I made it all the way to 10 minutes into episode 5 before finally giving up. It's happened on every episode so far: I try to enjoy it, get distracted, try to re-watch, get bored again. I can't tell you how many times I've said to myself "now who's this guy again?" or tried to figure out who is connected to whom. I've lost track of the story line (beyond the Katia arc) so many times I've decided that it's just not worth the effort.
shareSorry to hear you feel that way. At least you gave it a shot, which is more than I can say for some.
shareI made it all the way to 10 minutes into episode 5 before finally giving up. It's happened on every episode so far
Sorry to hear you feel that way. At least you gave it a shot, which is more than I can say for some.
A lot of folks bailed in the middle of the pilot. Those folks didn't give it a shot. Getting halfway through a season is.
BTW - if you couldn't tell I am a really big fan of this show. One of about five apparently.
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The concept is cool. Sadly in this case it's all in the delivery. I think in different hands this certainly could have been a compelling show. The producers of this show have shot high to establish a style.... the problem is the substance is muddled.
Verna Suds and the producing team of 'The Killing' learned a very hard lesson regarding this. They were cancelled and renewed with the promise of a tighter 3rd season. In my eyes they delivered to expectations. Unfortunately they lost way too many viewers over the course of seasons 1 & 2. The net result? Permanent cancellation. Unfortunately I don't think LWS will have that same opportunity to redeem themselves.
To be fair, I don't think Mundy wanted a "tight" show. He wanted it to be expansive. Perhaps it is too much for most people, which could be one reason (among many offered here and elsewhere) for its current state of viewership. But I went back and read some interviews he did before the series really ever started filming (they'd only shot the pilot) and he was aiming for sort of a big operatic canvas spread over many seasons that covered all sorts of topics related to Detroit. It wasn't ever gonna just be about two cops trying to get away with murder.
shareI think you are right... and probably every showrunner wants that. The problem is they have to get the bird off the ground and have it take flight. LOST started with a simple pitch... a plane crash, an island, survivors.... something in the jungle. BAM it was a hit. I didn't see the orginal UK LWS but I imagine it was more about the case and less about the city. Many regard The Wire as a modern masterpiece but few remember that David Simon had cut his teeth on Homocide:Life On The Streets and HBO's The Corner. In total he's spent nearly a decade writing about Baltimore's despair. It's maybe one of the reasons why LWS comes off a little forced and disingenuine. Chris Mundy was involved with CBS's Cold Case and Criminal Minds. Cold Case was perhaps the worst police proceedural of the last decade and CM is a pretty boring network affair as well. They both scream 'edge' as effective as a paper knife. And 'Hell On Wheels' he was involved with as well... which is funny. LWS seems to follow a similar pattern of characters all following different paths which sometimes converge... but take forever to freaking get there. I can admire a show like that. I just can't tune in every week to watch the ice melt.
I believe this was Veerna Suds downfall as well. Having written for network TV she just couldn't shake off some conventions. She tried to make the show more than just the mystery of the case and it failed. Ambitious in concept but it failed on delivery. BB's secret is that it has maintained a small cast and plot developments are very 'cause and effect'. Mad Men has maintained a larger cast but have kept it central involving the office. BB's Vince Gilligan worked on the X-files... a quirky show. Matt Wiener worked on seasons 4-6 of The Sopranos. It's easy to see how some of these showrunners had the experience to bravely write outside the box.
To be fair both BB and Mad Men weren't universally accepted when they came out. But they did have alot more critical praise than LWS. I enjoyed the pilot and episode 2 of LWS. It's the episodes that came after that started losing my attention.
I don't know if it's necessarily a lack of critical acceptance (I've read a lot of good critic reviews, and very few unfavorable ones). And I think, in general, the majority of people who have watched LWS from the start...seem to be pretty into it. For example, it still has a 7.3 rating on this board.
The folks who don't like it are a vocal minority who, for whatever reason, like to come here and explain (for days) why the show is bad, as if that is some kind of a fact instead of just an opinion. My theory is...it's much more fun for some people to pan something than to simply like it.
LWS simply....has not found much of an audience. This has happened to many a high-quality show in the past, unfortunately. And it often times has little to do with actual quality. I've always considered this a niche show anyway--a risk the producers took, which may or may not pay off. But either way...I appreciate the risk, and hope producers continue to take these kinds of chances...rather than something homogenized and formulaic which will please the impatient masses who are used to quick, easy-to-follow story arcs....good guys & bad guys who are written in black-and-white absolutes...and things being resolved at the end of a 40-minute episode.
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And the earth is flat right?
LWS has a Metascore of 59... and episode reviews since then haven't been promising since then. The AV Club scored Catacombs a D-. Metascore is the combined average of reviews from TV critics across the country. When BB premiered it earned a 74 out of 100. The second season scored 85/100, the third season scored 89/100 the fourth season scored 96/100, and the fifth season so far has been rated at 99/100. There's always room for improvement... for a show to turn things around. But if the show is lacking in critical buzz and it's losing viewers it's headed in the wrong direction. Now you might not pay attention to critical reviews but the executives at AMC do. And the fact that this show hasn't found an audience (and has been losing one steadily) is correlative to it's audience reception.
You can't say a few vocal minority are finding displeasure with the show when it loses 1.5 million viewers across 5 episodes? Just b/c 1600 people voted an average of 7.3 on IMDB is not proof that the show is well received. 63,000 people gave Criminal Minds an 8.0... possibly one of the most boring, conventional police procedurals of the past decade. And 1600 is a pebble compared to the more than 270,000 votes that BB has received. Not trying to compare the difference between a popular show 5 seasons in and a show just starting out. But remember LWS had 2.5 million viewers on it's premiere.... last Sunday it had 1.06 million viewers. Breaking Bad averaged only 1.2 million viewers it's first season.
Saying that the show is well received and just trying to find an audience while it's lacking good critical reviews and losing viewers at a clip is like saying the moon is made of cheese.
AV Club seemed to have knives out for LWS before it aired. Kinda like half the blogosphere. Even a lot of the criticisms I've found from people are holding the advertising that AMC has done for LWS against it ("Why are they showing so many ads for it during my show?! I am not gonna watch it because they're selling it too hard!"). I'm not much of a TV watcher, but I have sometimes read ratings stuff in the past (I closely follow the film biz, so it can bleed through) -- and I don't think Hell on Wheels did well in ratings OR with critics at first. Given the period element of the show, you'd think it'd be expensive. Now it's doing much better with both.
That said, I don't doubt a lot of people are disappointed in LWS, I would not argue that.
I know the ratings are poor, but AMC used to be willing to let that ride. I still think they do to a degree, but they aren't as patient now that they've had some successes.
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Agreed... the AV Club can be pretty cliquey with it's shows, but I tend to read a few reviews the morning after to see if my thoughts matched with others. I'm a film buff too. Before The Sopranos you wouldn't have caught watching more than an hour of TV a night. These days I'll average 10-15 hours a week depending on my DVR schedule. BB, Mad Men, Boardwalk Empire, Game of Thrones, Homeland, Justified, The Americans, The Bridge, Ray Donovan.... hell I'll watch True Blood just for the T&A.
Hell on Wheels had mixed to average reviews (metascore 63) but they have had solid viewership the entire run. It Premiered to 4.4 million viewers and was the second highest rated program after The Walking Dead. I don't know where it stands now (I don't watch it) since they moved it to Saturday nights, but ratings have never been a problem for HOW.
AMC has a real problem now competitively and that's what some of the fans of this show don't understand. BB is ending.... Mad Men ends next year. The Killing was just cancelled. LWS is underperforming. The only show that brings in network ratings is The Walking Dead. 2-3 years ago AMC looked like a hotbed of creative programming.... but now they have some big holes in their schedule. AMC, HBO, FX, Showtime are all competing for eyeballs. They will be less patient to nurture a show along if they don't see the potential going forward. They just proved that with The Killing.
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Oh, I know AMC has a problem that BB and MM are ending. They've gotten spoiled the last few years (or rather their stock holders have). LWS needed to come out in 2010, it might have had a chance to be kept around! Once you taste success it's harder to be patient.
I really didn't know HOW had had that many viewers initially. For some reason I thought it struggled to find an audience, guess not!
LWS needed to come out in 2010, it might have had a chance to be kept around!
I meant more from the standpoint in that AMC was more likely to be patient back then.
shareI'm with you on that. I've stuck around this long but don't know how much further. Usually by 5 episodes, I know if I like a show or not. The Wire started off a little slow but the acting was far superior and you connected to some of the characters right away.
I honestly have no idea what is going on. I have a little idea and the main premise of the 2 cops killed another dirty cop so one of them could save his ass from IA. But everything after is kind of meh. And the side story of the drug dealers is extremely dull. I'm sure it will connect back to the cops later but as of now, boring.
The acting and directing is not very good so far.
yep. after five episodes i'm done. so freaking boring. its a bummer when they make shows you want to like but they turn out to be like this.
shareHow does watching the first ten minutes of five episodes constitute giving it "a shot"? If you don't like it, you don't like it. Move on to another show. But, please, spare me the reviews of the first ten minutes.
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Read it again. The person stated watching 10 minutes into episode 5. I believe he/she watched episodes 1 through 4 in their entirety.
The dark, dreary can work if you care about the characters but I just do not in this show. Real shame as I feel the actors are doing a good job with what they have.
shareRead it again. The person stated watching 10 minutes into episode 5. I believe he/she watched episodes 1 through 4 in their entirety.
I made it all the way to 10 minutes into episode 5 before finally giving up. It's happened on every episode so far: I try to enjoy it, get distracted, try to re-watch, get bored again.
There's something about Mark Strong that is incredibly uninteresting. He looks boring, his acting's really stiff and one-dimensional, and I just can't make myself give a damn about what happens to his character. And the show tries so hard to be "intense" all the time that it just fails. It's got no soul to it, and everything seems forced.
I think it's mostly the casting, though. This same type of storyline worked great on The Shield, but The Shield was more street-level, and even though they're both bald white guys, Michael Chiklis has more personality and keeps you interested in his plight, even when he's doing bad things. Low Winter Sun just isn't working.
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zwolf...interesting take.
I have a different opinion on Mark Strong's character (Frank) vs. Michael Chiklis' character in The Shield. I really felt Mackey was a fun character to watch, but he never felt like a real person. Rather, he was written as an over-the-top caricature. The true anti-hero...the villian we love to hate, and love to root for. But things aren't always that black & white.
With Frank, he seems to me much more like a real guy....conflicted, stoic, and frankly...stressed out to the max. I KNOW guys exactly like FRank. That's why he rings so true to me. That authenticity isn't always as exciting or fun to watch on-screen as someone more cartoonish and unrealistic.....but the authenticity does serve the story and makes it feel more real. I think he's a remarkable actor with a very compelling screen presence. As said before...he can say more with just a look in his eyes than David Caruso can say with a paragraph of dialogue. Just my opinion. There's just something about Mark Strong's inflection, delivery, even the way he carries himself...that doesn't come across like an actor reading a script. He seems like a real guy in that situation.
Plus, Frank is just a cool dude. He knows how to walk the walk on the streets. The way he rolled-up on the gangster and his thugs and kept them in their place, with no back-up, and had their respect. The way he put his co-worker (Joe) in his place: "When you start signing my checks, I'll tell you where I've been". Great stuff.
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The pacing isn't for everyone, it's closer to something like The Wire in that respect (though at this point The Wire is certainly better even if both are good shows).
shareIf its pacing is similar to The Wire's then Low Winter Sun's failure must have come from the delivery because I watched all of the seasons of The Wire in one single marathon in less than a week.
shareI've managed to watch 3 episodes so far, haven't totally given up though I'm unsure whether I'll ever make it to the end, but for once, FOR ONCE, I could already predict a show's canceling. Had the potential to be really interesting with Detroit as a setting and Mark Strong as the lead. Sadly, "boring as snot" pretty much sounds about right to me.
shareCliclou....I hope you see it through to its conclusion. It gets better and better...and the finale is amazing. Mark Strong's acting, in particular, is jaw-dropping.
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