Is this really America? - Nebraska (2014) Discussion

[–] zooymtoo 11 years ago

Well, America is a very large place ...but the visuals in the movie are real.
I've traveled through many small farming towns that look exactly like those depicted in the movie.
That has nothing to do with America as a whole. You have places like Vegas and New York City and then you have the other extreme.
But most of it's somewhere in between.

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[–] mpatt670214 11 years ago

Never lived in a developed world,and have seen only hotels in big cities.But if life in rural America is true as depicted in the movie, and several other movies, then i am coming to believe that rural life in my supposedly backward district in India is far Superior.I still wonder, if that is really realistic.

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[–] M_Exchange 11 years ago

"But if life in rural America is true as depicted in the movie, and several other movies, then i am coming to believe that rural life in my supposedly backward district in India is far Superior."

You're making me laugh because I had this exact argument with an Indian American girl who I guess never has seen extreme poverty in America. She told me that poverty in India is much worse or whatever just because it's in India (or something) and I countered with something like, (sarcastically) "yes, an extremely impoverished family who is freezing their @sses off in Baltimore feels much better about themselves than an extremely impoverished family in New Delhi."

So much of the world is just becoming the same thing as jobs and culture are shipped overseas.

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[–] Ende3 11 years ago

Your argument is flawed. There is no comparing between the two. You'd know better if you'd seen how some people live in places like certain parts of India, much of Africa, northern China etc. The freezing, crack-addicted, impoverished family from Baltimore projects still has access to soup kitchens, water to bathe in once in a while, and other basic amenities. And more importantly, they're that way mostly because they're drug addicts. An Indian waste picker has much, much limited access to social benefits, and he's that way because he was born into the waste-picking caste. There are different kinds of poverty in the world, and most of it is due to different levels of civil liberty and different options available to different folks.

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[–] NutshelLS 11 years ago

Your argument is flawed. There is no comparing between the two. You'd know better if you'd seen how some people live in places like certain parts of India, much of Africa, northern China etc. The freezing, crack-addicted, impoverished family from Baltimore projects still has access to soup kitchens, water to bathe in once in a while, and other basic amenities. And more importantly, they're that way mostly because they're drug addicts. An Indian waste picker has much, much limited access to social benefits, and he's that way because he was born into the waste-picking caste. There are different kinds of poverty in the world, and most of it is due to different levels of civil liberty and different options available to different folks.

There are also a lot of people in America who are homeless and who aren't drug addicts, even more so lately with the state of the economy. To infer that most of those people brought those circumstances upon themselves because they are all drug addicts(mostly)is also a "flawed" argument. And for those who are drug addicts, be it homeless and/or living in extreme poverty, what if they have kids? Are those kids much different from the Indian waste picker who was born into waste-picking caste?

Although there might be different levels of poverty, i think there's a certain point where it's a terrible way to have to live, no matter where you're located geographically.

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[–] 11 years ago

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[–] NutshelLS 11 years ago

I have a job, thanks you very much. You are the one who is ignorant, gotoads. You obviously have no idea what it's like to grow up in poverty, and how hard it is for kids to pull themselves out of it. They are kids, moron. Kids need some kind of parental guidance to help them with choices that will ultimately lead to a good life. Some kids grow up without this parental guidance, or parents who think it's funny to watch their 5 yr old smoke a joint, and at age 11 that same kid is smoking crack with the same *beep* parents. Please explain to me how it's not very difficult to succeed in life for a kid such as this? Oh yeah, according to gotaods it's simple... just go to school and get good grades, because all kids should be able to make adult decisions starting at the age of 5 yrs old, and we all know that kids know how these decisions will impact their future job prospects and/or upward mobility, right.

The only thing you're right about is that IF a kid can somehow overcome these odds and succeed, then at that point they have more opportunities available to them whereas someone living in a third world country doesn't even have that. But that's a big IF, and it doesn't make their childhood any less hard and sad as a child growing up elsewhere.

And the economy is still bad, you're wrong again. For one, there aren't enough jobs to go around. I know you find this hard to believe, but there are people in some parts of the US who are trying to get a job, but they continue to get passed over due to a limited number of positions available. And even if you're one of the lucky ones who gets a job, it's not about 'doing something you hate for a while', it's about trying to support you and your family on a job that pays minimum wage($7.25/hr). That's about $850/month after taxes... after housing, electric/heat, food, gas, doctors, prescriptions, babysitter, etc... there's not enough money there to support yourself, much less a family.

To think things are fine if everybody would just get off their ass and quit being lazy is an incredibly naive way of looking at things, or as you like to say... rather ignorant.

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[–] NutshelLS 11 years ago

Nevermind.

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[–] dogluver1970 11 years ago

I have a job, thanks you very much. You are the one who is ignorant, gotoads. You obviously have no idea what it's like to grow up in poverty, and how hard it is for kids to pull themselves out of it. They are kids, moron. Kids need some kind of parental guidance to help them with choices that will ultimately lead to a good life. Some kids grow up without this parental guidance, or parents who think it's funny to watch their 5 yr old smoke a joint, and at age 11 that same kid is smoking crack with the same *beep* parents. Please explain to me how it's not very difficult to succeed in life for a kid such as this? Oh yeah, according to gotaods it's simple... just go to school and get good grades, because all kids should be able to make adult decisions starting at the age of 5 yrs old, and we all know that kids know how these decisions will impact their future job prospects and/or upward mobility, right.

Just wanted to put my 2 cents in here: with all due respect to your plight, qb-ashton, and whatever hurdles you've had to overcome, I think you took gotoads' post a little too personally. All he/she was saying is that in the US, we have so many social welfare programs, an overall STABLE economy, etc (no matter how bad, you cannot compare it to a any country outside of the developed world) that poverty IS somewhat different on a purely objective level. And I really did mean with ALL DUE RESPECT to YOU and whatever obstacles you might've had to overcome (and OF COURSE children need guidance, though sometimes their parents aren't able or around to do so, so they have to seek it elsewhere).

Now, since I grew up 'comfortable' in an upper-middle class family, OF COURSE I have no idea how it feels to grow up in poverty. However, that doesn't mean that I can't understand it on an intellectual level. My grandfather, who was born in 1909 to Russian-Jewish immigrants was SO POOR, he literally had to steal fruit off of carts and pick up pennies off of the street to survive, as a kid (his father died when he was very young and his mother was mentally ill- I think). And those social welfare programs weren't even around until the 1960s - though there were private charities that helped individuals and families. And although the public schools in NYC were absolutely atrocious in certain areas, during that time, he somehow worked his way up and ended up graduating at the top of his medical school class (Harvard) and had a successful OB/GYN practice, until he retired in his 80s.

Now, while my grandfather was smart and driven, things like this can ONLY HAPPEN IN AMERCA (or at least the America I grew up in - I fear it's headed in the wrong direction, but that's a whole other discussion). That's what gotoads meant, I believe. I don't think he/she meant in any way to diminish what you've overcome, in order to be where you are today.

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[–] NutshelLS 11 years ago

I'll respond one more time and then i'm done. Thank you dogluver1970 for expressing your point without throwing out insults to anybody who you disagree with.

First, in my original post that gotoads told me i was ignorant for posting, i was mainly responding to someone who pretty much said that the homeless in the US bring it on themselves by being mostly drug addicts. I already said what i had to say about that.

I then ended my post with this:

Although there might be different levels of poverty, i think there's a certain point where it's a terrible way to have to live, no matter where you're located geographically.

So according to gotoads, i'm ignorant for thinking that after you reach a certain point of poverty, that it's a terrible way for a kid to have to live. Nowhere did i say that the level of poverty and/or how widespread it is is equal to or worse in the US than a third world country.

@dogluver
I do realize that in America there's always a possibility to reach the "American Dream". And there are several that do, but for every person who escapes the clutches of poverty and reaches the American Dream, there are several who never escape poverty. And even for the ones who do, it doesn't make the time they spent growing up in poverty any less sad. That's all i was saying.

And you're right, i do take it personal when somebody like gotoads, who probably hasn't ever had to struggle... who hasn't had to go several days without food, or sleep under a bridge when it's 10 degrees outside... tries to minimize those who ARE living in poverty in America today. Then he comes back with a Forbes article that says there isn't even such a thing as poverty in America. Yeah, people like this who live in their own little privileged world and who seem to lack the ability to empathize with the less fortunate in this country really do piss me off. And that's why i'm signing off this thread.

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[–] dogluver1970 11 years ago

Before you sign-off this thread, I hope you see this qb-ashton:

I probably didn't read the ENTIRE thread as carefully perhaps as I should have, before I jumped in, so now that I read your thoughtful post above, I totally get what you're saying. And I honestly shouldn't have 'judged' what you take or don't take took personally - that's totally your prerogative and unrelated to me. I hope you realize that I only wrote what I did, in order to illustrate that although there ARE people like myself, who don't know what it feels like to struggle financially, I can understand it on an intellectual level and feel compassion for those who DO struggle in such a way. So commend and respect your position.

One last point: though I can't relate to what it's like to struggle financially or go to bed hungry, the human condition is one that is full of suffering, in one way or another. For instance, I think of parents, no matter how wealthy, whose children might die of leukemia - or whatever - I can't IMAGINE how painful that must be. Now, in my case, I've had a 20 year struggle with a chronic illness (Crohn's Disease). I've had 3 major surgeries and at least 20 hospitalizations in the past 20 years (plus, I've had a lot of chronic pain issues, the disease affected my career, relationships - everything). So I DO understand pain and what it's like to suffer. Though there may be different degrees, to an extent, it IS still a universal theme (though with that said, of course I always am grateful for what I DO have, as I'm sure that you are as well - and for what you are/were capable of overcoming.
Best wishes to you...

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[–] couzijn 10 years ago

I'd like to call you a name now, but luckily for you I was brought up with some decency.

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[–] MTulliver 10 years ago

Agreed! What a sour and mean person.

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[–] balducci2 11 years ago

Now, since I grew up 'comfortable' in an upper-middle class family, OF COURSE I have no idea how it feels to grow up in poverty. However, that doesn't mean that I can't understand it on an intellectual level. My grandfather, who was born in 1909 to Russian-Jewish immigrants was SO POOR, he literally had to steal fruit off of carts and pick up pennies off of the street to survive, as a kid (his father died when he was very young and his mother was mentally ill- I think). And those social welfare programs weren't even around until the 1960s - though there were private charities that helped individuals and families. And although the public schools in NYC were absolutely atrocious in certain areas, during that time, he somehow worked his way up and ended up graduating at the top of his medical school class (Harvard) and had a successful OB/GYN practice, until he retired in his 80s.

Now, while my grandfather was smart and driven, things like this can ONLY HAPPEN IN AMERCA

You've swallowed the kool-aid. :)

Certainly what you described CAN happen in American, but it is hardly the ONLY nation in which it can happen.

Indeed, it (climbing from a lower socio-economic class to a higher one) is (and has been for decades) less likely to happen in America than in many other developed Western nations. (E.g., several studies have placed Denmark, Norway, Finland, and Canada above the U.S. when it comes to social mobility.)

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[–] kelalole 11 years ago

Yes, you are right, but your tone/attitude does rub people the wrong way. Though the amount of abject poverty in America is minuscule compared to many other areas of the world, it does exist here. Those who have seen it or, worse, lived it will naturally get quite upset by your apparent dismissal of them.

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[–] croce-donna 10 years ago

I have friends from India. You can rent a near palace for $100 a month. Go out to dinner for $2.

Cost of Living is what it is all about and in our country the cost of living is higher than any third world country. Much higher.

I have been told that you can live very nicely in India for $400 or $500 a month.

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[–] Korios 10 years ago

The low cost of living only applies to you coming from the States with hard dollars, with which you can buy dirt cheap tons of rupees, not to someone who is paid with rupees. The same applies to any tourist traveling from a rich country with a hard currency to a poor country with a weak currency. To demonstrate this imagine the other way around, a poor Indian paid with a few rupees trying to buy US dollars to travel to the States. Do you think he will even manage to pay for a ticket?

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.

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[–] psdhart 9 years ago

The low cost of living only applies to you coming from the States with hard dollars, with which you can buy dirt cheap tons of rupees, not to someone who is paid with rupees...To demonstrate this imagine the other way around, a poor Indian paid with a few rupees trying to buy US dollars to travel to the States. Do you think he will even manage to pay for a ticket?

this

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[–] croce-donna 10 years ago

thank you for an excellent post

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] TRhett 9 years ago

To think things are fine if everybody would just get off their ass and quit being lazy is an incredibly naive way of looking at things, or as you like to say... rather ignorant.

Exactly. I'm having a VERY hard time comprehending what is so . . . incomprehensible about your comments (which are right on the money, BTW). I've been very lucky to be able to travel extensively, and I've seen what REAL POVERTY (and REAL DOWNTON ABBEY LIFESTYLES) look like (hint: the poverty section doesn't have satellite dishes on every roof, nor are there hot water heaters in every "house" - such as they are). I will admit that U.S. poverty is not the same as third-world poverty, but like I said, I've seen many small villages around the world, and . . . well . . . they're not exactly rockin', up-to-the-minute places. What exactly are these responders getting at? I know many people (most of whom have never been more than 20 miles from home - if that) in other countries see the U.S. as some big Disneyland due to only seeing things like Dallas, the Superbowl, the Oscars, ridiculously elaborate Beyonce performances (how many of the "packs" of orphans that run through the streets of Calcutta could a single one of those feed?), any number of exaggerated, FANTASY-tic TV series, "Reality TV," (BTW, anyone who wants to see what poverty in India REALLY looks like - watch "Slumdog Millionaire" - THAT will put things in perspective http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1010048/?ref_=nv_sr_1), the Superbowl, the Oscars, etc., but they can't possibly think all 4 million sq. miles of the U.S. are filled with Biltmore Houses and Hollywood - any more than I believe all of England is Buckingham Palace and Bath.

I think part of the problem might be that the rest of the world, which once again was used to seeing the West through Western movies and TV (which generally projected people rushing TO the West and grabbing large tracts of land with which to seek their fortunes) seems to have kind of missed the subsequent mass migrations AWAY from that very same "rust belt" (or "flyover states" if you prefer), abandoning MANY, MANY small crossroads towns after they ran dry.

Ever looked - REALLY looked - at a map of Kansas . . . or Oklahoma . . . or Nebraska . . . or Arizona . . . or New Mexico . . . or the Dakotas . . . or western Texas? There are literally thousands of square miles of NOTHING - and many people are hundreds of miles from the nearest town of any size. Which is why I don't understand what these people expected. I didn't expect small towns in rural Scotland to have Starbucks, FGS (and they didn't)!

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[–] MTulliver 10 years ago

""The economy" isn't that bad, by the way. Jobs are all around and sometimes you have to swallow a little pride and do something you kind of hate for a while. Stop whining, get a job and save money instead of wasting it all."

The economy is VERY bad. Do you live under a rock? "Jobs are all around"? Yeah, apparently you do. The thing about a job is...you need to be making enough to actually buy the basics and keep a roof over your head. It's not about people being PICKY. It's about REALITY. If all you can afford are necessities, please tell me how you are supposed to save any?
Ridiculous.
Go drink some more TEA.

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[–] vixenviewer 11 years ago

I agree with NutshelLS

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[–] llothar 10 years ago

Yes farmer (if they have their own land) in 3rd world countries live better then US american working poor. I lived for 6 years in rural Thailand - and all US american expats i meet never wanted to go back.

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[–] Ironman54 9 years ago

You have to keep in mind that these rural farms were usually close to a larger city, not too far a drive away.

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[–] TheMouseShadow 11 years ago

yes. there are many small decaying towns from coast to coast. the plains culture is gone and the farming culture is not far behind.

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[–] mordloldad 11 years ago

I travel back to my parent's hometown in rural New England every once in awhile. It's pretty much exactly how Nebraska depicts it.

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[–] brfts2001 11 years ago

Yes, it's easy to see things in a different light if you haven't visited rural middle America lately. But this part of the country is declining, and has been for some time. I applaud the director for deviating from the norm and filming this where not everyone is playing on the cell phones, latest Ipads, etc. It shows what life use to be like in the country as a whole. People still interacted more. For that alone, I thoroughly enjoyed this film! 8/10

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[–] Muppetsfan1 11 years ago

I can't speak for Nebraska or Wyoming, but I've lived in Billings, MT my whole life and while there are plenty of people who choose not to read the newspaper online, there are more people who carry around iPads and are firmly in the 21st century.

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[–] salvationsal 11 years ago

+1

Just wanted to add, rural mid-west is still some place where you can go live for few years to experience living in them old days.

Even if we don't have 4G there, life still is easy and makes sense, given you keep yourself employed (or want to be employed). - Just like the hard working family from where boys stole the compressor and subsequently returned.

"From the dawn of our species, Man has been blessed with curiosity." � Alvar Hanso

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[–] Roy_Munson2014 11 years ago

There have always been places like that in America and I'm sure there always will be

"Bltch, what you DON'T know about me -- I can just about squeeze into the Grand xxxxing Canyon!"

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[–] nomadprog 11 years ago

I live in Billings. Was neat to see those shots of the city downtown on the big screen. Yes of course those people exist here, but the area in which we are in the film has hipster bars, live music venues, jazz hangs, restaurants.. Will forte drives by one of my favorite bars in Billings in one scene, called "the rainbow".
But of course you got the simple town folk like the ones shown here and that was a very accurate portrayal.

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[–] agilson74-919-761792 11 years ago

I live in rural Nebraska and have almost my entire life. The depiction of small towns in rural America is spot on.

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[–] stuart4379 11 years ago

The fact that you've managed to find an internet somewhere suggests otherwise agilson.

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[–] joaquinpaez 11 years ago

I don't think the movie suggests internet is unavailable in this towns, it just happens to be irrelevant on the context of the story.

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[–] Hancockenstein 11 years ago

believe it or not some people still use dialup internet, and that's available literally anywhere in the US.

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[–] xxhaimbondxx 11 years ago

If there is at least 1 cell tower, you can have your internet. Some people had satellite dishes in the movie, here's your internet. It's more expensive, sure, but if you live in rural area, internet could be a neat substitute to getting drunk in a bar every night.

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[–] Hancockenstein 11 years ago

or just an additive to getting drunk in a bar every night.

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[–] Thought_Criminal_J62377 11 years ago

Stuart, I have no idea where you got the notion that internet isn't available in Hawthorne. You only saw elderly, redneck type people. My Aunt/Uncle and 1 cousin don't have internet of any type and my Aunt/Uncle don't even have cable TV. We all live in the Bolivar, Dover, New Philadelphia area about 25 miles south of Canton, Ohio. I didn't see anything in this movie, that I Haven't seen before in my own real life.

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[–] goodthingsjohn 11 years ago

I've lived in Nebraska all my life.
The answer to your question is "no".
This is an exaggeration. It just is. Yes, some small towns are dying. Some small towns have a lot of old people.
This is an exaggeration of that fact. It really isn't that bad. And they only show one part of a town.
The other half of the town would be vibrant. It doesn't set up a good community. Most small towns, even if "dying", still have quite a good community.

Liberalism is a mental illness, and it's the only one that's contagious.

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[–] Thought_Criminal_J62377 11 years ago

John, I hate to say this, but you haven't seen as much as you think. I've seen towns in Ohio that are even more vacant or backward. Look up Mineral City, Ohio on Google Earth. I grew up 1 mile from a town(New Cumberland, Ohio) so small it only had 1 store and it's half the size of a 7/11. I'm not sure New Cumberland will even show up on a map LOL and it doesn't even have a bar.

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[–] goodthingsjohn 11 years ago

Do small towns exist? Yes. And I'm sure towns without bars exist too. Has New Cumberland ever been bigger than that? That is the question. There ARE dying towns, never said there weren't. But the way Hawthorne is depicted is simply an exaggeration.
You know, there's a town in Nebraska that has one person in it. Highest population in thirty years there, too, because it didn't exist thirty years ago. You need to put things in perspective when you cite them, like how big it USED to be. Catch my drift?

Liberalism is a mental illness, and it's the only one that's contagious.

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[–] BilboTheDefiler 11 years ago

I checked out New Cumberland PA on Google Street View and to my non-US eye it looks beautiful and rich, the houses, the scenery, not dying at all but well-tended? Sure there's not much going on and it's very small, so what. But why does nobody have a fence around his house? That's so weird, anybody can just walk onto the property. Don't you guys need any privacy?

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[–] bstech 11 years ago

I have also lived in Nebraska all my life. In fact, I grew up in one of the towns that this film was shot. And Main Street in "Hawthorne" is in the next town over. I completely agree with goodthingsjohn. Yes, this is how the places look. But Alexander Payne and his cinematographer are professionals and can make anything look a little different. Add in the fact that this was shot in B&W of course it will look dreary. My hometown is quite lively and at one point had 0 homes for sale.

So "Nebraska" was an exaggeration..especially with the characters. Sure there are a few rednecks and geezers out there but that is minimal.

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[–] goodthingsjohn 10 years ago

THANK you. I'm getting tired of people not from here telling me that I'm wrong about what it's like even though I've lived my whole life there. Sheesh.

Liberalism is a mental illness, and it's the only one that's contagious.

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[–] drivenkick43 10 years ago

I also have lived my whole life in small town Nebraska.

I agree with what you're saying, but I am not sure what you are saying makes the movie an "exaggeration." Sure, they didn't show the fully modern high school building and teens buried in the iPhones. That aspect of small town life wasn't relevant to this story. But that doesn't mean that parts they showed were in any way exaggerated. I thought it was a very accurate depiction of the way some people live their lives. Just because the movie didn't show other lifestyles doesn't change that.

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