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"Licorice Pizza" and "Boogie Nights" -- The Same Writer-Director, 24 Years Apart

posted 3 years ago by ecarle (14979)
21 replies | jump to latest

I recently found a "free" streaming of Paul Thomas Anderson's (PTA's) Boogie Nights (1997) -- the "movie that started it all" for him (even if Hard Eight was really his first), and watched it all the way through.

Some thoughts:

Boogie Nights was made 24 years before Licorice Pizza. But it looks like it could have come out the same week! It is a real "mind blower" to feel that PTA conceivably could have made these two movies one right after the other. They are both shot in the San Fernando Valley(on some of the same streets, I think.) They are both set in the 70's, though Boogie Nights extends into 1983 (which was still, sort of , the 70s.) The cinematography -- use of color, use of California sun -- is roughly the same. They both use 70's songs in the main on the soundtrack.
But honestly, as long as one doesn't consider how old the actors of Boogie Nights look today (and Mark Wahlberg doesn't look THAT much older)...they seem to be from the same time. (OK, Burt Reynolds has died, but pretty much everybody else is around and kind of looks the same.)

Boogie Nights is "bigger" than LP, more "epic" with more characters and it was intended to make a big splash to get PTA on the map. The "let's visit Porn World" angle alone made the film daring (skirting NC-17) and provocative and something that people wanted to see, but PTA's Scorsese-esque pyrotechnics and exhilarating use of music were on display too.

Still, I, personally, can easily put Licorice Pizza above Boogie Nights -- and at the top of my list of PTA films to date (I'm not alone from what I've read, but there are not THAT many of us.)

Its the TONE that puts Licorice Pizza up there. Its NICE, its ultimately very positive on life(at a time when life isn't very positive for us.) Boogie Nights kinda/sorta ends on a happy note for its survivors, but they are still very damaged people at heart, and a number of the others died violent deaths or ended up in prison.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 3 years ago

That's not to say that, objectively, Boogie Nights is not a more historic and important movie than Licorice Pizza -- it is.

But I do wonder, given most of the PTA movies between Boogie Nights and here - some of which DO have successful (tentative) love story endings and happy endings to go with the bleakness , but most of which are pretty negative -- what possessed him to make this NICE story NOW?

Now, its not THAT nice. Alana, our heroine, has a capacity for sudden rages and cussing at others for no reason ("F off!" "Asshole!" "Dipshit" "Idiot") that takes some getting used to. But at heart, she's sweet and lost and ready for the right love.

Gary...interesting. He's not THAT nice, either.

No sooner does Gary have Alana on a plane to NYC as his chaperone, he opens a flirtation with the flight attendant ("What's your name?") just like he did with Alana -- in FRONT of Alana. Hmm...IS this guy an operator? A junior grade seducer on to no good with more women down the road. Well, when ANOTHER young actor starts to hit on -- and win -- Alana right in front of GARY -- the roundelay of jealousy is underway. An entire aching movie of it that seems to say : "forget those other people, you are the ones for each other."

So not a pure Disney film this time around(heh) but...honestly, Boogie Nights looks like Caligula in comparison. I mean, Boogie Nights seems sick, perverted, lurid, depressing, condescending(the porn people are often portrayed as very DUMB.) You've got one pedophile character, and Julianne Moore rather perversely sees Mark Wahlberg as her "baby boy"(child) even as she is having sex with him professionally.

PTA got nice this time. Will he go back to being mean and sick?

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 3 years ago

I had at one time noticed that PTA put too many "caterwauling women" in his movies Boogie Nights and Magnolia. Wahlberg's mother in Boogie Nights. Julianne Moore and Melora Waters in Magnolia. They just scream and whine and whimper all the time.

Well, Boogie Nights has plenty of caterwauling MEN. So I guess PTA just likes to watch men and women scream at the top of their lungs -- and somehow he makes art out of it. Even with Licorice Pizza.

And this:

After seeing Licorice Pizza I made my personal list of PTA's 9 films (less Hard Eight, which I don't remember) and it went like this:

Licorice Pizza
Magnolia
Boogie Nights
Inherent Vice
Punch Drunk Love

There Will Be Blood
The Master
Phantom Thread

...and the thing is, I don't think I ever would have MADE a list had not Licorice Pizza captured my imagination and heart so well. I had no INTEREST in making a PTA ranking, he didn't matter that much, though I liked Magnolia very much. Honestly..too much yelling.

I expect that There Will be Blood is "objectively" his great film. From an esteemed novel, with great themes, great art, great dialogue("I drink your milkshake! I drink it UP") with a great star and his Oscar winning performance. But still, its one of THOSE kind of movies, and I respect them more than love them.

Anyway, now PTA has a list in my head. And his most recent movie is topping it -- "fading" directors aren't supposed to be able to pull that off...with some of us, they do. A few others (not a lot, but a few) seem to like Licorice Pizza the best. I think it has to do with the radical change in PTA's sense of empathy for his characters and belief in a happy ending.

[–] stickman38 (3346) 3 years ago

I have to disagree, I'd put BN ahead of LP.

BN is just a better film. But they're both entertaining movies. In fact, I'd have to put Hard8 ahead of LP but maybe slightly behind BN. LP's main character is a 15 year old but talks like he's 30. I found this part of the movie to be rather silly and when they get involved in the waterbed business, the film started to really lose it's edge. I mean, I know this was a thing back in the day, but this part of story was, quite frankly, just really dull.

Either way, Magnolia is still PTA's best movie.

[–] ecarle (14979) 3 years ago

I knew I was (am) taking a big risk in putting this theory( and that list) forward. But I just feel this good about Licorice Pizza and what PTA has accomplished here -- and how almost totally "positive" his worldview has become in this movie. It may not last, but its the emotional heart of the film that zoomed it to Number One for me. The other films, with the exception of Punch Drunk Love and the Reilly/Waters love story near the end of Magnolia-- are pretty cold at heart.

In some ways, I feel like Licorice Pizza should just exist apart and away from the other PTA films. Its like its a "one off" -- perhaps driven by his affection for Alana Haim and the rest of the Haim sisters...and their parents. As PTA said in some interview: Alana Haim became the 'magnet" for all these OTHER true stories PTA had collected over the years: about his friend the REAL Gary and his waterbed sales; about movie stars at the Tail of the Cock (William Holden, Steve McQueen and Evel Knievel were merged into one for that sequence with Penn); about PTA actually SEEING a teenage boy hit on an older woman in a school photographs line. Etc.

Magnolia and Boogie Nights come in right after Licorice Pizza. Again..."bigger" movies, but perhaps too savage in the case of Boogie Nights(the murders, the suicide, the beatings, the OD) and too indulgent in Magnolia(I love that movie but it does meander.)

At this point in time, I see Magnolia, Licorice Pizza and Boogie Nights as a kind of trilogy -- Punch Drunk Love and Inherent Vice are also of LA(and the Valley) but not quite so interconnected as "stories of a world."

There Will Be Blood, The Master, and Phantom Thread are kind of PTA's "Merchant Ivory Prestige Pictures" -- fully divorced from the LA/Valley universe of the other pictures. And again, I'm "objectively" naming There Will Be Blood as his "prestige best." But it sure wasn't as fun as Licorice Pizza.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 3 years ago

Punch Drunk Love is a nice love story too, but you've got Adam Sandler (always an acquired taste) at a phone booth threatening to kill his hated sister if she doesn't give him a phone number and Emily Watson telling Sandler she'd like to scoop his eyeballs out of his head and eat them. Gary and Alana are a bit more grounded.

--

A few connect points between Licorice Pizza and Boogie Nights.

I believe that they share only one cast member: John C. Reilly. And of course he's about a 10 second cameo in Licorice Pizza.

Both Gary and Alana in Licorice Pizza, and Wahlberg in Boogie Nights...find their vehicle to be running out of gas at a crucial moment of escape from a threatening villain (murderous Alfred Molina in BN; just nutty Bradley Cooper in LP). These two scenes seem to have been filmed on the same hillside roads with the same "color of night." A matched pair.

Gary so wonderfully hitting on and flirting with Alana at the beginning of LIcorice Pizza finds its odd match in Burt Reynolds carefully "seducing" Mark Wahlberg into the porn star lifestyle in the kitchen scene near the beginning of Boogie NIghts.

And...Magnolia WAS my favorite PTA movie until this shorter, nicer one came along. Love those frogs! Love that Aimee Mann.

[–] ecarle (14979) 3 years ago

waterbed business, the film started to really lose it's edge. I mean, I know this was a thing back in the day, but this part of story was, quite frankly, just really dull.

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I suppose so...its funny to remember that in the 70s, waterbeds were a "thing," even though they were very unwieldy to install and maintain. This could end up being the only "waterbed movie" to ever get a platform.

I love the waterbed angle for the two back to back scenes where Alana(in a bikini; that girl may have a plain face, but she has a great body) helps Gary open his waterbed store. In the afternoon , she gets visibly jealous over Gary's attention to an age-appropriate old flame ("I'm the manager here. Gary may I steal you away for a moment"). In the evening, as Gary's posse of boys prove adept at a rather listless but kinda sexy electric guitar session. Alana gets stoned, tries to show Gary her love for him (without saying it) gets (oddly enough) rejected by the boy who we thought loved her; and seductively kisses some random guy while in her bikini, for revenge. Then she returns to her "stunted" home of grown sisters living with their parents and her dominnering Old World immigrant father sees her in the bikini and notes: What the f00k?

The whole sequence -- three scenes, back to back, a lot of emotion, a bit of sexuality -- depends on the waterbed angle to play out.And the waterbed justifies the bikini.

But...I don't aim to convince anybody of anything. Still, I liked it.

[–] Lucia2016 (612) 2 years ago

Just finished this film and have similar thoughts to your list.
To be honest i just couldn't love The Master/There will be Blood and Phantom thread, beautifully made but too slow and boring.
Inherent Vice is one of my favourites i think i like it even more because it is not that well liked even amongst PTA fans it seems, it's looked at as his Death Proof (which i also love btw)

I put this film off because the synopsis looked a bit unoriginal and it had unknowns in the cast but i was drawn in quite quickly and i actually appreciated the cast i think the top directors should do it more, there is something that irritates me in say Scorsese or QT films when well known actors know they are in a Scorsese film and this is their chance to be in an iconic film they look like they are trying too hard, throws me off.
And i remembered that in Boogie Nights most of that all star cast were relative unknowns at that time, so i think they should do it more.

I've only just watched it for first time so i can't say it beats the classics yet but i definitely enjoyed it and will go back to it again, i am really grateful that we have got to see one more PTA film set in that universe as that is where he excels better than QT and Scorsese in my opinion he has the same amount of flair but he never over does it
Quick note was she supposed to be a mixed up girl with a heart of gold because she was calculating and coniving all the way through but Gary was always there for her and in the end she kind of gave up and settled for him. I am not 100 percent sure it was as sweet as people are making out.
you mentioned the end of Boogie Nights, i think that is supposed to be a downer ending that misleads you into thinking they are getting on in the world and there is hope for them but if you look closely, Roller Girl is just staring out of the window during exam, Reed is performing magic (in a strip club) Buck is selling stereo's but his plan is to give them away at discount and Dirk is trapped

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Just finished this film and have similar thoughts to your list.
To be honest i just couldn't love The Master/There will be Blood and Phantom thread, beautifully made but too slow and boring.

--
Yes...the point of my "ranking list" was to demonstrate that I think those three are just "apart" from the other, Los Angeles based stuff, which is more "fun" (if sometimes brutal or sick) and lively. My feeling is that there is within the film critic community a real "taste" for the kind of perfectly made, rather astringent, "art film" type filmaking that There Will Be Blood, The Master, and Phantom Thread represent...and so PTA scored instantly with the critics on those three.

PTA is , thus, rather a chameleon. With Licorice Pizza he "returned" to the look and feel of his first films, and THAT's the filmmmaker I enjoy.

That said, I was looking at clips of "There Will Be Blood" the other day and there were Paul Dano and DDL screaming away at each other in one of Dano's churches. So...more of the "caterwauling characters"(male and female) who seem to be a PTA trademark...and an irritant to me.

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CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Inherent Vice is one of my favourites i think i like it even more because it is not that well liked even amongst PTA fans it seems, it's looked at as his Death Proof (which i also love btw)

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I liked it. Individual scenes were funny and/or sexy, (Funny: Benecio Del Toro's "marine law lawyer" at the police station; sexy Katherine Waterson's nude scene) Josh Brolins cop Bigfoot was a great foil to Joaquin Phoenix's stoner Sam Spade and the general nostalgic connections to The Big Sleep, The Long Goodbye and The Big Lebowski worked in the film's favor, as if it were "quasi sequel."

And if it didn't make much sense? These things rarely do.

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NEXT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

I put this film off because the synopsis looked a bit unoriginal and it had unknowns in the cast but i was drawn in quite quickly and i actually appreciated the cast i think the top directors should do it more, there is something that irritates me in say Scorsese or QT films when well known actors know they are in a Scorsese film and this is their chance to be in an iconic film they look like they are trying too hard, throws me off.

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Well, thank's to PTA's terrific dialogue and atmosheric direction, both Alana Haim and Cooper Hoffman were able to create characters that we CARED about, right from their first, great pick up scene together. Ms. Haim has something very classic in Hollywood history: a "plain" face that can look quite beautiful from the right angle(conversely, a flaw like bags under the eyes that are endearing on her.) And though PTA wanted to make Alana a star and praised her beauty, I expect that the smart director in him realized that Alana Haim's lack of "perfect prettiness" (as seen in a few of the other young actresses in the film) made her both sympathetic and understandable in her willingness to "hang" with a 15 year old "boy man."

Many reviews linked Cooper Hoffman's looks and mannerisms to that of his late father, but I think he had some "new and different" things to sell: a cuter face("thanks, Mom"), a very positive character to play, a certain heroic quality his dad was rarely alllowed to project. In short: very likeable -- and ALWAYS the guy that Alana SHOULD be with. (Which makes the age difference the true single obstacle in the story and one that is overcome at the end. Its only against the law to have sex; friendship and kissing and loving are OK.)

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CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

And i remembered that in Boogie Nights most of that all star cast were relative unknowns at that time, so i think they should do it more.

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Indeed they were. Its tricky to use "all unknowns," but it worked with Dazed and Confused. (Matthew McConaghey, Ben Affleck and Parker Posey emerged, yes?)

Licorice Pizza "cheats" a bit with two "star" cameos: Sean Penn and Bradley Cooper. Penn's a two time Oscar winner(one wasn't deserved) but not much at the box office; Cooper is a star but not a fully charismatic one. Still...they were names.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

I've only just watched it for first time so i can't say it beats the classics yet

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I'm not sure it beats the classics, either but -- I like it the best, and I for one, am heartened that a filmmaker could do something that good this late in the game. There's nobody this likeable in Boogie Nights and I always felt that Magnolia could use a trim.

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but i definitely enjoyed it and will go back to it again, i am really grateful that we have got to see one more PTA film set in that universe as that is where he excels better than QT and Scorsese in my opinion he has the same amount of flair but he never over does it

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An interesting point. Some articles and joint interviews have positioned PTA and QT as "Los Angeles area peer filmmakers" but QT is a bigger hit make. I think "Once Upon a Time in Hollywood"(set over the hilll and four years earlier than Licorice Pizza) made four times as much AS Licorice Pizza. Leo, Brad, Margot and Al may have had something to do with that -- but also, PTA is more of a "dramatic art film maker." QT still does violent thriller/Western entertainment.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Quick note was she supposed to be a mixed up girl with a heart of gold because she was calculating and conniving all the way through but Gary was always there for her and in the end she kind of gave up and settled for him. I am not 100 percent sure it was as sweet as people are making out.

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Well, she was "complex." How sweet she could be sometimes and how raging she could be the rest of the time suggested a bi-polar issue to me, but in the end, she was a good person "where it counts."

As for "settling" for Gary -- BOTH characters spend the whole movie trying to "honor" their age difference by getting with more appropriate romances(or in her case, OLDER romances) but the movie makes the point that all great love stories do: Gary and Alana are meant for each other. No man on screen(for her) or woman on screen(for him) can REALLY compete.

So, no Alana doesn't belong with the atheist young actor(who seemed to be cast well with a smarmy-faced guy you couldn't like, even when he was polite), or the famous old movie star who drinks too much and doesn't notice Alana, or the young male politician who turns out to be a closeted gay.

Is it conniving that Alana rather threw herself at those guys, or simply how women have always tried to get ahead, whether they had their own skills or not. The only "rational" male choice for Alana (age appropriate, not messed up) is Brian at the campaign HQ. They almost share a kiss and he seems like the best match for Alana...but she still chooses Gary. Perhaps Brian is too tied to the secrets and lies of the Joel Wachs campaign.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

you mentioned the end of Boogie Nights, i think that is supposed to be a downer ending that misleads you into thinking they are getting on in the world and there is hope for them but if you look closely, Roller Girl is just staring out of the window during exam, Reed is performing magic (in a strip club) Buck is selling stereo's but his plan is to give them away at discount and Dirk is trapped

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Yes, I can't say that Boogie Nights REALLY had a happy ending. It sort of has a "fake" happy ending. The survivors are all "friends and family" again; the music is calm, Burt Reynolds looks content...but yes, NONE of these people seem to have a shot at mainstream American happiness(MAYBE Buck and his wife and child.)

Burt Reynolds got his only Oscar nomination(Supporting) for Boogie Nights but still went on record as not liking the movie or the experience of making it. Mainly he hated his character, and I think his quote was meaningful "The character didn't respect women. I don't like men who don't respect women." Fair enough.

[–] Lucia2016 (612) 2 years ago

Wow what a thorough response you left no stone unturned.

You made some good points there ill try to check off a few,

That said, I was looking at clips of "There Will Be Blood" the other day and there were Paul Dano and DDL screaming away at each other in one of Dano's churches. So...more of the "caterwauling characters"(male and female) who seem to be a PTA trademark...and an irritant to me.

Yeah you could argue there are bits of that in Magnolia but i still class that as one of his top tier films but still that is probably the difference between that and the superior Boogy Nights in that BN has that bit of levity with more funny characters and upbeat soundtrack to gloss over the underlying tragedy, it works better IMO.

Inherent Vice i do actually think makes sense i am not saying i understood it 100% but the answers are definitely there woven in to this weird David Lynch style confusing dreamy film. It's not just a random spoofy type film IMO.

'Many reviews linked Cooper Hoffman's looks and mannerisms to that of his late father'

I had no idea going in about the plot or cast but did wonder when i saw the name Hoffman and i just thought immediately what a classy and sweet touch that was to bring him into the film. That is just the right ammount of sentiment to me there is something sad and poetic about that and truly respectful from Anderson to honour his legacy.

Licorice Pizza "cheats" a bit with two "star" cameos: Sean Penn and Bradley Cooper. Penn's a two time Oscar winner(one wasn't deserved) but not much at the box office; Cooper is a star but not a fully charismatic one. Still...they were names.

But Penn seems basically retired now and hasn't been in the spotlight for a while so seeing him come back and in great form was one of the highlights of the film and added prestige, having a legend resets the balance from the rookies and reminds you we are not just fucking around mind.

[–] Lucia2016 (612) 2 years ago

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Wow what a thorough response you left no stone unturned.

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Well, it seemed OK to take it other places. I honestly think that Licorice Pizza is so overall "nice and happy" that it puts the rest of PTA's canon in a different place: those earlier movies are much more mean and cold. And everybody's yelling(even in Punch Drunk Love, the "closest" to LP in love story tone.)

And suddenly one has to look to see how those other movies PREDICT Licorice Pizza. I daresay the age difference thing is where PTA made this movie a bit "radical." It took on some attacks and is graded as "sick" in some circles. Not mine. But you can see it as a cross-reference to Boogie Nights. As someone noted, "enterpreneurs" Gary and Alana a few years after 1973 just might end up seduced by Burt Reynolds into "porno world" too. Its in their (literal )neighborhood.A queasy thought, but there it is (maybe they would just work on the business side.)

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You made some good points there ill try to check off a few,

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Please.

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That said, I was looking at clips of "There Will Be Blood" the other day and there were Paul Dano and DDL screaming away at each other in one of Dano's churches. So...more of the "caterwauling characters"(male and female) who seem to be a PTA trademark...and an irritant to me.

Yeah you could argue there are bits of that in Magnolia but i still class that as one of his top tier films but still that is probably the difference between that and the superior Boogy Nights in that BN has that bit of levity with more funny characters and upbeat soundtrack to gloss over the underlying tragedy, it works better IMO.

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Yes...I like Magnolia a bit better than Boogie Nights for its rather "epic sweep" and superstar Tom Cruise showing up to give the whole project his approval(and good work.)

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Boogie Nights had style to burn, but it was the subject matter that got adults into the theater(and I'll bet some teens watching it on cable, too.) The film is fun enough in Part One(the 70's) but surely goes off the cliff into darkness and violence in Part Two(the 80s.) It is almost TOO neat, the mark of a new young director. But it made its splash.

Inherent Vice i do actually think makes sense i am not saying i understood it 100% but the answers are definitely there woven in to this weird David Lynch style confusing dreamy film. It's not just a random spoofy type film IMO.

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'Many reviews linked Cooper Hoffman's looks and mannerisms to that of his late father'

I had no idea going in about the plot or cast but did wonder when i saw the name Hoffman and i just thought immediately what a classy and sweet touch that was to bring him into the film. That is just the right ammount of sentiment to me there is something sad and poetic about that and truly respectful from Anderson to honour his legacy.

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Yes. I"ve mentioned elsewhere that PTA and pretty-in-a-funny way Alana Haim volunteered for the brunt of promotion. Hoffman showed up for one interview where (witih PTA next to him) he was asked point blank about his father's death. Hoffman grabbed his own coat lapel defensively and PTA gallantly jumped in to answer. I don't think Hoffman did many more interviews with risk, after that.

Bradley Cooper did some press -- and a group Zoom call -- and helped promote the movie a bit.

But Sean Penn -- did nothing to promote the movie. This maintained his mystery, I guess, ala Nicholson back in the day.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Licorice Pizza "cheats" a bit with two "star" cameos: Sean Penn and Bradley Cooper. Penn's a two time Oscar winner(one wasn't deserved) but not much at the box office; Cooper is a star but not a fully charismatic one. Still...they were names.

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But Penn seems basically retired now and hasn't been in the spotlight for a while so seeing him come back and in great form was one of the highlights of the film and added prestige, having a legend resets the balance from the rookies and reminds you we are not just fucking around mind.

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Yes. Anyway you cut it, Penn is a two-time Best Actor Oscar winner and respected in his field, if a bit tempestuous and mysterious. He's the last guy I would have figured to cast as William Holden(under another name) but he got certain things right (no doubt with help from PTA and crew): the stylish haircut, the expensive sportcoat and tie; the martinis and even an old time movie star's greeting to a director: "Come over here you son of a bitch from hell!" Not very witty, just movie starrish.

I think the real "sneak" of Penn's casting is that he harkens back to a film that PTA said inspired Licorice Pizza; Fast Times at Ridgemont High, also set in the San Fernando Valley(the Licorice Pizza record store can be seen at the mall), back in the 80s, and featuring Sean Penn as SPICOLI, the wasted surfer dude. Look at him now!

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Inherent Vice i do actually think makes sense i am not saying i understood it 100% but the answers are definitely there woven in to this weird David Lynch style confusing dreamy film. It's not just a random spoofy type film IMO.

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I liked it and I remembered that it made ENOUGH sense -- in the same shaggy dog way of The Big Sleep, The Long Goodbye, and The Big Lewbowski. It carried their vibe, but the root novel went different places.

There's a clip on YouTube of Joaquin(as the stoner PI) and Benicio Del Toro(as his lawyer) and cop Brolin meet in Brolin's office to discuss the case, with Del Toro acting all tough and getting deflated:

Del Toro: Well, sergeant, what's the beef here with my client?
Brolin: Isn't your specialty marine law? We've got some good charges here for murder and kidnapping, but I guess we could throw in pirates...

Always makes me laugh.

CONT

[–] ecarle (14979) 2 years ago

Lol totally agree on Bradley Cooper is this a wide held opinion or not because it amazes me how he is so prominent he is a very unlikeable actor to me, kind of handsome but not in same league as the ones before him he is just very bland and he tries too hard to come off as interesting, one of the few actors out there i really dislike for some reason.

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Same goes for me -- not that it bothers HIM. He's following in a long tradition of young white male leads -- some break out immediately(Cruise, Pitt); some take time to age(Jeff Bridges, Kurt Russell), some don't quite make it(Jeff Daniels, Josh Hartnett). Cooper seems to have gone beyond his limits due to great luck(and preparation): in Eastwood's megahit American Sniper(so everybody "met" him), then paired with Lady Gaga in that great "husband on the way down role" in A Star is Born.

He's got weird eyes. He made more sense as a smarmy villain in "Wedding Crashers." (And he's a bit of a villain as nutcase Jon Peters in LP.)

Oscar season put Bradley Cooper in two contenders -- Licorice Pizza and Nightmare Alley -- but neither movie really made much money(even my beloved LP...just not much of a hit at all.) This in turn put him "front and center" in a COVID-sparse front section at the Oscars, and there when Will Smith "did the slap." Some people get all the luck.

I don't wish Bradley Cooper ill. Hollywood is famously a tough town and his 2022 films did not hit big. Still, he'll land if things go wrong -- streaming is waiting. (Plus: maybe an Oscar ahead, right now he's playing conducter Leonard Bernstein and LOOKS JUST LIKE HIM in gray wig.)