MovieChat Forums > Defendor (2010) Discussion > I smell a Red Herring!! (spoilers)

I smell a Red Herring!! (spoilers)

posted 15 years ago by scofthe7seas
21 replies | jump to latest

I have to know if I’m the only one, and I don’t think so because I’m pretty sure the movie was made this way on purpose, but was anybody else in complete disbelief at the end when they showed the memorial service?

When Defendor is shot, they purposely do not show any bullet holes, or blood. His speech to Kat is completely lucid, not at all labored, and then very suddenly, ugh argh, death. I think it is misleading. I felt quite comfortable thinking, oh, he must have a bullet proof vest or something. Otherwise they would emphasize the danger, wouldn’t they? They didn’t. I wasn’t feeling appropriately sad when he lay there dying, instead I just felt complete disbelief after it happened.

Like, "Wait... what?? Really? Seriously?"
I kind of felt that way until the credits popped up. Yes, they were serious.

[–] hadmatter 15 years ago

Yes, I felt it was pretty clear that he was wearing that poncho to hide his bullet proof vest, which he must have nicked from the cop shop before he left. His speech was intended to get Angel/Kat to make promises to improve her life, which Arthur would then live to see her fulfill.

When it turned out that, apparently, he WAS dead, I felt like the ending had been changed. I kept waiting for them to reveal that they were letting Defendor "die" in the public eye so that his legend would carry on, but they never did.

I still can't quite believe it ended that way.

I am the sod-off shotgun.

[–] Deathtoll2010 15 years ago

The best way I can describe my feelings when he got shot was disbelief.

Please be patient while my meds take effect.

[–] M24 15 years ago

I thought he had a vest on too and the end would be him in some sort of witness protection program leading people to only think he'd died. I was actually thinking of back to the future 3 during that last shooting. I expected the big guy to run out of bullets and defendor to get up and reveal a heavy steel home made vest and then the girl or police to shoot the big boss. Great underated movie! :) One thing I found weird was didn't he get stabbed? I dont remember the docs mentioning that at all, just the bullets.

[–] DoomTrooper 15 years ago

I was shocked the same way. I thought Defendor was just saying those things to get Kat to do the right thing. Then the memorial comes up and I was like WTF?!? I actually was sad to learn Arthur/Defendor died. It is not normal for me to feel bad about a movie character but I honestly felt sorry for Arthur. As for not seeing blood I think that was just how they shot the film. If you think about it most of the violence is cut short and they don't show the effects that much. The Writer/Director really focused on the story of a simple man donning an alter ego to try and make the world a better place.

If one good deed in all my life I did,
I do repent it from my very soul.
Aaron the Moor

[–] jbernanke 15 years ago

Same thoughts here. I liked that he wasn't all intellectual or rich and powerful like most superheroes, but just an honest average good guy with no superpowers just all heart.

[–] bradmoreland 15 years ago

I thought it was a brave thing (by Hollywood standards) to have him die in the end. It made more of an impact in what had become a serious movie. To have him jump up, say "TAH DAH! I'm wearing a bullet proof vest," and then run off to prepare for a sequel would reduce the movie to wannabe superhero blockbuster fare. Which this wasn't.

It would be like if the movie SE7EN had been made with the alternate ending proposed by the studio and written. It involved Mills and Somerset racing to save Tracy's life from John Doe and Somerset killing John Doe to save Mills from "Vengeance." It would have been too "Hollywood" and wouldn't have the emotional and dramatic impact the final ending has.

[–] scofthe7seas 15 years ago

No, it's nothing like that. I have no problem with the ending, with the concept of the ending, or the choice in the direction they took. My problem is with the execution of it. Sure, fine, let him die. But don’t make it look like he’s completely fine until we see, disbelieving, his “memorial” services. If your analogy is to stand, it would be more like them racing to save Tracey from Vengeance, and then they do save her, and she seems fine. Then in the next scene they’re carting Brad Pitt away. He’s looking all sad because it turns out, in fact, that they didn’t save her.

[–] haileris-2 15 years ago

Yeah, pretty sure they also shot a "bullet proof vest ending" and later decided to go with the more fitting one (as the overall tone of the movie was pretty dramatic/tragic).

[–] rbtoab 15 years ago

I agree haileris that the filmakers probably wanted to go with the bullet proof vest ending at first then changed it. Maybe because they realized, had he been wearing the vest, it would mean he did not believe in himself that he was bulletproof. The filmakers may not have wanted the audience to think Defendor had any doubts.

[–] rkelman 14 years ago

He didn't die because the bullets bounced off him...

[–] 28renton 11 years ago

I was totally expecting him to have a bulletproof vest for the following reasons:

-he was shot with fake bullets and realized he'd need protection in the event that next time they're not fake
-hence he gets a bulletproof vest
-he said to his psychiatrist played by Sandra Oh that sometimes he lies
-so when he says bullets bounce off him, at the time, to us and the characters it sounds like he's saying it because he literally believes it
-but he's lying, he's saying it because he has a bulletproof vest
-in essence, it would've been a clever way for him to lie but be honest at the same time, due to Defendor's character having inside information that us and the other characters weren't privy to yet
-at the point at which he gets shot, I was expecting this to be revealed in flashbacks, but it didn't happen, lol

...I really thought they were working the bulletproof vest into the story in a clever way rather than just your classic reveal, "oh look I had a bulletproof vest the whole time". But nope.

[–] birdysreturn 14 years ago

He clearly stated that Bullets Bounce Off Him!!!

Apparently Defendor didnt get the memo that Wayne wasnt using real bullets when he shot him. Because he believed bullets actually wouldnt hurt him.

[–] Six-Shooter 14 years ago

Oh, boy. This is something that needs to die. Bulletproof vests AREN'T REALLY BULLETPROOF. Maybe if their was some distance between them, he would have walked away with a broken rib or two. But at point blank range, it goes right through it. Like a slightly hardened butter.

The knack to flying lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.

[–] scofthe7seas 14 years ago

Ok, except there isn't even any actual mention of a bullet proof vest. Your response is as if there was a bullet proof vest, and somehow the situation is explained by bulletproof vests in fact not being bulletproof up close (which is not true in movies.) but not any of that was mentioned or explained to any degree.

The point of this topic is that it completely looked like he wasn't going to die, and then "poop, he is in fact dead." It doesn't matter if he was wearing a bulletproof vest, or the magical underwear that Mormons get.

[–] Six-Shooter 14 years ago

I wasn't actually responding to the red herring mentioned but another topic was started that said something along the lines of "He couldn't have died! He had a bulletproof vest on!" That's what I was responding to.

The knack to flying lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.

[–] scofthe7seas 14 years ago

Someone in this thread? I didn't see anybody say that, but he definetly did not have a vest (at least as it is presented in the cut of the movie available..)
He dead. Fo' sho. Just lame the way it was presented.

[–] brushfyr 13 years ago

As Scofthe9seas said there is no mention of a bullet proof vest. Some things like the glass case for the wasps can be bought, and some things jury rigged, but a bullet proof vest isn't one of them. He could have bought one, but it would have been kind of an ass pull.

I really liked this movie, it was really good, nad the ending didn't bother me. Defendor isn't a real superhero, he just thinks he is. She he seems able to walk into and out of the police station when he wants, even the one detective is shocked to see him standing there, and later suprised that he left his office without being noticed.

So if we look at it like he does have some real superpowers it just seems to be some low level invisibilty that he can't control, otherwise he would disappear before he gets attacked and beat up the bad guys without them knowing what's going on. Each fight he's in he gets his ass kicked, badly, just like a real guy against 3 or 4 thugs. Defendor does not seem to have trained with ninjas like Batman, or even have taken a self defense corse at a learning annex.

[–] Demarates 13 years ago

"Bulletproof vests AREN'T REALLY BULLETPROOF."

In that case their name is a bit misleading.

When I'm gone I would like something to be named after me. A psychiatric disorder, for example.

[–] Six-Shooter 13 years ago

Yeah, I think the preferred term is "bullet-resistant" or something.

The knack to flying lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.

[–] spiyda 13 years ago

Well, the poncho was a pretty strong reference to Fistful of Dollars / Back to the Future, Part II.

Kat is writing the press articles.

The memorial is the graffiti from earlier in the movie

Arthur has already shown he can play dead in earlier scenes.. (the fake bullet scene for one)

Having dealt with the arch enemy that killed jis mother, there is no more need for the Defendor alter ego.

Arthur is not dead...

[–] MarshallStax 11 years ago

The wasp at the very end (that Kat Denninng notices as she is writing) just before the first credit rolls is probably meant to hint that Defendor is not dead.

All Art is pretense.