MovieChat Forums > Obi-Wan Kenobi (2022) Discussion > This show has entered comic book and nov...

This show has entered comic book and novel territory

posted 2 years ago by kuatorises (7467)
28 replies | jump to latest

I am behind, but DO read the comics. Marvel has done a pretty good job for the most part. I enjoy most of them and they are something to satisfy the Star Wars need if I don't feel like re-watching the movies.

But they do pull some stupid shit. Comics always have and this is no exception. In one of the first issues they had Luke and Vader have a confrontation between A New Hope and TESB. It was brief, but we all know they never came face-to-face until Bespin. There's several examples of this in both the marvel comics and many older ones written by Dark Horse (and even Marvel again if you go back far enough). Even Marvel's Vader comics, which have been awesome, have done some stupid shit.

This show has done that.

I actually liked the first two episodes, but the longer Leia is with him the more it enters, "Yeah, that never happened" territory. Obi-Wan was not planet hopping. He did not know there was a resistance movement. Don't even get me started on Obi Wan and Vader fighting. Sorry, but no. Never happened to the guy in A New Hope. That guy disappeared after he fought Vader.

Not sure this show can win me back. And I want it to, I don't want to dislike something from a franchise I have enjoyed my whole life.

[–] janelsenor (2044) 2 years ago

I’m not hating Obi-Wan and Vader meeting as much as I thought, and they’re obviously going to meet again in this series. It really depends on how it wraps up, and if they keep this series "limited" and don't decide to add more seasons.

I think what could really make me forgive this retcon is, in their next meeting, Obi-Wan pwns Vader, shows he truly is “the Master” while addressing Anakin as “Darth”….

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

I thought the end of the 2nd episode when Vader has the revelation (in the bacta tank( Obi-Wan is alive would have been a brilliant way for him to have them find out the other is still alive without retconning A New Hope. But of course they went the cliche route and had them meet. Sequels/expanded universe can't resist that kinda stuff.

[–] janelsenor (2044) 2 years ago

Sequels/expanded universe can't resist that kinda stuff.

Lucas couldn't even resist it with the prequels....

[–] Bubbathegut (18047) 2 years ago

Lucas created SW so he can do whatever he wants. And why are there so many prequel haters?

[–] janelsenor (2044) 2 years ago

I don't hate them. But it's clear Lucas sacrificed good continuity for spectacle/drama.

[–] Bubbathegut (18047) 2 years ago

The OT was the problem. The lack story and slow dialogue didn't help set up the Prequels. And don't forget Obi Wans and Vader's one handed light saber fight. It was just supposed to be one movie but then Lucas just made up 2 more really quickly with no coherent story line.

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

"And why are there so many prequel haters? "

Because they aren't good movies.

[–] FilmBuff (7234) 2 years ago

Because they are utterly awful films, stuffed to the gills with gratuitous CGI, with no narrative thrust, no believable character development or motivations, and the stories make no sense unless you allow for otherwise intelligent characters to act like morons. Were they low-budget indie films churned out by Troma it would be forgivable, but given that they had unlimited budgets and access to the best talent, they have no excuse for being the complete crap they are.

[–] melissah1982 (883) 2 years ago

They way I see it, the only official Star Wars is the OT. Everything else is just glorified fan fiction. Yes, including the Prequels even though they are George Lucas's own work. I just don't like how they have attempted to world build. Everything contradicts something else and it seems nothing connects flawlessly. It seams every time a new show or movie comes out, I whisper to myself: "oh...we're doing this now? ok..." and shrug my shoulders and move on. I either watch it or don't.

There's a lot of things I think about as my head canon; many things others may not agree with. I just prefer to use my own imagination than believe what billion dollar corporations tell me. Others think differently and that is fine. I just don't let it anger me. I would get angry during the prequels...but I was in my 20s and in the thick of it. I've since learned to leave it to the film's fans and just enjoy my movies.

But I agree with you. Whenever you have to go back and shove something into a tight timeline, there's going to be sacrifices. I don't necessarily hate the idea of Obi Wan runing into Vader. Take the prequels away and there's a LOT of things you can do. we are never told how long Obi Wan is on Tatooine based on the original movies. It's the Prequels that solidifies Obi Wan staying there from the end of the film into New Hope. I am more amused at the Leia part because based on both Sith and New Hope, there is NOTHING that shows Leia would have had any interaction with Obi Wan so I agree with you there. In the end, it's all fan fiction and fantasy. Pick what you like, throw out what you hate. I hate Mara Jade and she will never exist in my head canon, lol Though I know others love her.

[–] melissah1982 (883) 2 years ago

Just wanted to add some things. I've read the EU, people don't care if it's not canon now or whatever. But from movies, cartoons, books, there's all kind of nonsense that has flooded Star Wars. I look at the shows as harmless fun now. I mean...we found out that 20 -30 years after the fact Darth Maul survived being cut in half with a light saber. and that Boba Fett escaped the Sarlaac. I call BS on both those...so Leia running into Kenobi is really the least of my Chris Evans 'What the shit!?' moments, lol.

[–] janelsenor (2044) 2 years ago

Well, they're trying to cover the Obi-Wan with Leia thing by having her only know him as "Ben". It's weak, but I'll take it (for now).

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

That doesn't bother me much. She (seemingly) never sees him again after this, no reason to think "Ben" is Obi Wan 10 years later. You barely remember being 10.

[–] janelsenor (2044) 2 years ago

I have multiple continuities in my "head canon". One includes just the original, unaltered OT, Shadows of the Empire, and the OG Thrawn trilogy of books.

Another includes all the current live action stuff, with the updated OT (but I replace ESB with the ESB Revisited fan edit).

[–] melissah1982 (883) 2 years ago

That's exactly how you have to be. When I was younger, it was a complete offense that story events didn't happen the way I expected them to. I still reject Midichlorians with every part of my being. So I completely get how people get upset by it. I have just found myself passed all that. We can dream and imagine any story we want. I am not a fan of the prequels but the best parts of them are the locations. Naboo can completely live rent free in my head anytime, lol.

It's no different than say all the comic book movies. How many integrations of Batman and Superman are there? There isn't only one version and different people are going to like different interpretations. Doesn't mean you have to hate one or accept another. Just whatever Batman or Superman is to you in your own imagination is what matters. Same with Star Wars.

From a production standpoint, YES, I wish the writers/creators were more careful and consistent with their work. But in the end, it's just a show that will be forgotten in a year. No sense in getting upset. There will be another show that eventually comes along and retcons THAT story.

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

Books, comics, and cartoons are not on the live-action level to me. Even when I enjoy them...nope. I don't care that Lucasfilm or Disney tells you that they are canon either - they just do that to keep the uptight people happy.

Interesting. I hate the prequels, but never felt "they aren't canon". I never went the "only the OT counts" route. But I can certainly see why someone would.

[–] FootOfDavros (8142) 2 years ago

Books, comics, and cartoons are not on the live-action level to me.

I agree and that's as someone who's enjoyed the cartoons to some degree.

But I'm now viewing these Disney+ series as live action cartoons, rather live action.

The Mandalorian started off ok but Boba Fett with that cartoony Cad Bane and now this with the Inquisitors feels part of the cartoon universe rather than connected to the films.

Even the way Darth Vader appeared, coming down onto the planet in Episode 3 felt like something straight out of Rebels rather than his arrival on Endor in ROTJ say...

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

And I can respect someone likes them. Nothing wrong with that at all. But I despise when you're talking about a movie and someone says something about a book, comic, cartoon character or plot point. Something about Vader's apprentice he never had, Luke's wife he never had, or whatever. It's annoying as shit.

I think I am starting to as well, though I do think Mando is a good show. Boba Fett was so-so and I've really turned on Obi-Wan after initially liking it.

A lot of people are saying his appearance just fell off.

[–] Martoto (5024) 2 years ago

Totally disagree. There's no impediment to Vader meeting Kenobi here. Or Kenobi going off world.

Kenobi still doesn't know about a resistance/rebellion. He just learns about the network of people helping refugees.

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

Yes, yes there is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKF9g_BKmXU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCNeJmLAsBo

"Network of people helping", HAHAHA! Stop it.

[–] Martoto (5024) 2 years ago

In 1977 the line "When I left you, I was but learner..." was vague but was nominally consistent with Ben's earlier "who was a pupil of mine before he turned to evil.." line.

But since Ep III, and the impression given by Lucas that there was no story between the trilogies, some people have changed that line to "This is the first time we've met since Ep III". And it makes nerds happy to think that nothing can change and no new info can undermine their certainty that there is nothing new or different from what they "know".

But in ROTS, Anakin is no longer anybody's learner. In fact the clone wars show tells us that he is actually a teacher with a pupil of his own. Plus he thinks he's better than all the other Jedi who can't teach him anything. So Ep III "retconned" that line in ANH a long time before the two characters met in this series.

By the way. What is the first video supposed to prove? He just trails off but later he tells Tarkin it was a tremor not felt since he was last in the presence of his old master. So he could be referring to ep 3 of this series. Or some time later in the time line.

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

" some people have changed that line to "This is the first time we've met since Ep III""

No fan did any such thing. The dialogue stood on it's own.

"By the way. What is the first video supposed to prove? He just trails off but later he tells Tarkin it was a tremor not felt since he was last in the presence of his old master. So he could be referring to ep 3 of this series. Or some time later in the time line."

Yes, that's what Lucas was thinking of when he wrote A New Hope. This TV show.

[–] Martoto (5024) 2 years ago

So what? George's thoughts about what he meant in ANH changed after it was released.

[–] kuatorises (7467) 2 years ago

Lucas has nothing to do with this show and the show is the thing with the rectonn.

[–] Martoto (5024) 2 years ago

What has it retconned?

[–] FootOfDavros (8142) 2 years ago

... the impression given by Lucas that there was no story between the trilogies...

😂 But actually otherwise, yes, you are indeed correct - Lucas himself already knackered the continuity of that line in ROTS, where, as you say, Anakin was no learner...

Maybe this show could correct Lucas' blunder. Maybe Vader failed to kill Obi-Wan when he clearly could very easily have done so as he had a change of heart!

Maybe he'll flip back to the good side within this show, requiring Obi-Wan's teachings again to clear his mind of the evil.

Then at the end of this series' run he could flip BACK to the dark side and this would correct the OT line!

[–] Martoto (5024) 2 years ago

Maybe the show will include Kenobi agreeing to teach Anakin how to ride a bike, like he promised to when he was a padawan. Kenobi tries but Anakin as always won't listen to him and he falls off onto some sand making him angrier than before and they are split up again. Then in the post credits scene we see Vader riding around on his bike having finally succeeded. "Yussss. Now I am the master."

[–] FootOfDavros (8142) 2 years ago

😂 👍

[–] christomacin (4655) 2 years ago

Then Anakin marries some crazy, clingy, Japanese performance artist and he and Obi-Wan break up for good this time.