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malika585's Replies
I agree wholeheartedly. This was insipid at best, mediocre songs, really on the nose lyrics. I did not like Country Strong but compared to this it was a bloody masterpiece.
How does it compare to Annabelle?
In the scene where Brienne pens the narrative, it becomes clear that history remembers Danny, the Mother of Dragons, as the Mother of the Seven Kingdoms. Jon Targaryen is remembered as the Guardian King of the Seven Kingdoms. The last scene could be a group of mason's building a stone statue of Danny and Jon, in the same city square where Ned Stark was beheaded. A large moving shadow falls on the statues and people look up at the sky but the audience does not see the dragon. It is clear the dragon is leaving Westeros, signaling the death of the last surviving Targaryen. Jon leaves no heirs and another game of thrones begins.
@gater, That sounds about right. To continue...
In my version, that would give Danny and Jon enough time to have fallen in love in a more believable way while keeping some time to build up a mature conflict over Jon being a Targaryen. Also, Danny may or may not be expecting their child.
The final battle with the Night King would have taken 3-4 episodes. The armies would have been losing badly until Sam tells Jon about the Azor Ahai prophecy in the penultimate episode. It would state that Azhor Ahai sacrificed his beloved wife, Nissa Nissa to create the famous sword, Lightbringer, which was used to kill the Night King in the past. That means Jon has to kill Danny to create a new Lightbringer sword. It will be the only way to kill the Night King. Jon refuses but ultimately Danny finds out and seeing that the world is at stake, she convinces Jon to complete the ritual. Or she sacrifices herself and it gives us a chance to see her one last time with her fire magic.
In her choosing to die we keep Danny's story arc consistent and also see her growth from being an ambitious conqueror to a courageous protector. Jon's story arc is to be the ultimate tragic hero. Through Danny's death, he once again loses all that he cherishes, the woman he loves, the family he could have had, and a chance at a happy life, for the sake of the greater good. He is the one who strikes the killing blow on the Night King because it is HIS destiny. (I just do not understand how the writers could have built up these legendary characters like Jon and Danny and then have Arya-Jason Bourne come in and kill the main villain and steal their thunder. There was no payoff. I would be alright with reversing the Azhor Ahai story and Danny killing the Night King and Jon being sacrificed, however, the narrative does not naturally lend itself to that version.)
My theory is that the story is more impactful when characters do not get what they want, but get what they need, based on the original characterization. This makes a more dramatic and memorable end. Jon reluctantly becomes the king of the seven kingdoms, which he never wanted. Despite his heroicness, he is ultimately allotted an unfair life of loneliness and responsibility, much like he was in the whole series. His watch does not end. Danny's entire identity was centered around being a powerful and honorable queen but ultimately relents under her own code of ethics and realizes that the greatest good can only come through her own death.
With this finale, both characters are given equal credence, their choices are consistent with their personalities, and their greatness is not diminished. They actually support each other instead of being pitted against each other, competing for audience attention and plot twists. We also get a classic GOT love story since it ends in tragedy.
I agree. A lot of the harsh stuff that Nate says after Lisa's death is out of bitterness at the affair and not necessarily meant to be taken literally. I don't think she trapped him. She was approaching that age when women want to have kids and she finally decided to keep the baby and raise it herself. She had been in love with Nate for a long time so when he proposed or offered to marry her, Lisa obviously would not have said no.
Breaking up with Billy was the smartest thing Claire did. He had real problems and his mother kept trying to push him on to other women. Brenda had been his crutch and then Claire would have been roped into it too. Billy genuinely needed help but given that Claire was significantly younger and still trying to figure out who she was as a person she did not want to be his nursemaid. At least she was clear and did not string him along.
It was a sad situation for Billy but it was strongly suggested that being with Claire was Billy's way of being closer to Brenda so he was using her too. Billy and his mother were good at playing the sympathy card and being pathetic and clingy just like they did with Brenda who then gave up a large portion of her life for him. Thankfully Claire does not get sucked into their little plan.
While you do acknowledge a lot of Nate's good qualities, calling him a narcissist is unfair to the character who embodies the impending death scenario where everything understandably feels more urgent and intense.
Nate really lives and experinces a lot of life in a the few years that we see him. From the beginning, he's trying to do the right thing by confronting his father issues, staying and joining the family business, trying to reach out to Claire and David, offering to break up the engagement with Brenda when he realizes his health condition, and marrying Lisa and being a good father to Maya.
He does make rash decisions but so do the other characters including Brenda and Lisa. When he survives his first operation, Nate goes into "family" mode and commits to Lisa. When Lisa dies, he returns to Brenda who by then is in "baby mode" so they also enable each-other. I would argue that if he had been in normal health, he would not have rushed. But he did not want to stop experiencing life and spend more time waiting to meet the right person etc. which lead to unhealthy coping measures and an eventually unhappy marriage. I think Nate and Brenda knew they were wrong for each-other but neither of them was good at really addressing their patterns and kept repeating them. Brenda replaces Nate with Joe, and then replaces Joe with Nate, conveniently still living in the same "grown up house" she had gotten with Joe. Nate is tired of grieving and wants a family so goes back an forth between Lisa and Brenda. I think it was a misguided way of staying comfortable in a familiar, albeit neurotic relationship, while they tried to move forward in life.
When Nate finally meets Maggie, he feels a real connection that is missing with Brenda. He is drawn to Maggie immediately and when he does sleep with her, he knows he betrayed Brenda. I don't think he's being narcissistic. He and Brenda knew their marriage was over and were just going through the motions, and trying to figure out if they would get divorced or not. While neither Nate or Maggie are "innocent", Nate does break up with Brenda as soon as he possibly can and tries to make things right again. Of course he could have handled things better but his desperation for his own happiness and fulfillment keep driving him to seize opportunities and act out of impulse. That however does not cheapen his feelings for Maggie. Things are not so black and white. I think thats what this show wonderfully portrays again and again.
It's actually very tragic that Nate dies so quickly after meeting and falling for Maggie. I think Maggie (or someone like her) would have been a better life partner for him than Brenda, Lisa, the Rabbi or all the other women we've seen him with. Maggie and Nate had similar qualities and situations. They both were understated but strong personalities, had complicated relationships with their fathers, and been dealing with grief and life disappointments, and wanted to have a strong faith or practice to hold on to. We see that the two could have been really good friends. Given time, I think they would have gotten together and would have had a real chance.