MovieChat Forums > To the Wonder (2013) Discussion > The Ending. . .

The Ending. . .

posted 12 years ago by famousmortimer-2
39 replies | jump to latest

So I'm a little unclear about Marina's fate when the film kicks into its ending montage sequence of frolicking and pensive gazes. Quintana gets transferred. Neil sort of wanders around. Marina however...

There is a shot of her from behind walking down the gate to board a plane. Then later in the same final montage she is in the large back terrace of a new home with a custom waterfall as well as prancing through what looks to be the same Oklahoma woodlands at dusk with two young children.

So was Marina about to fly back to Paris then decided against it and began a proper family with Neil, hence the montage picking up again with the two of them in a newer, bigger, nicer house with children of their own?

I think the film, like all of Malick's, has staggering, redolent visuals, but having Marina's character pulled in all directions only to return to Neil in Oklahoma seems like a cop-out. As wondrous as her realizing it's her destiny and the grace of God that has brought her to this strange, new place, all we get to show her coming to this realization is a shaggy montage.

At least in DAYS OF HEAVEN, we get Richard Gere's motivation for returning for his love: "I never knew what I had with you." Maybe Marina is too ethereal a creature to make any such pronouncement.

[–] TermlnatriX 12 years ago

I don't think she's back at all. What you saw was a flashback after she leaves for the plane. The film utilizes flashbacks like this throughout the film, without letting you know "Hey look, it's a flashback"

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[–] famousmortimer-2 12 years ago

So you're saying she returned to Neil sans daughter; they get married officially; then, in the final montage, we warp forward to her boarding a plane and leaving him. Then later in the same final montage, we warp back to show Marina had stuck around long enough to live with Neil and end up in a new home with children around 7-8 years old?

Love elliptical editing as much as the next guy - RESNAIS, ROEG, BERTOLUCCI, etc., but that's just opaque, choose-your-own-adventure-level cohesiveness.

[–] TermlnatriX 12 years ago

No.

The very last sequence during the gloomy, grey scene of Marina - and the light falling on her face/eyes - that's what I'm referring to, that's the flashback.

The children part is most likely a flash forward.

It all makes sense because there is a scene with the lawyer earlier on which assumes divorce, or did you miss that one?

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[–] mram16 12 years ago

I'm not so sure she did end up with Neil. There is a brief (like, one second) shot of a woman on the patio, and while it could be Marina, it could be any other woman with dark hair. When we see her dancing in the field she is alone (not counting a dog we see briefly). And when they parted, it definitely had a feeling of finality to me. I don't know much about the geography of France, but maybe the field where she dances is in France. Taking it further, maybe she even picked that field to dance in because it reminded her of the place she left behind. Of course I could be wrong, but that's the way I saw it.

EDIT: Or perhaps, as TermlnatriX supposed, it could be a flashback. It took me a while to finish typing out my reply (because I went to watch the ending again), so I just saw her (I'm assuming it's a "her" by the username) reply.

Movies I've Seen:
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[–] thepalestfire 12 years ago

I'm pretty sure that was a flashback at the end with Marina. The horses, and the landscape give you clues as to that. I also don't think that was her with Neil at the end. That was him with his new family years later. Malick did similar time jumps in The Tree of Life.

[–] famousmortimer-2 12 years ago

Alright, your-mileage-may-vary time jump it is, but the movie was only 1hr52min -- Terry could have spared a few extra establishing FRAMES of Neil's new wife as well as Marina's final shot being a flashback reverie. He had 5 editors for Christ's sake!

[–] jimmybuf12 12 years ago

It could have symbolized her ultimately ending up alone in the world...

[–] nhoj441 12 years ago

My take on it is as follows: Marina goes back to France, which we see. The shot of the modern house/patio, is a glimpse of what might have been, had she stayed. The final images of her alone are Malick's final farewell to someone who seems to have been very important in his life. She's alone, briefly enlightened, erratic, still trying to dance. And of course the final image of The Wonder itself, the thing we all seek, distant, beckoning, difficult in its attainment. 1John4:4

[–] paulmaherjr-118-709749 12 years ago

see screen caps here

http://onebigsoulterrencemalickblog.blogspot.com/2013/04/so-does-marina-and-neil-end-up-with.html

[–] mram16 12 years ago

The screencaps do give you something to think about (especially reminding me of the "Love that loves us...thank you" line), but I still can't bring myself over to believing that she came back to him and they lived happily ever after. It just doesn't seem to fit with what came before. I really like nhoj441's interpretation, that we are seeing what might have been and not what actually was.

Movies I've Seen:
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[–] famousmortimer-2 12 years ago

Thanks folks for all the thoughtful responses. Was worried I might get slammed with ad hominem attacks.

I really wish we got to hear some pieces of the dialogue from Marina and Neil's many fights at all those swanky bars, etc.

Volatile relationships ARE cinematic, but to treat the one at the heart of this film completely abstractly was extreme and left Marina entrancing yet unknowable.

Chastain's otherworldly goodness gets set up by showing her as a little girl on the farm learning empathy. Pocahontas' similarly pure and sacred heart is established by having her seek her father's counsel in hushed tones. Marina, however, gets no such moment/glimpse if memory serves. She just IS.

[–] nhoj441 12 years ago

And then if you compare how Ben/Marina end up (i.e. without a perfect resolution, if I'm right) with how Father Quintana ends up, there are similarities. With Quintana, his moving resolution at the end (Christ before me,etc), isn't about neatly wrapping things up. It's about staying on the road, continuing the search, not losing faith in the quest. Same as the search for human love. It's more about the WERDEN than the SEIN, a German Romantic concept that Malick undoubtedly knows more about than I do. 1John4:4

Das ewig-weibliche zieht uns hinan. Goethe, Faust II

[–] gamer3000 12 years ago

I like this a lot

Not many people have basements in California.

[–] captainadam 12 years ago

I very much agree. I really wanted to hear them talk to each other instead of about each other.

http://everythingyoualwayswantedtoknow.blogspot.com/

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] janmarcfurer 9 years ago

I also agree with this scene being a glimpse of might have been. Mostly because of this shot where you see the boy in front of the house (under this some kind of bridge) walking away so that we cannot see him anymore (I think this is a beautiful way of letting him disappear). I think this shot is too long to be meaningless.
But I still don't really get the very last shot of Mont St. Michel. Is it just a last nostalgic thought?

[–] nhoj441 9 years ago

I think there's a lot of nostalgia there, and I would guess it's very personal. And the music during that last segment is the Parsifal overture, which also occurs during the opening sequences in Mont St. Michel. Which would seem to tie in nicely with the more general theme of Parsifal, quest for and discovery of love. I can't remember offhand whether that music occurs elsewhere in the story, but I'd be sure that if it does it reinforces a similar theme. And come to think of it, it relates possibly to Knight of Cups, where a similar quest (the Pearl) is apparently referred to (although I haven't seen it yet).

[–] nhoj441 12 years ago

Having just gotten back from seeing it on the big screen, I pretty sure that the woman in the modern house is not Marina. Of course that doesn't necessarily prove anything, but I still favor a darker ending, at least for Marina. She seems to be breaking down at the end, and throughout the film it seems to be emphasized by what we see and what she herself says, that her lows are more deeply felt than her highs in the pursuit of love. I'd like you to convince me to see it your way, but even the sketchy biographical data doesn't seem to support your argument, although again, that doesn't necessarily prove anything. 1John4:4

[–] renegade_rhino 12 years ago

famousmortimer-2, I thought EXACTLY the same thing as you when I saw it. You can't miss it- the children have dark hair, just like Marina and Neil, and the tone is different.

But reading this string of messages, I also like the poster who said that this could have been the life that she imagined having, had things been a little different...

Beautiful movie!!!!!!

[–] cfinde 12 years ago

nothing without a beginning can have an ending.

[–] jitterbug_cowboy 12 years ago

I think I'm pretty sure that scene is a glimpse of the life she could've had with Neil. In actual fact she chooses to leave the States, go back to Paris and end the relationship. Heartbreaking. We don't need to know the reason why she did it. Some relationships just run their course and run out of steam.

ENOUGH from the clown!!!!!!!!

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] TheMisanthrope 12 years ago

I dont think the end is a flashback at all.

Note that Wagners Parcival plays during certain sequences, and the message is clear. Its meant to signify a quest or search... I think at the end Marina has gone back to where she was happiest ("We walked up the steps.. to the wonder") and we hear Parcival on the soundtrack... its imagery to describe Marinas search for happiness.

IMHO she definitely ends up leaving the States, and ends up back in Europe searching for something or someone to make her happy.

Neil ended up with someone else. the woman we see.. from very far away isnt Marina.

"God Hates Us All"

[–] jab670 12 years ago

I agree. Or if it is Marina, it's meant to be a glimpse of the path not taken.

But I lean more towards it being another woman. Present in the film was two forms of love, spiritual and human. Affleck lacked the ability to love another, while she was bound to further be disappointed by the limits of man's love. Instead, I believe the light falling on her face suggests finding love in a form that was "higher" as Bardem voices.