of other peoples children. Hypocrite you are.

So by not supporting other people's children I hate women and am a hypocrite? Your deluded libtard logic never ceases to amaze me.

So then you should be up in arms about how your cult leader just gave the country away to the Taliban.

The DemoKKKrats are the American Taliban, they are literally aided and abetting the actual Taliban. Trump didn't surrender to the Taliban, he wanted to withdraw and that was what he said from the very beginning but it was based on conditions on the ground as in not instituting an Afghani President who's just going to run away when it gets tough like the President the DemoKKKrats backed.

You are a really a sick and disturbed individual if you think not allowing women to have abortions whenever they want (they still can have abortions BTW) is on the same level as denying women their human rights and forcing young girls to be sex slaves. The DemoKKKrats are the ones who clearly hate women.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Actually, my tax dollars support Trumpites and QAnoners in their failed states since their economies are a mess. I also paid for your 4 socialist stimulus checks. You owe me money!

So once again, I challenge YOU to support prenatal care and welfare.

"allowing women"

No, you condescending, patronizing misogynist, I don't "allow" anything. The decision is between the woman her doctor.

Trump signed a Surrender Agreement with his Taliban pals. He then helped them by removing U.S. troops so they gained more territory. And he made the Afghan prez release 500 Taliban prisoners.

Trump helped the Taliban so much, the country collapsed months faster than it should have.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

HAHAHAHAHA more backwards ass logic, I paid more in taxes than I got from the 2 stimulus checks I got so they were tax refunds to me, but they were handouts to the thugs and criminals who don't work and are the DemoKKKrat voting base.

Tell you what, first you stop supporting infanticide then we'll talk.

But the decision isn't just about the woman, it's about the baby. In that case whether I take the vaccine or not is between myself and my doctor and not your cults business. So which is it?

Trump did not abandon US citizens behind enemy lines, Trump would not have pulled out until he knew the country was secure, Biden did because he wanted to take a victory lap on the 20th anniversary and because of 13 US marines died, the Taliban took control of Afghanistan, women are now being abused, our enemies are emboldened, our allies will never help us again because they know Biden will ditch them. This was the worst thing to happen to the country since the Civil War and it happened on your cult leaders watch.

You should be in prison for supporting the son of a bitch, we certainly would have prosecuted those who supported Adolf Hitler.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

You should happily support prenatal care and welfare, Mr/Miss Moneybags.

You should also support unlimited Afghan immigration as do I. At least they would be pro-democracy and anti-Taliban unlike the GQP you support.

Your fake outrage fools no one since you supported Trump's Surrender.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

First of all I'm not rich, secondly stop condoning baby murder, help me ban abortions in all cases except rape AND it endangers the mothers life, then we'll talk

Your cult is on the side of the Taliban, you have that backwards libtard.

Trump didn't surrender, he was staying to make sure the Afghan government was trained to keep the Taliban out, Biden ran away because he wanted a victory lap which he hoped would help his sinking presidency, he literally murdered people and took a giant dump on the sacrifice of our military for political reasons. He should be impeached and jailed. Not to mention that he was apparently so bored during the memorial service that he checked his watch multiple times, Geez president Sippy Cup, I'm sorry that the deaths of 13 marines that you murdered is too big of an inconvenience to your very easy schedule.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/61338a610b4f1b1c4bbdc0d0/The-GOP-Kills-Babies-At-The-Border-by-Denying-Entry

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

Lol so enforcing immigration laws equates to baby murder? Again enforcing immigration laws doesn’t directly lead to a babies death (although Biden’s cages might), an abortion does

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/61338a610b4f1b1c4bbdc0d0/The-GOP-Kills-Babies-At-The-Border-by-Denying-Entry

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

I accept your concession seeing how you refuse to respond to my post.

[–] chilidoggg (14574) 3 years ago

So Roberts and the three Democrats wanted to grant the emergency stay

https://news.yahoo.com/chief-justice-roberts-3-other-063747804.html

The way I understand it, when someone wants to appeal a decision at the USSC, 4 justices have to decide that they want to review it. In this Texas case, they had the 4.

Roberts is the Chief Justice, he can probably change the rules. Maybe it's like the Senate where procedural rules can only be changed at the beginning of the term. But the USSC convenes in October - maybe the rules will change to allow the stay then.

[–] kspkap (13625) 3 years ago

” The Supreme Court early on Wednesday allowed Texas' six-week abortion ban to go into effect despite the fact that it violates Roe v. Wade, the landmark opinion -- still on the books -- that legalized abortion nationwide prior to viability, which can occur at around 24 weeks of pregnancy.”

Not 24 weeks. The ruling from the SCOTUS in ‘73 was the first trimester, 12 weeks.

Photos of a baby’s development month by month. Look at 12 weeks. If that isn’t a human being I don’t know what is! BTW, the heart starts beating at 4 weeks. It sickens me to know we barbaric humans rip to pieces a 16 week baby in the womb, a 20 week baby in the womb, a 24 week baby in the womb, etc. New studies are showing a baby can feel pain at 12 weeks.

https://www.webmd.com/baby/ss/slideshow-fetal-development

I’ve never heard anyone saying “I’m having a fetus.” The womb: At one time the safest place to be for a baby. 😢

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

If you cared about life, you'd wear a mask to protect others.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

According to Fauci masks don’t work

Also if you cared about life you would support the Texas Bill, clearly you don’t which doesn’t surprise me. The only way for your pathetic excuse of an argument to go forward is for you to admit you don’t care about life.

EDIT: Another problem with your premise, not wearing a mask doesn’t directly kill someone, an abortion does. False equivalence on your part.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Your death cult murdered 600,000+ Americans by refusing to wear masks and getting vaccinated.

Your death cult knows zip about science since you believe a horse dewormer cures covid.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

The Demokkkrats were more concerned with a fake impeachment when it could have made a difference. Your cult murdered over 600,000 innocent people along with 13 brave marines who they abandoned to be murdered by the Taliban.

You’re cult doesn’t know the first thing about science and that’s hilarious coming from the libtard who thinks men can not only get pregnant but are “half female”

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

You're gaslighting so obviously you have no logical argument.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

I’m just being accurate, I’m sorry your cult has indoctrinated you so badly that reality is that distorted to you.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

Also I clearly explained : an abortion directly leads to a death, not wearing a mask does not, false equivalence

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Wearing a mask stops the spread and social distancing which you reject prevents covid. 600,000+ dead is irrelevant to you.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

Not wearing a mask doesn’t directly kill anyone, an abortion does numb nuts. And if you gave a damn about masks you’d call out your cult leaders like Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer who have been caught without one. Also Fauci said they won’t stop Covid. If you people had listened to President Trump when it would have mattered then those 600000 people would still be alive. They literally died so you could have a fake impeachment , you are glad they are dead so you could politicize them like you do everything else.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Every surgeon and dentist wears a mask.

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

Ok I just went outside and I didn’t have a mask on, please tell me who I killed? Because the woman who has an abortion I can point to who she killed

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/61338a610b4f1b1c4bbdc0d0/The-GOP-Kills-Babies-At-The-Border-by-Denying-Entry

[–] MovieChatUser497 (18943) 3 years ago

I accept your concession seeing how you refuse to respond to my post.

[–] kspkap (13625) 3 years ago

Yet again, you spread misinformation. I would say people who believe as you do (the ignorant) are the ones responsible, for perhaps, killing others. Once again: MASKS DO NOT PROTECT YOU AND OTHERS FROM COVID-19 AND ITS VARIANTS! Masks are window dressings which do not stop the windows from breaking or the heat from the sun making a room warmer.

[–] Keelai (36078) 3 years ago

Tell that to doctors and surgeons who wear masks.

[–] kspkap (13625) 3 years ago

Without a doubt these poor souls wore masks!

April 28, 2020

”WIDELY USED SURGICAL MASKS ARE PUTTING HEALTH CARE WORKERS AT SERIOUS RISK”

”Relying on surgical masks — which are considerably less protective than N95 respirators — is almost certainly fueling illness among frontline health workers.

As of April 23, more than 21,800 health care workers had gotten the coronavirus and 71 had died.”

MAY 24, 2021

At least 115,000 health workers have died from COVID: WHO

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-05-health-workers-died-covid.html

[–] kspkap (13625) 3 years ago

I don’t suffer fools such as yourself. For the nth time masks won’t stop you from getting the virus and it won’t stop you from giving the virus. Having an abortion is a definite way to kill someone. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[–] Rorikon (18355) 3 years ago

https://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/cms/asset/66ff7182-ed28-4bfc-98bd-d56f33c49907/ehp2268_f1.jpg

Imo I think a baby is aware once you feel that first kick at around 18 weeks. It's a sign saying, "Hey bitch, I am alive, don't you dare abort me."

12 weeks it only looks slightly human. Second trimester is when things start looking more like a human. My limit is still at 12-15 weeks. 12-13 weeks is the last stage of the first trimester and the very start of the second should be the outer limit.

[–] kspkap (13625) 3 years ago

To most people looking at a 12 week baby in utero they would declare it’s a human. They would see the face, arms and hands of a human being growing. What other future sentient being looks this way at 12 weeks?

[–] TimMC (9143) 3 years ago

I know I know.

Everyday that I can't kill a baby is a miserable day.

I get it.

[–] TexasJack (12516) 3 years ago

They followed up with a brief opinion and several dissenting opinions:

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/20pdf/21a24_8759.pdf

Texas wrote the law in such a way that the state or local governments would not be able to take action to enforce the law, but rather gives Texas citizens the right to bring civil actions against abortion providers.

The Court did not issue a preliminary injunction because "federal courts enjoy the power to enjoin individuals tasked with enforcing laws, not the laws themselves. And it is unclear whether the named defendants in this lawsuit can or will seek to enforce the Texas law against the applicants in a manner that might permit our intervention." (emphasis added)

So the bottom line is that this is a very narrow opinion focused on an extremely technical legal question that has never come before the courts to this point. It does not foretell the reversal of Roe v. Wade, nor does it prevent the plaintiffs from attempting to obtain another injunction in the future if/when there are actual defendants, i.e. a party or parties that attempt to enforce the Texas law by filing a civil action against one or more abortion providers.