MovieChat Forums > Politics > I got called a transphobe today and I ga...

I got called a transphobe today and I gave a response that left the person without anything to say.


I was having a conversation with someone where I said that trans people deserve equal rights and that gender dysphoria is a difficult thing to suffer from and they don't deserve to be ridiculed. I added that I don't believe that someone is now the gender they transition to. They called me a transphobe and said "who are you to deny how they identify?" I said "how am I a transphobe when I don't identify as one?" She was standing there for a few seconds and gave the excuse of "that's not how it works".

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So you’re a girl?

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I'm a dude. I just don't identify as a transphobe.

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Clever response.

Hers wasn't, though.

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You sure seem to get into these types of situations a lot.

But to get to the point, transphobe isn't a gender identity.

Also, he/she was correct to say you aren't the one to deny how someone else should identify. However, what the trans community doesn't quite understand is it's not really up to them either. It's up to the majority of society. If the majority accepts a trans-woman as a woman, then she is a woman. If the majority rejects him, then he is not.

Right now it's a passability contest. And it's often difficult, and sometimes downright impossible, to know what the majority thinks when the trans individual doesn't quite pass.

However, there are certain situations where you know what the majority would say.

For example, If I was to ask every person in the country which gender Shawn Stinson is...

http://www.transvalid.org/wp-content/uploads/shawn3.png

...I'm 100% sure the majority would side with him being a man, even if I informed them he has XX chromosomes, was born with a vagina and still has one.

A transphobe is someone who doesn't care about what the majority thinks. Like this guy:

https://moviechat.org/bd0000082/Politics/5dd707d03b7083088a0842cd/Trans-male-given-access-to-female-locker-room?reply=5dd83961fa3d301332d53b80

He assumes he knows better because of his feelings.

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You sure seem to get into these types of situations a lot.


It's usually with the same people.


But to get to the point, transphobe isn't a gender identity.


I know. I just wanted to illustrate to her that just because someone identifies as something, that doesn't mean we should just go along with it.


A transphobe is someone who doesn't care about what the majority thinks.


The thing is that I even told her I hate when someone is made fun of for being transgender and they deserve equal rights. Calling me a transphobe for not seeing how the can't be a gender they weren't born with is just lazy. Save that for people who actually hate them.

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I know. I just wanted to illustrate to her that just because someone identifies as something, that doesn't mean we should just go along with it.
Which I agree with. It all comes down to personal freedom.

It's a common misconception for people to think their right to identify someone else comes from what that other person looks like. The reality is you have the right to identify anyone as anything you want, regardless of what they look like.

As I stated below, Ben Shapiro can call Caitlyn Jenner a man because of the same reason Caitlyn Jenner can call Ben Shapiro a woman. There's no mechanism to force an individual to refer to him as a man.

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"It's a common misconception for people to think their right to identify someone else comes from what that other person looks like."

FFS, it's not a "common misconception!!!!!!! It's common sense!!!!

Jesus, how did western society get to be so f'n insane?!!!

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This is stupid. But coming from UV, what else is new?

As I stated below, Ben Shapiro can call Caitlyn Jenner a man because of the same reason Caitlyn Jenner can call Ben Shapiro a woman. There's no mechanism to force an individual to refer to him as a man.

Is Ben Shapiro calling Caitlyn Jenner a man is stating fact without any intention of insult, while Caitlyn Jenner calling Ben Shapiro is an insult. That's the difference. But because UV and others like him are snowflakes steeped in identity politics, they take it as a slight.

The right to identify someone does not come from what that person looks like. That right comes from the US government.

Where is it stated that gives the government that right, pray tell? Is that what you want? You want compelled speech, don't you? Just like Canada and exactly what Jordan Peterson is fighting against. Once again, you've PROVEN you're a socialist or even a goose stepping fascist. In this country, there a big green statue in New York harbor. What's it called again? I know it's not called the Statue of Socialism, that's for sure. Why don't you move to Venezuela? 🤪🤪🤪

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"You didn't even read the post with that quote in it."

Didn't I? That's funny, I could have sworn I did.

"The right to identify someone does not come from what that person looks like. That right comes from the US government."

So now you're citing the US government as the ultimate arbiter of what's "right". You sound like the quintessential sheep.

"I have the right to identify you as a mental midget. I don't have to see you to have that right."

You must be an easy mark on dating sites. Better watch out for those 65 year olds who tell you they're 25 and hot. You'd believe it in a second.

"So yes, it is a misconception. You stepped right into it. Because you are a mental midget. Just like all Trump supporters :)"

The smiley at the end of that suggests that you don't even believe it yourself. It's as I figured. You only posted this poppycock to rile people.

I don't have to see you to identify you as an angry loner.............. with issues.....

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So now you're citing the US government as the ultimate arbiter of what's "right".
Not what's right, corn pop. What IS a right. Your government determines what rights you have. That is what I was talking about. I was talking about the RIGHT to identify someone as whatever you choose. You missed it because of ignorance.

You haven't refuted anything I said. Just silly quips about dating sites (something I've never used) and some weird conjecture about smileys.

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Lol, you reported the post because you're too much of a coward to admit you messed up.

Okay, fine. I'll give you the version that doesn't make you go cry in the corner.

You didn't even read the post with that quote in it.

The right to identify someone does not come from what that person looks like. That right comes from the US government.

I have the right to identify you as an idiot. I don't have to see you to have that right.

So yes, it is a misconception. You stepped right into it.

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Your government determines what rights you have. That is what I was talking about....

The right to identify someone does not come from what that person looks like. That right comes from the US government.

Spoken like a true communist. It's tangential of course, but you're also wrong about this. Governments choose whether to respect or violate rights like that, but the US government itself says that natural rights like basic liberty (including free speech) come from the "Creator" who endows all people with them.

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Is that more of your science? lol. The only "creator" proven by science is your parents. Every other creator is baseless mythology.

Not that it matters. The government determines which of the "creator-given-rights" are allowed and which ones are not.

For example, in Exodus 21 you are allowed to own Hebrew slaves. In the US, you are not.

Go back to bible school, kiddo.

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I didn't say rights were based on science, you idiot. That's political philosophy. It's what makes the freedom to pursue things like science possible; the same freedom that governs speech. And you've already embarrassed yourself enough on the other topics. Don't make it worse by adding biblical scholarship or other topics you know nothing about unless you're going all in on wanting people to feel sorry for you.

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I mentioned science because you started your useless babble by calling me a sciencephobe, then proceeded to say rights are given by some creator that doesn't have a real definition according to science. The reality is the government is giving you your "creator-given-rights." No ifs, ands or buts.

You keep saying I'm embarrassed but all I see is you ditching your own points. First science, now creator. Lol.

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Oh wow. You're drowning on every topic. Even your discernment is lousy. Let me walk you through this. I called you a "sciencephobe" ironically to mock your use of "transphobe" (a big clue should have been me in this same thread mocking modern leftists' use of "phobe" tacked on to any group they don't want challenged in any way). That said, you are contradicting hard biological science with your social construction stance on sex. By contrast, me acknowledging that things other than science exist, like art, religion, or political philosophy, is not contradicting science. It's undeniably true. In fact the scientific method, developed by Francis Bacon about 400 years ago, wouldn't exist without some of those things. There's certainly no scientific proof that God doesn't exist, so believing in God (due to a combination of objective and subjective evidence, for example) isn't anti-scientific. It's supra-scientific. So are math and logic.

Hope this helps.

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Whooaa what?!!! I "reported the post"??! Sorry, that's your galloping paranoia acting up again.

I don't report posts. I've never done that, and I never will.

You're seeing enemies everywhere, it seems.

Again, so you get it: I do not report posts. Ever.

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Excellent post!

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Thanks. It's fun watching them tripping over themselves on this one.

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Pat yourself on the back all you want. You're a phony dunce, plain and simple.

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Yep, there it is.

Hey honey, nobody's tripping over anything. What you're seeing is peoples' bewilderment that anyone can not only believe such nonsense, but can also post it on a forum for other people to see.

I suppose it helps that you aren't susceptible to embarrassment.

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I'm sorry your ignorance doesn't allow you to know the difference between "what's right" and "what is a right."

But you can totally dodge the issue by replying to me somewhere else on the forum... honey cakes.

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Well, talking to you is starting to get boring. Your kind of deliberately "outrageous" posts do become stale after a while, you know.

But you're like a bad accident; we all stop to gawk. Afterwards, we feel a bit annoyed with ourselves.

Anyway, tell us, what do you identify as? Pick one:

Male, man, female woman; woman-with-testicles, man-with-uterus; little boy, little girl; old man, old woman; Gentleman, Lady... or which of the 500 fictional characters are you???

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I'm sorry your ignorance doesn't allow you to know the difference between "what's right" and "what is a right."

Maybe next time you will read a book about what rights are before making assumptions on topics you know nothing about.

Just look at that last sentence of yours. You just insinuated that Male, man, female, woman, little boy, little girl, old man, old woman, gentleman and lady are fictional characters.

Lmao.

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"You just insinuated that Male, man, female, woman, little boy, little girl, old man, old woman, gentleman and lady are fictional characters."

No no, that's what YOU do!

Obviously the 500 other fictional characters refers to the invented genders that you believe in. I've removed "other" to make it easier for you to comprehend.

So anyway, which one are you? Or are you a hybrid of several? You sound like it.

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Sorry, corn pop. You're in your fictional fantasyland on that one. I don't believe any fictional characters are real.

You removed other because it was a grammatical error that I caught you on, corn pop.

You can do better, corn pop. You can do better.

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No, I removed "other" because it insinuated the inclusion of normal genders in the category of fictional genders. Also because it was possibly confusing, in the context of other posts.

You don't believe fictional characters are real? Well, then, that's sorted. I don't believe they're real, either. You obviously do.

So, again, which are you?

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Like I said, it was a grammatical error. Any "confusion" was due to it being used improperly in grammar.

First you say it's sorted, then you say it isn't?

Do you have schizophrenia, corn pop?

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It's sorted. The question is clearly, "Which fictional character are you"?

To make it even easier, "fictional Characters" in this context are all of the invented genders which you and those like you are promoting as legitimate genders. You know the ones I'm talking about.

Which. One. Are. You?

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My gender identity is a rare one. I could tell you, but it might get deleted. So fair warning.

It's known as popcornyisaninbred.

As I said, fair warning.

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Okay, tell you what, I'm done. I can take a little bit of boredom but not this much. And to be honest it doesn't really matter whether you tell us what you are, or not. I could make a guess, but... bored.

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So long, corn pop. If you're really that bored then you should read a book about what rights are. It would help reduce your ignorance on the matter.

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You sound like a sciencephobe. Biological reality isn't dictated by what society thinks, you Orwellian twerp.

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Science can only say a male is a male and a female is a female. It cannot say a male must be a man or a female must be a woman. Man and woman are terms defined by society. For example, no male is born a man. It is something the male has to grow into. When does it happen? It's up to society. Science has no clue.

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You clearly do not believe in science, facts, or reality.

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You can pretend to believe that, but you cannot articulate how it is true. Because you know I'm right.

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"Science can only say a male is a male and a female is a female. It cannot say a male must be a man or a female must be a woman. Man and woman are terms defined by society. For example, no male is born a man. It is something the male has to grow into. When does it happen? It's up to society. Science has no clue."

Seriously, what the hell are you rambling about here?

There are two genders, the rest are mental disorders.

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You don't believe there are two genders though.

Man, woman, boy, girl... so there's at least 4. Science has no clue when one becomes the other.

The mental disorder seems to be in your own head that can't even count to 4.

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Man and boy are Male
Woman and Girl are Female

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What determines when a boy become a man? Science doesn't tell you. All science says is that XY chromosomes are male.

You've put yourself in a corner... again.

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Ever hear of puberty?

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Are you trolling or really this stupid? Some people aren't done with puberty until they are in their 20s.

Science doesn't dictate when a boy becomes a man. Something else does. You don't want to admit it because you're stuck in that corner.

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Please go look up the definition of puberty, help yourself. In short it is the process where a boy or girl becomes and adult. What are adults called? Men or women. Laws also dictate when you become an adult.

Based on your sick logic, a 60 year old man could identify as as a nine year old boy and have his way with little girls. Sick! You people not only defend this, but encourage it! Need to get sick people you off the streets.

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Puberty is when a person is capable of achieving reproduction, which generally happens before the age of 12.

So by your stupid pedophile logic, 12 year olds are adults according to science. Yet 12 year olds are most definitely not considered adults in the US.

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Puberty does not end at 12.

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Jesus, Violet, you're even more confused than I thought!

You say, "Puberty is when a person is capable of achieving reproduction.", and then;

"Some people aren't done with puberty until they are in their 20s."

What the hell are you on?!

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It's called reality, corn pop. You're just too ignorant to see it. You should try reading a book sometimes.

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Nevermind the phony UV, Littlefinger. It's only obvious he's wrong. He's trying to save face by arguing semantics now. Another one of his "honest" discussions. It's pathetic. 😁😁😁

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Science can only say a male is a male and a female is a female. It cannot say a male must be a man or a female must be a woman. Man and woman are terms defined by society.

As opposed to "male" and "female"? What a load of self-contradicting gibberish. I'm speaking of the scientific reality. A man is an adult male. He doesn't stop being male at some point. Male and female pronouns traditionally, correctly, and usefully identify this biological distinction.

Of course one could try to philosophically deconstruct the nature of reality itself or even just human perception of it, but to do that you’d have to go a lot deeper than mere language evolution, let alone terminological posturing by fringe, intellectually bankrupt special interests.



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"A man is an adult male."

Science doesn't make the distinction between minor and adult. Science doesn't dictate when a boy becomes a man. Something else does.

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You missed the point, which was that "man" and "boy" are both words for male humans, a biological distinction from females that doesn't change with time. Traditional masculine and feminine pronouns are useful and arguably vital to society in dealing with this scientific reality. You apparently wrongly feel they're frivolous. And of course even your off topic remark is wrong since biology says a great deal about puberty, growth, aging etc., regardless of precisely when you feel like demarcating adulthood. Not that it matters since even adult men are often (usually playfully) called "boys" while women are often called "girls". You're bizarrely trying to divert a debate about scientific sex categories onto one about life stage.

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You missed your own point where you said science determines what a man and a boy are. It does no such thing. For the second time, science determines that a human with XY chromosomes is a male, and a human with XX chromosomes is a female. Though there are instances where some humans are missing a chromosome, which are called XO, and are by default considered female. There are also XXY, XYY, etc. So if you want to get down to the real definitions of what male and female are... male is the presence of a Y, female is the lack of a Y. The initial X is a given as it is the signature of all humans.

However, what determines a man is society. This is the concept you know is true but refuse to admit. Society determines when a boy becomes a man. If society says a boy can become a woman, then a boy can become a woman. Science doesn't care, because all science says is that if there is a Y present, then it is male.

You can keep repeating your circular logic of 'a man is a male because a male is a man' all you want. You can even continue incorrectly suggesting science deems it as such. But all you are really arguing here is your feelings.

If the majority determines this:

http://www.transvalid.org/wp-content/uploads/shawn3.png

To be a man, then so it is.

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Wow, you didn't even read the post you just replied to. I didn't say science determines when a boy becomes a man (though it heavily informs it, unless you feel puberty and physical development are social constructs). You're the one hung up on the man/boy thing that's irrelevant to this discussion. My point was that both those terms (and some others) refer to males. Your insipid argument seems to be that because some things are at least partly social conventions, like when to refer to people as adults, then all things must be social conventions. You're logically wrong. The sex difference is a concrete biological dichotomy, not a gradual development like aging. The extremely rare cases you waste half your post on for some reason are deformities, not different sexes, not that it would help your social construct case anyway if there were more than two sexes since you're still talking chromosomes here.


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Violet, you're talking nonsense, (and I have a sneaking suspicion that you know you are).

Either that, or you're bored and you're trying to rile people by making ludicrous comments in your posts.

Maybe you're, dare I say it, seeking attention?

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No you.

I've articulated my argument.

Instead of articulating yours, you've resorted to spewing empty rhetoric.

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LOLOL!!! You just proved that you have no more grasp of the meaning of "rhetoric" than you do of "gender"!!!

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"Science can only say a male is a male and a female is a female. It cannot say a male must be a man or a female must be a woman. Man and woman are terms defined by society. For example, no male is born a man. It is something the male has to grow into. When does it happen? It's up to society. Science has no clue."

You do realise that you're getting into stereotypical labels, not identities, don't you Violet? It's not far from calling any male person a "Gentleman", and every female person a "Lady". I would have though you'd be the first to object to that..

Would you want society to refer to Ladies as Gentlemen? Or to Gentlemen as Ladies? You people love that word "gender", because it sounds more "scientific" than just plain "Sex". We "sex" animals according to whether they have a penis or a vagina. The same has always applied to humans, and always will.

Now, of course there are hermaphrodites, who are an accident of birth. And there are psychotics, who are normal people whose mental processes have been damaged. But the first are exceptions which science already recognises, and the second are unfortunate people who are suffering with an illness. But every male is a "gentleman", and every female is a "Lady".

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That's right. Identifying as male doesn't make you male or vice versa. Why is that so hard to understand? Does identifying yourself as a unicorn make you one, pray tell? In all seriousness, how stupid is that?

Yet, look at phony boy, UV preach identity politics. "It's up to the majority of society." Again, how stupid is that? UV would let society dictate what he is for himself. Individuality be damned. There is no freedom of choice or liberty in his idiotic utopia. Everything would be dictated by the masses. The dimness is astounding.

With the idiotic posts from Fredo, Dick Dick, dogdump, komrade keelai, BuckSwope, and others, I am always surprised at how each one outdoes the others stupidity. 🤪🤪🤪🤪

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Living in your head rent free!!!!!!

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You're welcome. 🤪🤪🤪

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[deleted]

The decided to exit stage right!

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Anybody's free to play pretend and identify as and live as whatever gender they want without having to be shamed or made fun of about it. But they are not free to (nor is anybody else free to) force others into play pretending along with them. Hell, you are free to identify as a dog, or tree, or alien if you want. But you can't force people to agree with you and make them say yes, you are indeed a tree, or a dog or an alien etc. That's what they and the SJW brigade try to do to people and that is wrong.

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While that is true, you are kinda missing an underlying point of personal freedom.

The reason Ben Shapiro has the right to call Caitlyn Jenner a man is because Caitlyn Jenner has the right to call Ben Shapiro a woman.

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Bruce Jenner no matter what he does to himself, will always have the XY chromosomes and be a male.

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I agree. Caitlyn Jenner is a male. Society does not get to determine what a male and female are. It's up to biological science.

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Bruce is also a man based on science

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When did science say Bruce became a man then?

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Men have XY chromosomes. Thank you, and good night. You can't win this.

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Lol, trying to troll your way out of it. You just got done saying men require puberty. Dumbass.

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Men, boys , males, bros, dudes, homies, whatever you want to call them all have the XY chromosome.

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Not this one:

http://www.transvalid.org/wp-content/uploads/shawn3.png

This one has XX chromosomes. Society says so. And science doesn't care.

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Lol

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Then he is actually a she. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.....🤪🤪🤪

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"you are kinda missing an underlying point of personal freedom."

"Personal freedom." That's a dogmatic article of faith with you, isn't it. Like it's an unassailable rule, and has no qualifications.

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And yet you start a thread that prompts the real transphobes to kick off. Not your intention? Sure, cause you didn’t know that would be exactly the reaction you would get on this forum. Right. Whatever.

Do you identify as a bloody shit stirrer? You should.

It’s the cheekiness innit?

If a manly looking woman introduces herself to me as Barbara, then it is Barbara I will call her. Like it’s any skin off my nose. As long as Barbara ain’t no bitch she can be my friend.

Perhaps my simplicity doesn’t factor in the wider social implications but if it means that a trans person gets one friendly interaction in their day I’m ok with that.

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A proper name isn't the same as a pronoun, and there are no "real transphobes" because it's a BS term, just like all the cases of the left tacking on "phobe" to whatever group they don't want criticized or disagreed with in any way.

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"It's a BS term, just like all the cases of the left tacking on "phobe" to whatever group they don't want criticized or disagreed with in any way."

Exactly. It's probably to be expected that they are so careless with their choice of terms. "Phobic" is a psychiatric term that means an irrational and debilitating fear accompanied by excessive and obsessive avoidance behaviour. They like to apply the term to anybody who doesn't go along with their nutcase notions because, well, nobody wants to be called that, do they?

Transphobic, homophobic, whateverphobic, are all false accusations, and should be dismissed like any other fallacy.

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Well said.

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If a manly looking woman introduces herself to me as Barbara, then it is Barbara


The thing is that the person I was speaking to wasn't transgender. I told her my beliefs and that was it. If I was talking to a transgender woman, I wouldn't just say, "you're still a dude". That would just be rude. We also didn't discuss whether or not I would call them by the name they prefer.

If transphobes wanna go off, then that's on them and the door is opened for them to be called out on it. Everything is up for discussion. If I posted "The Godfather is the greatest film of all time" no doubt that there would be people disagreeing with me.

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You're alright, samoanjoes :)

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Blushing.

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Excluding comments that may not be visible to me due to blocking, I don't see any "transphobes" commenting here. Nobody here, that I can see, has said anything about how living as the opposite sex is wrong and shouldn't be allowed or shouldn't have the right to do, or that it's disgusting/gross/nasty. Those types of opinions/comments is what constitutes being transphobic. As far as this post being made to stir the pot, I'd say yup LOL!! 😆😆😆😆

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They're lurking April, make no mistake! mwahahahahaha *twirls mustache menacingly*

Sometimes it's not hard to detect the prejudice underlying faux-benign statements. "They can live any delusion they want but I won't accept them as as female if they are born male"... blah blah blah. Not exactly promoting harmony, you know?

Do you ever see ANYTHING positive said about transgender people in these threads? That's my point.

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But that's not what transphobia is. Transphobia is thinking and saying that changing your identity should not be allowed or that a person has no right to do it or saying that it's disgusting or an abomination. Or harassing, degrading, bashing, or physically harming them for it. Plain and simple. And nobody here on this post has stated such things.

Not allowing yourself to be forced to agree to or forced to refer to Bruce Jenner as female, for example, is not transphobia.

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No, no one has stated as such. No one has said "here's what I like or admire about trans people" either. It's always negative. I saw a similar thread about gay marriage and yes, no one there came out and said gays are an abomination or disgusting, but there were pages and pages of people saying shit that would be pretty hurtful for any gay person to read. "Do what you like but stay away from our institutions and our children" was the overriding theme.

It's all about debate isn't it? Only that debate doesn't work so well when there's only one side being debated.

Take the word "transphobia" out of it and put yourself in the place of a trans person reading this thread. Would it make you feel good about yourself or give you hope about people being a little less judgmental? Probably most of us don't care.

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I am responding to what you said in your original comment. There has been no REAL transphobic comments kicked off here in this post. And yes, it was posted to stir the pot. I personally wouldn't care less if people refused to call me male if I changed identities because I'm not a SJW fanatic and can comprehend that even though I'd be dressing and living as male that I wouldn't actually be one. And I don't see anything here that should cause a transgender to feel bad about themselves at all. As far as judgement, that's part of human nature that can never be changed. No matter what the subject. We judge people *Every* *Single* *Day*. Whether it be a friend, a neighbor, the person walking down the street, the person in the car ahead of us, a coworker, the cashier at a store, an actor's performance in a film etc etc etc etc. We, meaning everybody, judge people every day of our lives. That will never change because that's part of being the species called homosapien.

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Sweet, judge away. Have a nice day April.

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Oh I will. Just as you will. Just as you did on this post. Just as we all will. Have a good one. 😊

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Rekt much?

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I don't understand what that means Sandman, sorry. I assume you were being friendly so thank you.

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I definitely wasn't trying to stir the pot. I was actually hoping someone would disagree so I could see if my example to her was accurate enough. I was looking for a discussion. I'd definitely make it more clear if I was trying to stir the pot.

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Any post about changing sexes stirs the pot. That's a given.

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Anything with politics will.

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Mistaken identity case. FTFY!

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They called me a transphobe and said "who are you to deny how they identify?" I said "how am I a transphobe when I don't identify as one?" She was standing there for a few seconds and gave the excuse of "that's not how it works".

Bewildered and confused from the lack of rebuttal responses that all her liberal college professors tried to indoctrinate on her on how to win arguments/debates on gender, she did the first act that came into her mind. She ripped off her shirt revealing her progressively liberated braless breasts which stunned samoanjoes for just a few seconds, enough to make a quick escape.


C'mon man. At least make this pointless story more exciting or at least more engaging in read.

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