MovieChat Forums > Inside Llewyn Davis (2014) Discussion > Some explanations I haven't seen here...

Some explanations I haven't seen here...


I'm posting this because as far as I can see, none of the threads touch on the things I've seen in the film.

First, regarding the beginning and ending of the film. There's a thread here about the differences between the two scenes, and I was surprised that no mention was made of the fact that the songs Llewyn sings are different in each scene, so it can't be a flashback. There is, in other words, a significant difference between the two scenes. Why does the film begin and end the same way? Jean tells him, "You don't wanna go anywhere, and that's why all the same *beep* is going to keep happening to you. Because you want it to."

The songs are also a clue to film's meaning. For example, "The Death of Queen Jane" is about a dangerous pregnancy, with Queen Jane asking to be cut open so that the baby will be saved. In the end, she dies giving birth to it. This is not a direct parallel to the plot of the film, but it must be poignant for Llewyn who has just learned that an abortion he paid for two years ago was never undertaken and that he is in all likelihood a father. (It occurs to me now as I write this that this may be another example of an eternal recurrence. In two years he could be trying to pay for another abortion, learning that the previous one again was not undertaken.)

One thing that connects all the songs that are sung in full in the film is the word "farewell":

Although "Hang Me" doesn't feature the word, the singer is singing about his death, saying that he wouldn't mind it.

"Dink's Song" (which Llewyn had sung with Mike) is also called "Fare Thee Well".

"The Last Thing On My Mind" is about going away. "Are you going away with no word of farewell? Will there be not a trace left behind?"

"Five Hundred Miles" -- another song about leaving.

And when Dylan appears, he sings "Farewell".

The last word of the film? "Au revoir." (This could be significant, because it means "Till we see each other again" -- a recognition of the film's looping structure.)

And this leads me to the last point. We know throughout the film that Llewyn's partner Mike killed himself, although we never learn why. When he auditions for Bud Grossman, Llewyn says, "I had a partner." And Grossman says, "My suggestion? Get back together." Grossman doesn't know Mike, so he doesn't realise what he's saying. But Llewyn says, "That's good advice. Thank you Mr. Grossman." I think the very least we can gather from this is that Llewyn is considering joining Mike and killing himself.

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I think he was already dead and trapped in some sort of purgatorial state.

“Democracy is a pathetic belief in the collective wisdom of individual ignorance."

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This possibility is actually not that different from what I propose.

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Some excellent analysis, mate.

Did you also know that the Gate of Horn is from ancient mythology/mysteries? It is the gate through which true dreams pass to humanity (the Gate of Ivory is for lies). So Llewyn set out on a quest, basically, to hear an oracle. Sadly, when he hears it, he cannot stomach the choices that would be needed to follow it, even though he KNOWS "that's good advice."

And on his way home, he sees the animal limping off into the woods in the cold. I wonder if he reflected on himself then, and what loss fate had sent screeching into his own life?

The nautical aspect is also interesting to me. He's a sailor, maybe searching for the shores of Heaven. If we take these shores to mean happiness, I find it tragic that he'll be literally sailing away from them by the end of the movie. If we take them to mean sweet death and rest, then he'll be sailing to them after all, sooner than he'd intended maybe.

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and dont forget the cat is named Ulysses

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featheredsun

Thank you for this. I came here specifically looking for something like this that would jive with my own thoughts on this film, a bit of confirmation bias for myself, and here it is.

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These are all great theories and ideas, I love them! I think what the Coen's did great here was walk the fine line of ambiguity. They gave us just enough to allow us to make our own conclusions. I never thought of a lot of what others have proposed on here, but reading them has made me appreciate the film even more.

All the evidence people give makes sense enough for me to not really be able to dispute it. I'm just not sure how deep they wanted us to read here because I've seen explanations all over the place and that vary, but damn they're some good ones!

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I agree with you. I started to read some analysis here about the cat, and gave up on it. Sometimes, and I believe the cat is an example of this, things in a film have no thematic or symbolic significance, but are dramatic tools. I believe the theories about the cat are ridiculous. The scenes with it simply generate suspense, and reveal things about Llewyn's character, and his desire to be responsible and do the right thing.

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I've seen some ridiculous theories on here and some not so much. I don't think paralleling the cat to Llewyn is so far fetched, in fact, it's hardly even subtle. I think the insinuation is quite apparent. That said, anymore extrapolation from that is purely conjecture.

But it's great to see people reading into it at all when I feel like it gets written off so easily by so many more.

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At the end, when the Grossmanns' cat turns up, we learn its name is Ulysses [aka Odysseus], and there is a sense that Llewyn has a moment of recognition. This tallies with much that is written above. The Gates of Horn is also from the Odyssey. This won't come as news to long-time Coen fans, but "Brother, where art thou?" (with the song "I am/ a man / of constant sorrow") is a loose, light reworking of the Odyssey too.

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Sometimes, and I believe the cat is an example of this, things in a film have no thematic or symbolic significance, but are dramatic tools.

For real? You think the cat has no symbolic significance whatsoever? No disrespect, but that strikes me as beyond ridiculous. I mean, they practically hit you over the head with that "Llewyn IS the cat" line.

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There are some interesting thoughts there, I do think the music in the film would have been chosen for certain reasons and to convey something.

I do disagree though about the beginning and the ending. From what I remember it is pretty clearly the same scene. Although we don't see Llewyn play 'Dink's song' at the beginning, there is a delay between him finishing 'Hang me oh Hang me' and then him being off stage. Likewise at the end he has been on stage for a while when he plays 'Dink's song' and it seems pretty clear that he has just finished 'Hang me oh Hang me'.
He is also wearing the same clothes in both scenes and the fight outside is more or less identical.


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Sigh. The differences in the events at the beginning that are shown again at the end are stylistic. Filmmakers wanting to show and scene and then revisit again are stuck with limited options. They can replay that part or refilm it. Coens refilmed it and let the differences remain. The vocals were live, so it was never going to be the same. And allowing for differences for stylistic reasons is hard new.

Too, you see two small clips of him singing out of what would be a whole set. It's hardly enough to build a big theory on the back of.

The vanilla reading of this film - showing an event and then rewinding to a point before it to show the lead up to it (which isn't apparent on the first watch until the end) - showing Llewyn's existential struggles at a time of change in the culture are enough to sustain the film. It doesn't help when people feel the need to jump on every stylistic element to find a (gasp) deeper meaning. It's great as it is.

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You make some interesting observations on the songs. I wrote about some of this a while back, but you've added other things about the songs that are interesting. (love the music too BTW).

The movie is like a song/album and is meant to play over and over like a chorus, as in the structure of the film and Llewyn repeating patterns.

I won't repeat everything I previously wrote, but all the leaving clues/songs refers to his journey (to the gate of horn...greener pastures) and "odyssey" as others have mentioned those references and eventual return home to find himself (the poster of "Homeward Bound" shows us this). I feel he finds his true self on his journey and accepts his place and comes to terms with all his problems. Dylan is about the hit the scene and raise the tide for other folk musicians.

I think another overall theme of the film is how we romanticize different periods (midnight in paris), but the realities at the time/place may have felt much different. Decades/centuries later they may be thought of as :golden ages", because of what came out of them, but like many artists, their work is not valued during their lives, and is only later appreciated (financially as well) well after they are dead.

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