Actually exists? THey refer to her at the end but there are two scenes (when Doc goes to the psychiatric hospital, where she randomly dissapears from the car and during the ouija sequence where she's totally ignored) that suggest she's an hallucination or something.
shareUp to you I guess. It is an interesting choice to have her narrate the film - that separates her from it in a way but she is very much an actual existing character in the film. She seems to represents Doc's intuition or his Doper's ESP if you will.
Buy The Ticket, Take The Ride
Yeah, I'm on the fence.
I'd like to say she's a real person who literally and figuratively serves as Doc's voice of reason. But I don't know, man. There are some theories that suggest Shasta is dead, and if Shasta is the only other person who knows about Sortilege, then maybe Shasta is all in Doc's head too...Cos y'know, she's dead and he's hurtin'.
Weird stuff
Howard Hughes was Italian?
As with a lot of the stuff in IV, it doesn't matter really as it's all relative, but what Doc does with it is what is of interest.
Buy The Ticket, Take The Ride
She's real, but she primarily serves as our guide through the film.
Her appearance and subsequent disappearance from the car could be that she was dropped off along the way, or, more likely, the director just messed with our heads.
"a malcontent who knows how to spell"
Given that she has actual conversation with him at other times, such as over pizza in one of the earlier scenes, I didn't see any hinting that she's not real. I agree that she disappears very abruptly from the car during that driving scene, but I got the impression that that was simply a jump cut to a later point in the day, when he was about to arrive at Channelview Estates. (Was he even wearing the same clothes between the shots where she was, and then was not, in the car with him?)
shareBut you gotta keep in mind that Doc is the only one throughout the movie who acknowledges her presence. Not to mention Shasta's mysterious line: "She knows things, Doc. Maybe about us that we don't know." (Or something like that).
There was another scene when Doc is traveling to Chick Planet. Sortilege is there in one shot, but it cuts to a profile of Doc and Sortilege is no longer in the passenger seat.
Yeah, I think she's a real character but was she actually THERE with Doc when everything was going down? That's the thing that's getting me right there.
Howard Hughes was Italian?
I think she's there in some scenes (restaurant) and not in others (Ouija). I also think some parts are sorta flashbacks maybe...or non linear blended together. There is definitely all this allusion to ESP & mind control. Astrology/spirit world among us.
She (they) are among the initiated enlightened good side. Others are using these powers for Dark purposes.
Sortilege
1. (Alternative Belief Systems) the act or practice of divination by drawing lots
2. (Alternative Belief Systems) magic or sorcery
The use of supernatural powers to influence or predict events:
I also think Bigfoot & Doc have some kind of ESP and/or are faces of the same person. Notice every time something goes down Bigfoot calls and already has heard about it (Shasta being back in town). Then the last scene where they speak the same words confirms this. In fact, there seems to be a whole web of connections going on. Every character that walks into Doc's life, is connected in some way to his tangled web of investigation in a surprising way.
Either way I don't think it's crucial that she is/isn't there to the story,but it's vague on purpose to make a point. Dopers ESP Doc, Dopers ESSP.
I love Paul Thomas Anderson's films, but the thing that keeps them lively while REALLY bugging the crap out of me (not in a bad way, mind you), is that he has these little "mysteries" the remain unsolved in his flicks ever since "Magnolia."
Magnolia has the frogs, Punch-Drunk Love has that harmonium, we're not sure if Eli was a twin or a schizo, is Sortilege real, and maybe there's one in The Master, I just can't think of it.
While keeping the movie vague enough to never be able to nail down, it does create some lively discussion.
Exactly. See, Eli was a Twin in the Screenplay. I think PTA even had 2 Actors in mind. It then became what we see with Paul Dano. At first, I didn't question it all that much. Just figured he nailed the role. Then I watched, again and again. I started to think that he was one in the same. Except for the Bowling Alley scene, both are mentioned. Is it just one man's insanity? Idk. In Punch Drunk Love I think the piano represents his rage and/or control of it. That's why the Music throughout the film pretty much goes along with Barry's mood. It literally makes me feel uncomfortable lol but in a good way. In a way only good Cinema can. No matter, I agree. PTA is truly building up a resume of incredible work and he puts meaning into every ounce of his work.
shareThere's some clues in There Will Be Blood, apparently, that Eli IS faking the twin, but still it's dismissible. The most interesting point is that when he pours drinks in the bowling alley for him and Daniel, he pours THREE glasses. BOOM.
I also get the representation aspect of the harmonium, and say yes, totally. It's a small, weird thing with a lot of capability that was dumped on the street but has the potential to make beautiful music like HELLO: Barry. It's just that the literal-minded people I know still ponder a grounded justification for it's existence, or for the car crash, in this otherwise very grounded, realistic story.
As for Sortilege, she was real in the book. Who knows here. The more I watch the flick, the more I think Shasta didn't make it. But Bigfoot knows about her. So...what the @#$*, PTA.
I totally forgot about the 3 glasses!! I remember noticing that the last time I watched it. Absolutely! Yea, it's just PTA mastering his artform. The guy is getting Scary Good. Very creative stuff. Imagine 10 years from now? He started so young, his films are maturing (Even with Inherent Vice and it's sometime absurdity), it's why I love Cinema. Great post because I forgot all about that.
shareI assumed she was dead when she showed up in that spanking scene because she's wearing that necklace and then when he sees Puck late he's wearing it at some point it stops being clever and just becomes annoying
shareTo some people that seems like brilliance,
but to me it just seems like a deliberately distressed
piece of furniture ... something that is deliberately
made defective ... it just doesn't work so well with me.
Sortilege is a French word for spell or hex.
More from wikipedia about Sortilege- this explains that Ouija board in the film:
"Also Psychologist Julian Jaynes categorized divination into 4 types. One is Sortilege (cleromancy). This consists of the casting of lots, or sortes, whether with sticks, stones, bones, beans, coins, or some other item. Modern playing cards and board games developed from this type of divination. Cleromancy is a form of sortition, casting of lots, in which an outcome is determined by means that normally would be considered random, such as the rolling of dice, but are sometimes believed to reveal the will of God, or other supernatural entities."