MovieChat Forums > Pacific Rim (2013) Discussion > A plot hole that nothing can reconcile

A plot hole that nothing can reconcile


After the Gipsy Danger test run goes haywire, we see Chuck Hansen complain to the marshal about how he doesn't want Raleigh backing up his bomb run. He also bitches about how he wanted to survive this mission.

What I don't get, is that later on the Striker itself is equipped with the nuclear device. Which is essentially a suicide mission. Doesn't make any sense given that Chuck wanted to return alive. And how would he leave the cockpit without an escape mechanism like the Gipsy had? It was clearly established during the double event that the Striker had an escape hatch, but did not have pods like the Gipsy.

Anybody have thoughts, theories, etc?

reply

The orignal plan was to get to the breach and drop the nuke in. It was detachable.

No married man kisses his wife like that!

reply

Yup, that´s how I understood it. So, no plothole there.....

reply

If people say this movie was meant for retards to have fun.......that means the OP is beyond retardation?

reply

The real plot-hole was when they detonated the nuke at the bottom of the ocean. That detonation would've created a tsunami miles high that would've absolutely demolished all cities anywhere close to the sea all over the earth.

reply

What, like all those actual underwater nuclear detonations around the middle of the last century that caused massive waves that obliterated loads of coastal cities?

No. Stop being silly.

No married man kisses his wife like that!

reply

Just thinking the same, then I saw your reply.

reply

Random doublepost is random.

Also, a bit of further reading on underwater explosions. The science behind it all is actually surprisingly interesting. For example, an underwater nuclear explosion results in less overall radioactivity because the radioactive elements combine with the hydrogen and oxygen in water to form stable isotopes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_explosion

No married man kisses his wife like that!

reply

Point one: that's not a plot hole. Please educate yourself as to what a plot hole actually is before declaring things to be plot holes. There's apparently like, only a tiny handful of us on IMDb that actually know what the term "plot hole" means, and you aren't one of them.

Point two: detonating nuclear weapons on the bottom of the ocean doesn't have that affect, as extensive video evidence clearly shows. Please educate yourself about the numerous underwater nuclear tests done during the mid-twentieth century. I'll even give you a good starting point: Operation Hardtack I and the Pacific Proving Grounds.

That is all.

reply

maybe there are better ways to send the nuke through the portal... inside the remains of a dead kiaju... for example.
and first they had a bunch of candidates to copilot with the dude first,,, then when the marshall has to go on the mission knowing he'll die... turning it into a suicide mission... he could have gone alone... and spare the other kid, who goes in the mission saying goodbye to the world...

I must say... the neural link makes no sense.
remote control with a joystick and a couple buttons...
hell they don't have cell phones in that movie.. they¡re going in the wrong mission and the cientist have to take the helicopter and run into the room to be able to warn them... nonsense.

reply

Sending it inside of the remains of a dead kaiju was an option, true, but it doesn't have the same finality and guarantee that going in themselves would. By going in with Gipsy, they could be sure that they were getting the mission done.

The other candidates were never stated to be drift compatible with Becket, nor could we be sure that they had any actual piloting experience.

Stacker went on the mission knowing that it would be his last because of his condition, which had already killed his first partner. It was the stress of piloting a jaeger that would do him in, even with a drift partner, so piloting solo just wasn't an option. Stacker piloting also wouldn't have turned it into a suicide mission for anyone but himself. Had things gone as planned, Chuck would have come back from that mission. You should also bear in mind that every pilot runs the risk of death, for obvious reasons, and that Chuck didn't go into the mission planning to die; he specifically states that he wants to come back because he quite likes his life.

I must say... the neural link makes no sense.

It was clearly explained in the movie.

remote control with a joystick and a couple buttons...

You say that as if that's bad or unrealistic. Modern military tanks and jets are also controlled via joysticks and buttons.

Hell they don't have cell phones in that movie

Who's to say they didn't?

they¡re going in the wrong mission and the cientist have to take the helicopter and run into the room to be able to warn them

Considering that the mission did close the Breach, I'd say it was the right mission. The scientists taking the helicopter back is a bad thing, why? Makes more sense than running all the way back to the Shatterdome. I also don't understand why telling LOCCENT what they learned, warning them about how they need to complete the mission, is a bad thing.

nonsense.

Did you understand anything in this movie at all? Or are you one of those people that thinks "thing I don't understand" = plot hole?

reply

You really need to get out more...

No, I don't care what you think. Really. Don't bother replying.

reply

Because typing is hard, amirite?

reply

Some people love movies. Those people post on IMDb. Some people don't care, and those people should leave.

reply

You're assuming that cell phone service would have been possible in the Shatterdome? Or anywhere else on a devastated and post-apocalyptic world? Perhaps something like that would have functioned inland far enough, or closer to the Atlantic ocean where there WEREN'T GIANT MONSTER ATTACKS. Its clear that anywhere near the Pacific is dangerous and the world and culture have changed a great deal and its possible that they don't even have cell service, at least not reliably.

Or its also possible the screenwriter didn't even bother because cell phones would have done NOTHING to improve the movie or the way information was conveyed. Having the scientists run into the control room rather than call or radio-in has dramatic merits more so than a simple phone call scene would.

The world has been at war with the Kaiju for years and years already. This means that any real naval presence, subs that would launch nukes, have probably been devastated and destroyed and since the Kaiju have been lead by a superior intelligence they've likely wiped out military installations capable of nukes long ago. So it makes sense that they have to drop a nuke in with a Jaeger, rather than firing it.

The neural link is something I've heard complaints about before but we have to keep in mind that Pacific Rim is a homage to both Anime and Kaiju films which both play fast and loose with science. So if they say it takes two pilots, it takes two. As for the controls, its obvious that the pilots movements have a lot of control over the Jaeger's movements, so why they would need more than a few switches and buttons is beyond me.

My nipples weep for you

reply

Actually, many (if not most) of the poorest, most devastated, wartorn, etc. regions have widespread cellphone usage (perhaps some of the widest if you were to consider the perception that these places should not have such widespread usage). Look at Somalia as an example. In fact, you could argue that cellphone usage remains high in these places exactly for the reasons you would not think of: to have competitively-priced services in a place where physical infrastructure tends to be underdeveloped and/or vulnerable and the need for quick and easy communication (yes, including in warzones between members of rebel groups) and you have a society where such communications are not only possible, but rather widespread.

It might not be a plothole, but the poster does bring up a good point (not that I particularly care if a movie happens to feature mobile communications). Not to mention the fact that there was nothing "post-apocalyptic" about the world in Pacific Rim. I didn't get the impression that society and cities had been destroyed outright or on a supremely wide scale (perhaps on the brink, yes) or that civil order had broken down completely. Sure, kaiju attacks were devastating and were happening at an accelerated pace, but people seemed to be living, even living well given all that was going on, from the cyberpunkish Hong Kong slums to downtown Sydney.

reply

A little late responding here but it needs to be done. The nuclear bomb tests you are referring to were not done at the bottom of the ocean. It was at the surface and also with much less power. I can assure you that a nuclear weapon going off at the bottom of the ocean as large as they showed in the movie would create tsunamis of massive proportions We're talking 500 - 1000 foot tall tsunamis that would obliterate coastlines bordering the Pacific. It's called water displacement and its not a theory. The simple movement of tectonic plates caused the tsunamis in Thailand and Indonesia as well as the more recent Japan tsunami. But to displace many cubic miles all at once would be much much much more deadly at the surface. This doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out. Now please study some simple physics for God's sake.

reply

Oh, you can assure us. That's ok then.

You imply a massive earthquake somehow releases less energy than a nuke, I think it's you that needs to study some simple physics...

Just one example:

"Méhauté et al. conclude in their 1996 overview Water Waves Generated by Underwater Explosion that the surface waves from even a very large offshore undersea explosion would expend most of their energy on the continental shelf, resulting in coastal flooding no worse than that from a bad storm"

There's some detail on that wiki page I posted about why nuclear explosions at depth don't have the effect you might think they should. The key factors being the massive pressure at that depth and the fact that water is virtually incompressible, meaning the explosion (no matter how massive) has a great deal of its energy absorbed rather than transferred into any kind of motion.

No married man kisses his wife like that!

reply

While this is all, for all probability, factually correct, saying that this would happen is irrelevant. When the nuke went off, it was in the "other dimension", therefore not affecting or impacting anything on earth.

I think this is a point that some people have overlooked when critiquing the physics of how a set off nuclear device would react that far under water. For what its worth, the other side of the dimensional portal that the Kiaju are coming through might for instance, have denser gravity than our own world, or what Raileigh Becket's Jaeger is floating in before detonation might not be salt water. Could be the equivalent of amniotic fluid, we just don't know.

reply

maybe there are better ways to send the nuke through the portal... inside the remains of a dead kiaju... for example.

true.

and first they had a bunch of candidates to copilot with the dude first,,,

this. they apparently have a dozen or so jaeger pilot candidates lying around. and two extremely tough, albeit damaged somewhat (red typhoon didn't suffer nearly as much of a beating as cherno alpha did), jaegers presumably tucked in their hangar. why no repair jaeger and begin testing out jaeger pilots?

then when the marshall has to go on the mission knowing he'll die... turning it into a suicide mission... he could have gone alone... and spare the other kid, who goes in the mission saying goodbye to the world...

this, too. they knew there were gonna be kaiju near the breach when they went in. that implies a fight. with the marshal's condition, it could be reasonably argued that pentecost was totally neglecting to look out for his co-pilot. Even had they survived the kaiju fight, the marshal may have already kicked it and left his co-pilot to complete the mission on his own. solo.

I must say... the neural link makes no sense. remote control with a joystick and a couple buttons...

this. it's supposed to be a neural interface with the machine, whereby every function of the machine that is a pilot's jaeger is controlled by that pilot's thoughts. why the hell do they need any sort of controls?

hell they don't have cell phones in that movie.. they¡re going in the wrong mission and the cientist have to take the helicopter and run into the room to be able to warn them... nonsense.

mako mori is seen with a tablet. these are formerly super-high-ranking international officials. now they're paramilitary, funded by the king of asia's black market. you think they can't get cell phones? what about satellites? why didn't geiszler and gottlieb just call someone? they're employees. they should have a hotline to their commander.

reply

this. they apparently have a dozen or so jaeger pilot candidates lying around. and two extremely tough, albeit damaged somewhat (red typhoon didn't suffer nearly as much of a beating as cherno alpha did), jaegers presumably tucked in their hangar. why no repair jaeger and begin testing out jaeger pilots?


how I interpreted that was that most of the Jaegers were destroyed beyond repair, they only had 4 remaining Jaegers which were still working and salvageable, and those were the 4 remaining Jaegers we saw in the movie. As for the candidates, since the Americans only had 1 remaining Jaeger which was Gipsy Danger (the other 3 Jaegers belonged to other countries), Pendecost insisted on having Raleigh pilot Gipsy again, because he used to co-pilot her, so he was an experienced pilot with Gipsy. They could only train potential candidates to be Raleigh's co-pilot, but as it turned out none of the candidates that were picked were compatible with Raleigh, only Mako was strong enough to be drift compatible with him.


this, too. they knew there were gonna be kaiju near the breach when they went in. that implies a fight. with the marshal's condition, it could be reasonably argued that pentecost was totally neglecting to look out for his co-pilot. Even had they survived the kaiju fight, the marshal may have already kicked it and left his co-pilot to complete the mission on his own. solo.


Striker Eureka was Australia's Jaeger, meaning it should be piloted by Chuck and his father Herc, but since Herc had injured his arm, Pentecost volunteered to replace him as Striker's co-pilot. Remember that Chuck had complained to Tendo Choi that his father was injured and that he could not pilot Striker all on his own, sure they could've gotten someone else to co-pilot with him, but there was no time to find a candidate who was strong enough to be compatible with an experienced pilot like Chuck. By the time the deployment orders were sent out to the Jaeger pilots, the Kaijus had already appeared at the breach, they had to act quickly, there was no time to waste, so Pentecost decided to replace Chuck's father as the co-pilot for Striker, he made that instant decision because he knew that he was the only other person strong enough and experienced enough to be drift compatible with Chuck. Even though he knew that piloting a Jaeger again could potentially kill him, but it was for the greater good, and just as he had told a worried Mako "not getting into that Jaeger would kill us all". I'm sure at that moment he felt he had to co-pilot Striker...of course you can see the situation from a different perspective and say that Pentecost "did not consider the safety and well-being of his co-pilot" by deciding to pilot Striker and literally going on a suicide mission. But Pentecost knew that he had to do it for the greater good, and I'm sure Chuck understood that very well, I'm sure all the Jaeger pilots understood that they did what they did to protect humanity, and would even risk their own lives to complete that mission, all the Jaeger pilots risk their own lives every time they pilot a Jaeger, they risk their lives to do what they did in order to protect humanity. And I'm sure Chuck understood that, hence he became more receptive of the possibility of dying for the mission in the end.
You also have to consider that if Chuck's father had not injured himself in the first place, then Pentecost would not have replaced him and he would've stayed alive...also, even if Chuck had co-piloted Striker with his father as usual during the mission, there's still the possibility that Striker would've ended up being destroyed and they still would've died anyway. Because even if Pentecost was not in that Jaeger and Chuck's father was, there's still the possibility that Chuck and his dad could've met with the same dilemma of being trapped between incoming Kaijus and they had to self-destruct Striker like they actually did in the movie. These are possibilities that people should consider.

this. it's supposed to be a neural interface with the machine, whereby every function of the machine that is a pilot's jaeger is controlled by that pilot's thoughts. why the hell do they need any sort of controls?


was it ever mentioned in the movie that the neural link between the pilots and the Jaegers controls "all" the functions of the Jaeger? I don't think that was ever specifically mentioned...my impression is that the neural link does not necessarily "control" every function of the Jaegers themselves per se, but rather it stabilizes and manipulates the effectiveness of the functions and controls. I mean, Raleigh did say in the movie that the stronger the bond between the pilots and the Jaegers are, the better you fight, so the neural link between the pilots and their Jaegers were probably mainly just used to manipulate and stabilize the effectiveness and strength of the functions, the stronger the neural bond the pilots have with their Jaegers, the better & stronger the functions work. But all the Jaeger's functions still required some sort of controls to activate or deploy...remember the time during Gipsy Danger's trial run and Mako lost control, she accidentally subconsciously activated Gipsy's plasma cannon weapon and the control center were not able to deactivate it because Mako's neural link with Gipsy was too strong, they eventually had to pull out the main power line to shut down Gipsy completely. That incident with Mako during Gipsy's trial run only further convinces me that the neural link does not necessarily control all the Jaeger's functions themselves per se, but rather it manipulates the effectiveness of the functions.

reply

What I don't get, is that later on the Striker itself is equipped with the nuclear device.


this was the plan from the start, for the striker to carry the bomb and the other three jaegers to fight off any attacking kaiju. chuck got upset after the gypsy test run because of mako freaking out and activating the plasma cannon. prior to the other two jaegers being destroyed and his father getting injured, chuck had much higher hopes of making it back alive, but when pentecost himself volunteered, i think chuck realized that wasn't gonna happen.
and the striker may have had escape pods, but they didn't need them during the double event, since they weren't trying to abandon their jaeger. i dunno if they would have worked after that emp anyways.

"Cinema was made for fantasy, rather than normal types of stories." - Ray Harryhausen

reply

No, the actual plot hole is how Raleigh got back to Earth from Demon-Dimension. When the bomb blew, the hole IMMEDIATELY collapsed. As we saw, there is a good minute or so of travel time through that hole, so once he got back in it from the eject pod, bomb collapsed that bad boy. He was stuck in no-where land.

Well, that and there's about 100 other obvious plot holes in this movie. But overthinking movies like this is silly, since the movie isn't supposed to be technically sound or perfectly written. It's a monster stomp, plain and simple. You enjoy it for what it is, or you don't.

reply