Noob here... did the Holocause actually happen?

Depends who you talk to.

You'll find deniers, revisionists and believers


Deniers will offer these points

http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?t=4971


Look at David Cole's work for revisionism as a good starting point (make up your own mind once you listen to his stuff whether he is telling the truth)


And believers, well there info all over these boards and the web.




No more dead Lannisters
No More dead Trolls

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It never happened, it's just a Jewish mythology. But there are two sides to this.

First Theory of the Holocaust™
>First one can say it did not happen at all, that is it made for the profit of the Jews so they could steal Palestine and make tons of shekels of this hoax. It is merely a modernized version of their story of how the Egyptians enslaved them to build the pyramids, except instead of Egypt it now takes place in Germany, and Ramses is replaced with Hitler, the slavery is forced labor(which was so the Jews could pay off everything they stole from Germany), and the Pyramids are the camps. Now those stories do sound familiar but what really debunks the Holocaust™ is simply the fact that you will goto jail for questioning it. As previously stated if you commit heresy against the Jew you will goto jail. Now why? I thought these European nations were places with free speech. Oh no, hate speech is not free speech says the Jew. Interesting, then why aren't people prosecuted when they insult Muhammad and spread lies about him, that is considered free speech by the Jews, even insult and desecrate Jesus, the Jews call him all kinds of nasty stuff like how he's the son of a prostitute who's dad was a Roman soldier and he's burning in hell in a lake of poop. Why aren't people who spread lies and hate about Islam or Christianity prosecuted but those who Question the Holocaust™ are? Why are the Jews given this special protection? Hmm could it be, perhaps if people start questioning the Holocaust™ we will realize it is false and the Jews will lose their Holocaust™ card? That means all the billions of dollars of the Holocaust™ Industry will be worthless and obsolete? Perhaps it is not that we question the Holocaust™ but it is the fact that by questioning the Holocaust™ we threaten the Jew's money, and that is the greatest blasphemy against Jews

Second Theory of the Holocaust™
>Second one can say the Jews deserved the Holocaust™, it was the right thing to do, it was the only thing to do! The Jews are parasites on this planet and all they do is destroy, did 6 trillion die? Maybe maybe not, maybe it was 1.2 million like the Red Cross says, but it doesn't matter what the number was. The only bad thing is that all of them weren't exterminated. 6 trillion, 7 trillion, 12, 60 whatever the number is it wasn't enough it should have been every single last one of them, to kill a jew is no different than killing an animal, even the best of jews should be killed. Had all of them been exterminated the world would be in peace, no wars for oil, Palestine would be in peace, no Jewish lobbies controlling America, no Jewish bankers on Wall St. etc..

Well, as deniers like to bring up the argument of plausibility – and usually nothing more –, they should stand up to their own "highly critical" standards. The question should be: why in the decades of its existence has the "revisionist" movement not accomplished to make the slightest dent in the world of academia, in the world of scholars who deal with the issue of the Shoah as a profession? Is it

a) because there is an almighty conspiracy that controls all historians, Jewish and non-Jewish alike?

or

b) because deniers are flat out wrong and cannot present a convincing case of an alternative version of history that is in accordance with all the evidence we know?

If you think that a) has the slightest possibility to be true, I urge you to read just the following article:

The "Hoax" – where's the evidence?
http://www.phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/~jamie/the-hoax.shtml

This should show that the theory of a massive conspiracy of forgers, instructors and torturers tacitly implied and suggested by the deniers has not a shred of plausibility at all. Usually they don't go into detail about that conspiracy, and that is for a reason. But denial of the Shoah cannot be possible at all without the existence of such a conspiracy.

If you're still not convinced you can study the websites (see link list below) which specifically deal with the debunking of the most common denier arguments. You will find that usually those arguments are either minor details and irrelevant, or based on cherry-picking of facts and constitute a hypocritical approach concerning evidence, or sometimes flat out lying and distortion of the historical record, as has for example been clearly proven in the Irving trial. You will find as a pattern too that oftentimes the driving force is not the honest, unbiased search for the truth, but certain ideological mindsets instead.

http://www.nizkor.org/
http://www.phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/
http://holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/

People were sent to the camps, many died of disease & starvation, and I'm sure a few were probably shot and killed, but there's no scientific evidence that mass gassings took place.

About 500,000 Jews were transported to Belzec death camp and gassed. Between 700,000 and 900,000 Jews were transported to Treblinka death camp and gassed. About 200,000 Jews were gassed at Sobibor death camp. Another 200,000 Jews were taken to Chelmno death camp and gassed. About 1.1 million people, mostly Jews, were taken to Auschwitz-Birkenau, and about 90% of these were gassed. A further 1.3 million Jews were shot by Einsatzgruppe moving from village to village behind the German front lines. Other Jews were held at multiple camps across the area controlled by German forces and were killed there (eg 60,000 at Majdanek).

For me it's pretty simple. My father was awarded the honor of being the first American GI to liberate a Nazi Death Camp. In this case Buchenwald. He dared anyone to try and tell him it didn't happen. It was the one thing that affected him more than any other single thing. I saw what it did to him and how he talked about it from firsthand knowledge. So for me it's easy. Yes, it happened and was even worse than you can imagine. 6 million Jews and 5.5 non Jews killed and a large portion tortured and/or experimented on. He said the ovens still had body parts smoldering in them, but the worst was the cages. Do some research on the camps. To the deniers, it's a shame you've sold your souls.

A lot of the evidence comes from Soviet Occupied Territory, a country that was massacreing and raping Germans at the time. Also the Nuremburg defendants were tortured into giving statements.