They left out the best part! - All-Star Superman (2011) Discussion

[–] koweja 14 years ago

While I'll agree that it was one of the best parts of the comic, I wouldn't dock the rating by 20% just because of its absence. I can understand why they cut it since it wasn't crucial to the plot (in fact, it being completely unimportant to the main plot is what makes it so moving), however it would have only taken a few seconds of screen time and there were other scenes that could have been eliminated or shortened.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

And Jimmy in a dress was crucial? Besides, as it's a home video release, it really isn't bound by any rules of running time, is it? Or is it?

Ah well, maybe they'll do a "special edition" with that scene included on the comic's fifth anniversary or something.

Thanks for your input!

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] Progeny51 14 years ago

I actually enjoyed the movie more because they didn't waste time one of the most overrated moments in comic history. It's not bad. But it doesn't have to be there. It made sense to cut it, along with most of everything else that was cut, for time.

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[–] Falcon90 14 years ago

I think I remember that part, shame it wasnt put it but the movie was too short - yes they could have cut some out to fit it but I still thought it was too short overall for the multiple plotlines they introduced.

Oh, and OP, love the sig. Always thought that

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

I was surprised at how much they got in; frankly if I was Bruce Timm, I'd have made two or three movies and included everything, but this was a nice boiling down of the parts of the story that flowed together best.

Thanks for the compliment! Ordinarily I admire Obi-Wan, but he was being really pompous at that point. Ah well, put it down to him being under duress.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

It would not have been time wasted, and the scene has already been echoed in a Justice League comic in which Superman saved a girl who might as well have been Regan, so in calling it overrated, I think you're treating it unfairly.

And again I say, I'd rather have seen that than Jimmy Olsen in drag.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] UltraBaron7 14 years ago

I agree. Would have been nice if they included it.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

Thanks. :-)

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] memorandom 14 years ago

missing that out was nuts - it's not simply a key moment in the story, it's kind of one of the most defining illustrations of superman's character in ANY story

it's also a shame they trimmed/dumbed it down and cut out zibarro and a lot of morrison's more oddball stuff

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

Sadly, the trimming is unavoidable, unless they want to make a miniseries, which would have been a great idea. Me, I would have liked to see the segment with all the future Supermen turning up, as well as the Zibarro story.

And a bit of a shame they couldn't have made Mr. (not Dr.) Quintum's coat the rainbow color it is in the comic; I bet a bit of CG would have made that possible.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] libra113 14 years ago

Speaking of, as some of the other posters were, I haven't read the comic and was kinda wondering WHY Jimmy was in drag in the first place?

Not knowing the comic I still can agree that the Jimmy scene (without explination) was kind of silly and pointless and the alternet scene described with the girl sounds better and straitforward enough to not need a lot of explaination or build up.

That said, I just finished the movie and liked it over all.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

In the comic at any rate, Jimmy was doing an entertainment feature entitled, "I Spent a Week as America's Sweetheart" for which he dressed as a certain girl pop star. It was only vaguely hinted at in the movie. Mind you, he was a bit more modest in the movie; in the comic, he wore denim cutoffs, a halter top (presumably with socks stuffed inside), and a long blonde wig.

For all that Jimmy has most often been the comic relief in the Superman mythos, I think they overdid it here. Mind you, I think he fared better than the cadaverous Cat Grant which was the only instance of questionable drawing in the whole series.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] libra113 14 years ago

Okay then. :)

I started reading the comic during the John Byrne era and I don't really recall him writing Jimmy that way, altough I am aware of it being done in the past and in the years since he left.

Under John Byrne Jimmy built the signal watch himself (in an attempt to contact Superman and save a friend of his who tried to kill herself), he was a vauble ally on some occasions about the only time I recall him being portrayed as a comedic figure was when it was discovered that he still lived with him mother (but that wasn't really made a major issue). Later they did things like him losing his job and being a pizza delivery boy and whatnot.

Cat was always portrayed, by Byrne, as being a bit of a flirt and being something of a rival for Lois. There wasn't really a lot done with her, that I recall, until later when we got to learn that she had a son and an ex with whom she shared custody of the son and all that but that wasn't until later on (still in the John Byrne era but not at the start.

Still, I have to agree that the other scene would have been a better use of limited screen time. Still the Jimmy bit was short enough they COULD have done both if they really wanted to. :)

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

Byrne did a lot of great things with Supes and his cast which have stayed to this day. I enjoyed his tenure, and I also liked Matrix to the point that I'm miffed that she seems to have vanished from the DCU altogether.

My problem with Cat as portrayed in "All Star Superman" is strictly in the way she's drawn; she looks anorexic as opposed to her usual curvaceous self. In mainline continuity, I see she's become a one-dimensional floozy with a boob job, which is sad, given the depth she got from the story in which her son was killed by the Toyman.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] libra113 14 years ago

Yeah, I so happened to start reading DC Comics (and comics in general) seriously around the time DC was settling things after the Crisis and got in on the ground floor with Byrne's "Superman", Perez's "Wonder Woman" and so forth.

What I really liked was Byrne's fresh eye toward Superman's powers. He didn't just take them down to a more managable level, he also redefined them in little ways, like the idea that his x-ray vision wasn't really vision so much as just giving him a vauge idea about what he was looking at and he had to make sense of it himself (much like a real x-ray), or that his heat vision wasn't beams (unless it was kicked up beyond his control like Lex did once by beaming solar radiation directly into him via a satalite) but was a red glowing in his eyes and of course the whole telekenisis that worked when he was flying to allow him to pick up heavier objects or hold them together while moving them without having a crazy level of strength.

I'm also not sure but I think he was the one who introduced the notion of his protective aura that made his suit able to withstand all the attacks made on him but didn't protect his cape so it would end up in shreads all the time (which was cool becasue it showed more of what Superman had just been through).

All and all I would say the revisions made under his watch by him (and by others who were working with him) were great and it's too bad they didn't all hold but that's the nature of comics. :)

As for how Cat was drawn that reminds me of the complaints of the way Lois was drawn after Byrne left. He always drew her in designer clothing and looking like a professional business woman then whoever took over right after was always drawing her in jeans and t-shirts and her glamour was gone. Best image I remember Byrne doing of Lois was in her Who's Who entery that year where she was in a light yellow blazer with a knee length skirt and heels. Something about it just seemed like the very image of a professional reporter on a major newspaper. :)

Thoes where the days.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

Some of Byrne's innovations bugged me a bit, such as Supes not "really" being super-strong, but as I always liked his artwork and (for the most part) his writing, I stuck with it and enjoyed it. I especially liked how he made Clark a more capable character and not strictly a bungler; he took a lot of his inspiration from George Reeves, who certainly played a very authoritative Clark Kent.

I dig what you say about Byrne's Lois; on the other hand, I can see both approaches as valid. On the job, she's a total professional (if a bit of a maverick), but at home, she also works as a "jeans & t-shirt gal." I guess it's the difference between Noel Neill and Erica Durance (another being about seven inches).

(For that matter, I remember her "Rambo-ing up" in a black string vest and khakis to rescue a powerless Clark from kidnappers, and that seemed very Lois as well. A multifaceted lady, our Lois Lane!)

What I'm not digging is the new continuity, with a lab-rat Superman in armor. But I think things will slide back again. Like you said, "the nature of comics."

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] libra113 14 years ago

Well, I don't think John Byrne's Superman wasn't super strong it's just he wasn't as strong as past Superman versions and when he was doing super strength stuff it wasn't all just strength there was TK in there as well (which was also neatly reflected in the Superman clone after the Doomsday storyline and his 'tactile telekinis' ability).

Also, the thing about Lois that I was saying was that whoever took over the art chores after Byrne ALWAYS drew her in t-shirts, running shoes and jeans and it was jarring when Byrne had her most often in more dressy clothing (although I'm pretty sure he also dressed her down when the occasion called for it). I'm certainly not saying she (or any character) should dress the same way all the time it was just a strange transistion. :)

Yeah, I to prefure a more confident and assured Clark the the bumbling nerd who walks into walls. Never bought the idea that Clark showing the basic compentence worthy of a reporter of his level would 'blow his cover' somehow. Anyone buy that a major metropolitan newspaper would employ a reporter who faints and practically wets his pants at the sight of danger?

I learned long ago that comics are fleeting and they're always remaking themselves to fit the latest trends and tastes so I try not to get TOO attached. :)

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[–] ian_sheng 14 years ago

Maybe one of the reasons they left it out is because they thought a scene of an attempted suicide of a young woman is too hot a topic to handle for a Superman movie, even though Supes actually talks her out of it in the end. So, they cut it out to save the trouble. I dunno.

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[–] maskedman66 14 years ago

A truly brilliant speculation, and one I hadn't considered.

Still, as the movie was PG-13, I think it would have been permissible, and as you say, Superman did talk her out of it, giving her the words which helped to make that scene so wonderful.

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] ian_sheng 14 years ago

Maybe one of the reasons they left it out is because they thought a scene of an attempted suicide of a young woman is too hot a topic to handle for a Superman movie, even though Supes actually talks her out of it in the end. So, they cut it out to save the trouble. I dunno.

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[–] LightningLad 13 years ago

I agree that's a good moment and actually might have fit, as the plot made a few digressions which I think are integral to the whole, it's about the Superman myth and not just one adventure. They cut out a bunch of my favourite parts of the series; the Bizarros, the future Superman, Jimmy's "For a Day" adventure - I would have been just as happy if the film had been twice as long or a two or three parter, because it somehow seems important to the whole of the story to have those last Silver Age-style moments; but I get that the world doesn't revolve around my tastes and it was a risky project as it was, so I still found it a good moving Imaginary Story. As for Jimmy in drag, that definitely referenced his frequent cross-dressing in the sixties.

-----
Reason is a pursuit, not a conclusion.

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[–] maskedman66 13 years ago

I agree it would have been better to do either a longer production or a series.

"As for Jimmy in drag, that definitely referenced his frequent cross-dressing in the sixties."

Really? I never knew. If it wasn't for Lucy, I'd be very worried about that lad...

"Only a Sith deals in absolutes" is an absolute statement.

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[–] mimsey 13 years ago

"As for Jimmy in drag, that definitely referenced his frequent cross-dressing in the sixties."

And Grant Morrison in the 90s. :P

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[–] Kent_Kainer 9 years ago

Don't know the comic but that scene sounds good and the movie is character driven anyway. Only thing I adore about this movie, how Clark/Superman is portrayed.

They could have deleted the two time traveling dumb asses for it. They were just so wasting the time and felt like a randomly thrown in obstacle without any use for the show.

---
Lincoln Lee: I lost a partner.
Peter Bishop: I lost a universe!

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