Naked women?!


What was the significance of the gradually more obese dancing women at the beginning?

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I'm not too sure the significance, but I feel like in the context of it being an art show then it was almost a way of questioning and defying what peoples expectations.

It's like if an art gallery decided that instead of putting up some paintings that people would admire and think are beautiful, they put up paintings that don't look amazing and are considered to look awful.

The director, Tom Ford, is a fashion designer. In that industry, models have to be perfect looking and very thin. The complete opposite of the dancing women.

I'm sure there's a better explanation, but this is all I could think of.

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I have to be honest, I wound up covering up my eyes until that went away.

But as the film proper begins, we see morbidly obese women on display at this big... To-do or party or something. I don't know what it was actually. What struck me about it was that nobody was looking at the women.

So, maybe that has something to do with it. How something that others might find disgusting is on open display like that in the middle of a very swanky party and nobody even notices.

Plus it's like SUPER-SIZED in the background of that party. How do you avoid being affected by that if you're one of those people stood there drinking champagne?

And Amy Adams is moving through that room. So maybe the whole thing is some sort of visual metaphor for her life and where she's got herself to. She gradually rose to a place where her life has become grotesque and she didn't notice herself getting there.

I do think about the line she asks one of her... I guess it was one of her staff, the young black woman, she asks her if she ever gets the feeling that her life turned out a completely different way than she wanted it to or something like that. (the girl sort of shakes her head and Amy Adams laughs and points out that of course the girl is just starting her life).

I think that's all tied up together with the images we see at the beginning.

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This is almost exactly how my wife saw the scene unfolding.

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My wife would like ask you ... what do you think happened to Susan's ex-husband at the end of the film? He killed himself in the book world, did he kill himself in the real world?

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Well, another poster has got me thinking about dream angles, so I'm still digesting that. He thinks the scene where she dropped the mobile phone is a dream and I tend to agree.

I haven't read the book. But I also believe that a film should tell the story without needing to refer the viewer to the book so...

It strikes me that the entire thing could be a dream. I saw a film a few years ago and cannot remember the name of it to save my life but it took place in Paris and essentially we see all these things play out on the screen that are never really explained and in the end you can conclude the whole thing is a fantasy a mental patient has.

Not saying this definitely is like that- just that it's a possibility worth keeping in mind.

And with that in mind:

We never see Edward in the 'present'. He is disembodied and exists only in her memories from our perspective. Thus, the way we see their story- their coming together and eventual break-up is all what she remembers. This isn't Edward's perspective at all. This is what she has turned it into in her mind (because we all do this with our memories).

She is in a relationship she is not happy with. She has become her mother. She must look back on Edward with nostalgia in her own mind. But she can never really do this without also remembering him say she was like her mother- with the sad eyes (also a way of saying her outlook on life is sad).

And she must always feel guilty about the abortion. If she looks back with nostalgia, she must also wonder what would have been if she had accepted less in life- materially speaking- but to have had a family with Edward and to have someone in her life who loved her with passion.

In this sense, it would almost be a sweet fantasy of hers to think that Edward one day did write the 'killer novel' and became enough of a success so he could make a grand entrance back into her life and she could ditch the husband she had.

She might also have suspected deep down that her husband was having an affair for quite some time- not just realizing it when she overheard the elevator guy give it away. So, this would also play into that whole 'return of Edward' fantasy angle.

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There are some interesting points here to consider.

One, she cuts her finger when trying to open the proof copy of the novel. Even the use of the word 'proof' here is telling. The story could just as easily have been him sending her a copy of a manuscript that had not yet been accepted for publication. The story itself is a proof perhaps that Edward exists.

The cut causes her to have her man assistant open the package and read the note. Thus, if the assistant is real, then presumably the note is real as well and thus the story and Edward are real.

But this opens up possibilities for us because she has given the staff the weekend off. So, if we use the assistant's presence and interaction as a form of 'proof' that any scene in the house is taking place, we lose this reference point with them all gone.

As I pointed out earlier- when we see Edward, it is actually only in her memories. When they break up, one of the last bits we see is Edward in front of a vintage car- it's the same car that is in the story, I'm reasonably sure of that.

If this is HER memory, what's it doing in HIS story? So you get this part of the story creating a little bit of a loop you can chase around for a while. Maybe her memories are influenced by the story she is reading or maybe these aren't proper memories but dreams and her unconscious mind inserts the car from the story into the dream.

The car wouldn't have been put there if it didn't mean something.

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When she's talking to one of her colleagues- I can't remember whether it's the black woman or the woman with the baby monitor- the other woman says she didn't know that she even had an ex-husband.

Which has implications for the 'daughter' we see her telephone. How old do you figure she is? She's old enough to live with a man. Edward is at least 19 years ago. The girl is aged 18- 24. If she's Edward's daughter, you'd figure this might be known. Yet if the math is correct, she almost certainly can't be her current man's daughter because she would have had to get pregnant almost immediately after having the abortion to have a daughter old enough to be living with a guy somewhere.

Therefore, the daughter is probably imaginary or that scene is a dream.

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So, in the end, I don't know what happens with 'Edward'. We never see him. We know for a fact she's going through some serious issues of guilt towards her past and regret about her present and also financial bankruptcy is seemingly looming.

The whole notion of Edward could be an escape on her part.

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19- 20 years seems like a long time to carry a grudge against an ex. I've been married twice and rarely think about the first one in terms of going back and 'showing her' or getting even for some argument we had or how we ended up.

Edward is an attractive, artistic guy. Like he's not going to have girlfriends in his life who make him forget all about Amy? Hmmm...

At the end, I don't know. I don't think there's any objective way- from inside the film- to ensure that the whole restaurant scene isn't part of something going on inside her head.

Maybe, when the penny finally drops that her husband is screwing around on her, she gets lost in this story and imagines meeting Edward just like she did long ago in the restaurant. But it never happens because she can't escape what she's made of her life at this point and maybe it can't happen because he isn't real.

I'd have to see it again to do better. There are conversations at the party that are important and I can't recall them. Images that need to be examined. A re-watch is a must to sort this one out.

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I think he gained some level of revenge for the way she left him. That, as soon as she contacted him to arrange the dinner, he knew she had read and liked the book. That, in her eyes, he was now successful and she wanted that... so he stood her up as a measure of revenge.

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Tom Ford said that they're supposed to represent freedom. Here are these women gleefully flouting the norms and conventions of society, totally free, juxtaposed to Amy Adam's character who consciously restrains herself to society's rules.

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wow.

(i'm not being sarcastic, btw.)

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Interesting to get the director's take on it, thanks for that.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAIJ3Rh5Qxs

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