MovieChat Forums > Person of Interest (2011) Discussion > Shaw killing the Conan-lookalike Samarit...

Shaw killing the Conan-lookalike Samaritan agent bothered me.


I don't know, they took this guy that was down on his luck, that served a lot of time for a non-violent offense, showed him doing menial work, not getting a second chance with his girlfriend. I could see why he would start doing odd jobs for Samaritan. I would have. He didn't just blindly do what he was told, and even tried to get out but was brought back in by his boss. Now he ultimately ended up killing Root.

I just think he should have gotten a redemption arc, and I think Shaw should have let him live. It was over. Samaritan was done. It think it really would have shown character development if she would have let him live even after killing Root. It just showed she was still a stone cold killer.

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I agree with you but I would have wanted retribution also, regardless of his circumstances. Shaw being Shaw probably didn't give a moment to wonder how he ended up doing what he did. She wasn't there when his number came up, once the machine came back online but had some glitches, so she didn't get his background info.

I have to say I hated that this bit player, a person with no real history with the show, killed Root. Although, I was not okay with any of them dying.

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Shaw did give a moment of thought to it.

She paused and talked with him. She even comments that in the past (before the machine) she would have already killed him, or if her friends were alive they wouldn't want him dead.

She recognizes the changes they were making in her life. She just can't live with him being alive while they are dead and falls back on her old ways without them around.

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That's the point. Shaw changed, but not completely. At her core she was still an unemotional killer.

He eventually blindly did what he was told, including killing people. You know who else followed orders? The Nazis.

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I had no problem with Shaw killing this guy. She has definitely changed as a person through the show, but that POS deserved it, being the good little order follower that he was.

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I disagree. It shows the progression of her character. She killed him for revenge, because he killed the person she loved. Old shaw would have never done that

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Her conversation with him explained all of this.

Before the machine if she was under orders she would have killed him without a thought. Instead she actually confronts him and thinks about it.

In the end she kills him for revenge, for her that is more emotion that she would typically have over a death.

She regrets the situation she is in and she feels strong enough to need to act on it. That's not the old emotionless Shaw. That's the new emotional Shaw acting out in a world without guidance.

Maybe that's not redemption, but for someone who was essentially a sociopath, that's a huge change. It means that what she really needed in life was guidance.

And in the end, if the machine survived just enough to rebuild itself and call her, maybe she will get it after all.

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I don't know, they took this guy that was down on his luck, that served a lot of time for a non-violent offense, showed him doing menial work, not getting a second chance with his girlfriend. I could see why he would start doing odd jobs for Samaritan. I would have. He didn't just blindly do what he was told, and even tried to get out but was brought back in by his boss. Now he ultimately ended up killing Root.

I just think he should have gotten a redemption arc, and I think Shaw should have let him live. It was over. Samaritan was done. It think it really would have shown character development if she would have let him live even after killing Root. It just showed she was still a stone cold killer.


Remorse comes before redemption...he had none.

He wasn't sorry.

He didn't say he was sorry to Shaw for what he had done--didn't make any excuses--didn't say he had no choice.

What did he say; something on the order of "It was just a job...."

AND, then he tried to "play" Shaw by saying what her murdered friends would want.

Even without Samaritan, if Shaw had let him go, did he really seem like the kind of guy that would have gone back to a life of fence-painting to you!?


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I'm not saying he was redeemed, I'm saying I wanted him to be. He had a rough go at it. I don't think he was inherently a bad guy, i think Samaritan made him that way. You could clearly see a downward progression.

Who got redeemed from Samaritan side? No one. I would have liked to seen some shades of gray there, and think this was a missed opportunity. And I would have liked to see some more change from Shaw than giving the guy an extra 30 seconds to live than she normally would.

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I understand your point, but I don't think he was the redeemable character. He was selfish and willing to go the extra mile, do things that he hadn't even been ordered to do. There comes a time when violence turns from abhorrent to enjoyable. He was way past the middle stage; he enjoyed it.

I think the quirky computer nerd that won a place in the Samaritan entourage, and then came back and showed all the wonderful things Samaritan had accomplished could have been redeemed. They were still using her for the positive, promising aspects of Samaritan's plan. She could have gotten a huge dose of reality and seen that if Samaritan couldn't make people stronger and better, it was willing to kill them as inessential, or as actually a hindrance in its grand plan.

But ex-convict turned mass murderer guy passed the point of no return.

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I would have agreed, but then he killed root. Then he had to die...

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But they also showed that he understood where he would end up if he kept working for them. He knew they'd ask him to kill before long and he had a way out (although they probably would have killed him but he didn't know that). So at the end of the day it was his choice to stay in knowing it would mean killing people he knew nothing about.

Also, Shaw is shown repeatedly to be a sociopath. So that kind of character development would have been... out of character... 😎

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You made a good reference by pointing out this scene which bothered me as well. We should remember the episode in the hospital where Jeff was ordered to kill the two doctors, didn't want to do it first and then was forced to by Samaritan showing him his thumbprint proofs. He then went on because his hown safety was at stake and I ask myself what he would have done also, maybe also killed a child? We don't know, can only speculate.
Shaws killing him was pure revenge and Finch wouldn't have liked that. He only let Elias kill the voice in order to prevent him of doing further harm.
But John Reese would have probably done the same as we have seen in The Devils Share, where he wanted to kill Quinn and was prevented by Finch.
I like the series because it makes us think about these questions of morale and ethics, shame that it got canceled!

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