MovieChat Forums > Black Mirror (2011) Discussion > Brooker's women [SPOILERS if you haven't...

Brooker's women [SPOILERS if you haven't seen all the episodes, S. 1-3]

posted 9 years ago by bartgirls
30 replies | jump to latest

I liked the stories and everything related to narrative, camera work, acting, and so on... but I am impressed at the way women are portrayed in each and every episode.

Just in National Anthem, the wife of the PM disses him after the enormous sacrifice he did to save the princess and his career. She even told him before the zoophilia act that in people's minds, he already did it. She treated him like crap.

15,000,000 Merits puts Abi as a woman willing to prostitute herself in order to get out of bicycling for points. She never saw the guy who gifted her the golden ticket again, and her self esteem ended up in shambles (like other girls in the show). A good single guy with a steady job (Waldo) gets rejected by a woman trying to keep her job and win an election she already knows it's a lost cause.

In the rest of episodes, women cheat and lie to men and they don't give a rat's behind about men's emotions. The beautiful Jodi Whittaker's character denies she had a long term relationship with the guy from Downton Abbey until she's forced to show the tapes to her husband. They get pregnant from other men and they lie to their husbands. Even in White Bear, the main character, although she spends 100% of the time in distress and screaming like in an Eli Roth movie, she technically is a child's murderer being punished.

White Christmas has men being punished by what women did to them: these men are in limbo, ghosted, blocked from life and interaction with humans.

So my question to Charles Brooker is: What did that girl do to you? I can relate to the Jodi Whittaker episode, because I've been there and I also asked her if she used a condom or not.

I can see who Brooker relates to in the series: all men victimized by women after being played on, just like technology does to us on a daily basis. I know the feeling, but we need to move on.

[–] spuzer55 9 years ago

This. Did you also notice how similar the two scenarios were in The Entire History of You and White Christmas? Both women become pregnant after being unfaithful while in steady relationships. The men both have their lives ruined and become violent because of it. It's Brooker's go-to male horror scenario.

I will vehemently disagree with anyone who says that the "social blocking" technology used in White Christmas is 'profound'. If you actually take the time to think about it you'll see that while the show wants you to think that, its actually a very silly and stupid idea. Added to this is the fact that no sane woman or person would ever be so spiteful as to block their ex partner 'forever' based on an emotional whim without even a second thought. Add to this some plot inconsistencies like 'if block was applied to offspring, why couldn't he figure out that it wasn't his kid since she'd need court order to do that? or are all children automatically the right of their mothers for some reason in this universe?' and you have your classic recipe of Brooker's incomplete and irrational manipulation.

[–] SenaShetani 9 years ago

I could see some women pulling this if it were available. A lot of women will do anything to avoid ah uncomfortable situation with a man. I know women who try and keep the father out of the child's life out of spite and so on. It's not unrealistic.

[–] spuzer55 9 years ago

Really. Out of spite? What exactly did he do to her again? Tell her to keep the baby? Sure, that sounds reasonable and realistic.

Also social blocking would never become available to anyone, ever. It's pointless, ineffective, and literally does nothing but annoy the other person. You could still stalk them, you could still cause them harm. So what is the point of it exactly? It's silly.

[–] SenaShetani 9 years ago

Women are very emotional and not as logical as men. Many would rather avoid the issue wholly than face it head on

[–] shauna-mark 9 years ago

I thought the husband in the third episode was a spineless annoying wimp; I was quite pleased when it turned out that after he'd left his beautiful young wife in a jealous fit she took it upon herself to bed her ex.

That's called "what goes around comes around"...

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

No, that's called acting like a cheating scumbag that only someone with severe issues with men would ever say.

[–] ejs8882000 8 years ago

You are a dumbass and going on nothing but misogynistic stereotypes that are NOT true at all. Women are NOT more emotional than men and men are NOT more logical than women. That is just something very sexist men continue to uphold in this society where people still hate women. Women are just as logical and intelligent as men. Stop treating us as though we are all the same. As though we are all monolithic creatures who all think and act the same. We are individual human beings just like men.

I also just find it ridiculous that you would even write that on here knowing that women read these boards too. Are you trying to be offensive and oppressive on purpose or do you just not care about our feelings. Probably the latter since people like you don't even see us as people.

[–] Movie_Guy79 9 years ago

I could see some women pulling this if it were available. A lot of women will do anything to avoid ah uncomfortable situation with a man. I know women who try and keep the father out of the child's life out of spite and so on. It's not unrealistic.

It is unrealistic if the father removes his grain, or hacks it to avoid the block.

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

no sane woman or person would ever be so spiteful as to block their ex partner 'forever' based on an emotional whim without even a second thought.

You clearly don't deal with many women.

or are all children automatically the right of their mothers for some reason in this universe?'

That's how it is in this universe.

[–] chrismise 9 years ago

Remember thay in The Entire Story of you the guy is over jealous and left her thats why she date her ex.

On White Christmas the guy is unstable as well. We didnt get the whole story but by his reactions we was not a saint

[–] sgtgory 9 years ago

First off, it was in one of the other threads, if not just for being an amazing show, the discussions it brings forth are very insightful.

shauna-mark, "spineless annoying wimp" ?? hrmmmm
Plus I'm not sure you fully understand the phrase, "what goes around comes around"
She was even cheating on him the night before he got back from his business meeting.

They jus had an argument about the other guy who may have been into her.

White Christmas:
I don't know the full story behind blocking someone, but I would say, that if a parent blocks a person and that is automatically passed on to the child, it would be the "primary care giver" that the blocks originate. So yes, the father would be blocked.
Also, he approached her in the street and she got a restraining order against him. She could have said, "Judge, if this guy finds out he aint the baby daddy, he'll kill us."

But yeah the blocking is a bit strange, with it being all psychological. Nothing stopping a murder-suicide. That guy at the end has a 'lets lynch the guy on the Register' look about him.

[–] shauna-mark 9 years ago

Where do you get the "cheating on him the night before he got back from his business meeting" ? Where's the evidence for that suggestion ? If you mean talking to her ex at the dinner party that's not a crime.

"What goes around comes around" is pretty simple to me - actions have consequences - walk out on your wife and just maybe she'll take her destiny into her own hands, rather than sit alone at home sobbing and hoping you'll come back ... Whether or not my definition of the expression aligns with yours, the point is pretty obvious.

[–] sgtgory 9 years ago

When they are at the dinner party, towards the end of the meal, they put on some footage of the night before, thas when he see's her smooching with Jonas in the background... "Thas not Marrakesh is it?"

I'm not sure that I'm following you, is the "goes around" him being paranoid enough to discover his wife is frequently cheating and he may be raising another man's child? And the "comes around" is him being so distraught by the emotionally driven on-demand video footage that he cuts out a brain implant over the sink?

[–] shauna-mark 9 years ago

That's old footage of before she knew him, partying back in the day with what they called "the old gang" of which Jonas was a part. If you're inclined to watch it again you'll see that. That became proof that she had a longer relationship with him previously, but not that she was cheating with him at the time.

The "goes around" is that he walked out on her and the immediate consequence was that she ended up in bed with her ex, with the ultimate consequence that he was alone and clearly miserable. There's actually no evidence at all that she was a serial cheat. What did happen was the ability of the grain to play and replay and pick-up and emphasise small things made a bunch of minor things appear a "cohesive case" of major attraction to Jonas which was then interpreted by the audience as her being a serial cheat. It was quite clever because that's what could very easily happen in real-life.

[–] sgtgory 9 years ago

I did watch it again before I last replied, but jus to make sure I got the subtitles;
"OK, I was gonna play some redos from the Fraser 0 days..
"Yay!"
"Stuff from LAST NIGHT, depressing and fun."

Thas when he later replays it too her and says, "Is that Marrakesh?"

[–] shauna-mark 9 years ago

I think you'll find that was THE last night - referring to the last night of the pub some years ago ... if it's footage of the previous evening the episode is finished; there's no need for anything at all that follows it ...

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

Look at how dedicated she is to defend the cheating whore. You are talking to what I pray is a troll.

[–] shauna-mark 9 years ago

Couple of things:

1. I'm actually a middle-aged, pretty well-balanced (in my opinion at least) guy.
2. You've got yourself awfully worked-up over a 5 years old piece of TV fiction ...

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

That sort of backwards logic and straight up misinterpretation of reality could only come from a woman.

And yes, you call Love actually a sexist assault on women. One day you will grow out of your bitter hatred of men and remove that chip off your shoulder. On that day you will finally have people that desire to associate with you.

[–] hannafran 9 years ago

What about Martha? I thought she was reasonably sympathetic...

Other than that I can see where you're coming from

[–] froghawk 9 years ago

'15,000,000 Merits puts Abi as a woman willing to prostitute herself in order to get out of bicycling for points.'

Abi didn't want to do that, she only agreed because they made her drink 'Cuppliance', which I'm assuming made her more open to suggestions. Abi is in no way an evil character here - what the society did to her was evil. The only woman who was truly portrayed negatively in that episode was the purple haired European girl who wanted to be a singer.

I think Martha was very sympathetic, and it seemed to me that Liam was the real villain in Last Night - an awful person who deserved to end up alone.

[–] bartgirls 9 years ago

"Cuppliance" was obviously the "Kool Aid" all of them had to drink, that's why the guy didn't drink it and fake he did. Liam was a moron and a loser, and his wife was already getting off other men because of him being a total wimp.

But it seems to me that the whole series, besides being a criticism to information technology as we know it now, is a jab on women's attitude towards men, being the later awful or not.

[–] froghawk 9 years ago

Maybe true. All I can say is, if Brooker wants us to sympathize with the leading men in Entire History (which I know he didn't write, but it's consistent with the others), Waldo Moment, and White Christmas, he definitely has some issues he needs to work through. I found them all deplorable.

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

And yet to a normal person the men acted entirely just and the women were terrible individuals. Only an invalid or cheater supporter would say otherwise and if you are the latter than you are an awful person.

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

Kind of ironic you justify a cheating whores behaviour because the man is "a total wimp" while in the same post deride BMs portrayal of women as negative.

[–] Starwarsfan777 9 years ago

I think it's refreshing for once to see women portrayed realistically on TV instead of perfect angels that can do no wrong.

On everything else the woman is a superior being and the man is to blame for all problems in the universe.

[–] dignanwilson1014 9 years ago

Exactly.

[–] mboj 9 years ago

You're forgetting that Charlie's wife helped write a lot of the episodes.

[–] Pumpyjones 8 years ago

The main issue is that most of the protagonists are men and the women are seen through their eyes. So, even if the men are also douchebags they are seen as the ones being victimized, because the protagonist is the one you're subconsciously programmed to sympathize with the most.

The only time you don't sympathize with the protagonist is in White Bear, when we're given a bait and switch and we find out she's a child killer-adjacent (and incidentally, she is the one who is punished, while the actual killer - a man - is allowed to kill himself and escape the torture).

So -- maybe they need to write more stories with women protagonists who are not baby killers and then we'll sympathize with them more? Martha in 'Be Right Back' is the only other female protagonist I can think of offhand and she's very sympathetic. I'm guessing if we saw some of the other stores from the female characters' POVs, we might not think of them as being as awful.

That said - the pattern of bad women characters is noticeable enough to prompt several threads, so they've got to even things out unless they want to be known as *that show*.

[–] ejs8882000 8 years ago

You seem to be quite misogynistic yourself if you actually like the portrayal of the women on here being nothing but the worst of stereotypes that treat us like crap.