First half was good; second half was whiny emo
Ugh why is everyone so happy? Can't they see how meaningless things are? I'm so much better than everyone because I do.
sharei liked the first half better.
the sister when she is younger is perfecto.
ethan hawke at the bowling alley
the camping trip
later in the movie...junky college girlfriends i cant stand that always look like they smell and have clammy skin. plus i hate college aged young adult conversations. yucko yucko. stop it and become the capitalist you will be in 5 years.
great movie, ethan, patricia and the sister. bravo!
I was closin in on another BarBarian!
Hated the sister character all through the film ... whiney, nasty, rude etc etc. For me, best character was Ethan's.
shareI thought Mason was just fine too until he was around 14 and turned into a stick-in-the-mud emo hipster.
shareYou are carping on a movie on the internet. Talk about a stick-in-the-mud. Plus you are probably over 14, so you don't even have that excuse.
shareI didn't realise that we weren't allowed to have opinions, on a MESSAGE BOARD... We're all here, and fawning over a movie is just as bad, so what's your excuse?
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Oh you can have an opinion. Especially you!
I was pointing out the irony that the PP was hanging out on the internet griping about some kid who doesn't have a life (whiny, emo) when the PP is being 'whiny and emo' as well. This whole thread is about people whining and griping about someone who is 'whining and griping.' I imagine they are a whole lot more like Mason than I am.
But far less interesting than Mason.
Expressing dissatisfaction or discontent is not the same as 'whining' - especially when using text...
Nuance is important. I say this as somebody who loved the movie overall, but did think the main character became a little melodramatic... I don't think that such binary thinking or dividing people into camps is at all helpful; we all have variances in opinion because we are all different.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Sorry, but calling someone an 'emo hipster' is not about having a different opinion. It is pure snark aimed at trivializing sincere feelings.
And I do think you are very much wrong about Mason becoming melodramatic. Now that is an example of having a different opinion!
I would say he didn't react strongly at all, which came from years of putting distance between what he thought and how he expressed himself. Melodrama would have him slamming doors, throwing a tantrum or sobbing or screaming. His reactions to much of what he encountered were fairly subtle - in fact too much so for some of the film's detractors. His girlfriend described him as gloomy, but melodramatic was not part of how he reacted to things.
It MAY be an unfair characterisation (I don't think so) and/or an exaggeration (again, I don't think so) but those are still valid labels... New terms come into the language because they express feelings that were difficult to pin down, before. You may think they're dismissive, and you're entitled to that, but to others (me, and possibly the other poster you snapped at) they're just shorthand.
"Trivializing sincere feelings" of a fictional character???! I'm sure that no offence was caused, given that HE DOESN'T EXIST... He may have been based on somebody real, but we weren't taking shots at the actor. YOU might be offended, but if anything, you're trivializing our sincere feelings by implying that we shouldn't speak about a movie character in a certain way... I certainly feel that that's what I'm implicitly being told - and although I share your love for the film, I adamantly reject it... You're being a little hypocritical; these are my "sincere feelings".
Everybody's entitled to a different opinion - mine was "melodrama", and I'm not the only one... All I'm saying is, give people space to share opposing views. Coming onto a message board and implying that people who post negative interpretations are defective in some way, yet people who post positive ones are A-OK, is something which spectacularly lacks self-awareness, and stifles healthy debate. I love the film like you do, but all I've seen so far is you praising people who post positive feedback, but acting defensive towards anybody who might have criticism to offer.
If you're happy with the impression you give off, then that's cool - but you don't seem to treat others the way you want to be treated, yourself.
Gloom is 'melodrama', to me - just because you don't have the energy to be expressive doesn't mean that you aren't (or in this case, he wasn't) letting situations affect him way more than he should... Sure, that's part of being a teenager, and therefore fairly accurate... but it still didn't make it enjoyable for me to watch.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
"Trivializing sincere feelings" of a fictional character???! I'm sure that no offence was caused, given that HE DOESN'T EXIST...
It is unfortunate that there is no Nobel Prize for Film Criticism, because this insight would have clinched it for you.
The sincerity is based not only on what the character feels, but on how the audience can either identify personally or at least understand where the character is coming from: even if the character is confused, gloomy, distrustful, depressed, or apathetic. It is very dismissive to reduce these traits as simply "whiny emo" considering the disappointment he had when he faced some very adult situations that he was not ready for. That these situations can be so common should serve to make the film even more important.
From the evidence, I would say that most people hurling these epithets at Mason (news flash - a fictional character) share more of these traits than they would ever be willing to admit. Except instead of being fictional, these folks are all too real.
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It is unfortunate that there is no Nobel Prize for Film Criticism, because this insight would have clinched it for you.
There you go again; complaining about snark, and yet taking every opportunity to indulge in it, yourself... There IS a Pulitzer, but that's OK, since I'm not self-important enough to be angling for one. If it's so obvious, then I'm surprised I've had to spell it out for you, since you still haven't explained why trivialising the feelings of a fictional character actually matters, if no one is hurt by it? (apart from you, seemingly... )
how the audience can either identify personally or at least understand where the character is coming from: even if the character is confused, gloomy, distrustful, depressed, or apathetic.
OK then; well in this regard, it failed, for me... He kept repeating the patterns of behaviour so often that I began to lose patience with him. I have no sympathy for those who won't help themselves. If you say that's dismissive, then fine, I'll own it. I'd probably be more supportive of a real person, but again, he's not real, so my annoyance flares quicker.
That these situations can be so common should serve to make the film even more important.
Nonsense. Losing a parent is common - but that doesn't mean that every film which depicts grief should be applauded; it's all to do with how well it is handled, and I thought this could've been handled better.
From the evidence, I would say that most people hurling these epithets at Mason (news flash - a fictional character) share more of these traits than they would ever be willing to admit. Except instead of being fictional, these folks are all too real.
From the evidence, I would say that you are projecting; that you identify with the character of Mason so much, that you perceive any attack on him to be an attack on YOU. It isn't, or wasn't meant to be... I'm sure you're a lovely person - at least, when you aren't being confrontational...
However, critiquing the behaviour of fictional characters is what these boards are FOR. If somebody wants to call the character a "whiny emo", that's their prerogative, and they shouldn't be shamed for it... Those aren't the words I'd use, but I do sympathise with the description!
The issue I have is that you responded to the insult of a fictional character by insulting a REAL person! I know which sin I find more grievous, and if you can't see how the latter is so much worse than the former, then perhaps civilised conversation just isn't your forte.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!" share
He kept repeating the patterns of behaviour so often that I began to lose patience with him. I have no sympathy for those who won't help themselves.
First, he is eighteen years old at the end of the film just starting college, and has shown interest in a profession. He had a job in high school. I am not sure exactly what you mean when you say he won't help himself. What, exactly, do you want him to do? Surf the 'net putting down fictional characters for not being better? Sounds lame to me.
Losing a parent is common.
I don't recall him losing a parent in the movie. They were both still alive when the movie ended. If you are talking about divorce, then I don't think he was damaged by divorce. He started becoming puzzled by what adults around him said that didn't make any sense. When that turned ugly, he maintained distance between what he thought and how he expressed himself. I do not think this is necessarily a bad thing, and in fact I think he showed a lot of strength and maturity in the face of potentially difficult situations that could have resulted in a lot of unnecessary pain. By the time that Jim started to assert any kind of 'perenting', he just shrugged it off. Drama averted, the opposite of whiny and emo.
I think you have patently misunderstood this movie, and all those folks calling him whiny and emo are showing their own lack of depth. All they understand is that they do not see themselves like Mason, which in my opinion is all in Mason's favor.
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'Defending fictional characters' is equally lame; that was my point... None of us here are exactly overachievers, and you're just the same, except on the opposite side.
Nobody lost a parent in the movie; it was just an example to rebut your claim that if a movie shows something that happens often, then it must mean that that movie is important.
I think you have patently misunderstood this movie, and all those folks calling him whiny and emo are showing their own lack of depth.
... and I think that you can't accept any reading of a movie that clashes with your own view, so we're even.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!" share
There are certain things I like about Mason and certain things I don't, but all of that is beside the point. I don't have to like him for it to be a great film, just like I don't have to like Hamlet for it to be a great play. The movie is great because of its themes.
However, calling Mason melodramatic is absurd, once you understand the meaning of the word.
Anyway, my opinion is that folks who think that all of the critics got the movie wrong are simply griping about something they don't understand, and their resulting writings on this board do not stand up to even mild scrutiny.
I don't have to like him for it to be a great film, just like I don't have to like Hamlet for it to be a great play. The movie is great because of its themes.
I agree, and I do think it's a great film... I've never said otherwise.
However, calling Mason melodramatic is absurd, once you understand the meaning of the word.
I disagree, and I've explained why. My understanding of the word is perfectly adequate.
Anyway, my opinion is that folks who think that all of the critics got the movie wrong are simply griping about something they don't understand, and their resulting writings on this board do not stand up to even mild scrutiny.
You're entitled to your opinion, but if you cannot even conceive of a contrary argument, then your perspective is a pretty narrow one.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!" share
Oh, I can conceive of a contrary opinion. For example, if people don't like the movie because it has no plot, then I totally see that it is not for everyone. I would say the vast majority of the film's detractors fall into this category.
If people say it has no meaning, I have, countless times, not even argued with them but cut and pasted my ideas about the meaning of the movie:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1065073/board/thread/240989390
But I'd like to hear what you think of the meaining of 'melodramatic' and examples of Mason's melodrama.
But I'd like to hear what you think of the meaning of 'melodramatic' and examples of Mason's melodrama.
I've already told you, so either you skipped over it the first time around, or didn't feel like addressing it, then:
You said that because Mason wasn't "slamming doors or throwing a tantrum", he wasn't melodramatic - but you did allow that he was occasionally 'gloomy and distrustful' (qualities that I thought made him unlikeable, when he exhibited them) ... So I responded thus:
Gloom is 'melodrama', to me - just because you don't have the energy to be expressive doesn't mean that you aren't (or in this case, he wasn't) letting situations affect him way more than he should... Sure, that's part of being a teenager, and therefore fairly accurate... but it still didn't make it enjoyable for me to watch.
That's my interpretation. It might not be one you share, and if you have a different take on things then good luck to you - I would never tell anyone they have to see things a certain way... but those are MY feelings, and you saying that they are incorrect won't change my mind.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!" share
Being gloomy is not melodrama under any definition that I've seen. So go ahead and start coming up with your own definition for things, don't worry about making sense.
Just because you can't conceive of it doesn't mean there isn't truth in it (it also doesn't mean that there IS - but then, I'm not asking anyone else to agree).
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Another point; it might have meaning to YOU, (and indeed, it does to me, on a personal level... ) but "meaning" is subjective - so if it doesn't have meaning for them, then that's perfectly fine, too...
You seem to have a severe case of 'everyone who disagrees with me is wrong'... Pretty dogmatic of you!
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
If you read my link, you'd see that I think not every film is for everyone. Which is why I don't go on imdb tearing down movies that I don't understand. I also don't respond to many of the undebatable opinions (the hatred for Patricia Arquette).
I just can't help smiling when whiny, emo people complain about how whiny and emo Mason is.
"Meaning is subjective." Is someone forcing you to post in clichés; or are you doing this on your own?
It's an onerous enough task reading and responding to what you're writing HERE - as if I'm going to click on a link and voluntarily subject myself to more of your screed? Not a chance.
Nobody is "tearing down" anything; they're just giving their opinion. You aren't required to agree with it, but a civil person doesn't bully someone for speaking out.
Is someone forcing you to be hostile? Nope - it's just you. You're being thoroughly unpleasant. Nobody has insulted YOU. All we've done is shared our perceptions of a fictional creation, and yet you have consistently made it personal. We aren't fictional, we are REAL, and that is the difference that you're refusing to acknowledge.
Cliches become cliches because they contain a nub of truth that lots of people respond to... I'm sorry you aren't one of them.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
You are compelled to respond to me, yet you can't bring yourself to read what I have to say about the themes of the movie.
Yup, I guess that's typical. I don't mind being hostile to behavior like that.
I'm responding to what you've said to me because it's polite not to just ignore things which are addressed to you... However, judging by your conduct throughout this conversation, it's evident that you don't know much about politeness... I'll stop when you stop giving me things to address.
If you want me to read something, then copy and paste it here; I'm not going elsewhere... This is not a treasure-hunt.
Besides, as I keep repeating, your opinions don't vex me. You're entitled to your opinions and I'm sure they are well thought out... It's your insults towards people who have a different view that I find galling.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Clicking on a link is not a "treasure hunt." Typical cowardly lying that trolls do. You have become completely unserious at this point.
shareWhat else would you call following a trail to get to information? Why not just paste it here, and then all the relevant detail is in the same place?
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Perhaps you have not noticed, but folks use links all the time rather than cut and paste everything. It tends to be easier on everyone. I suppose you'll have to trust me on that, but the more words, the better it is just to provide a link for those who are truly interested,
However, since you asked so nicely, here is the entirety of my post:
No matter what I say, if you don’t relate to the movie Boyhood, I’m afraid it will be lost on you. However, I will take some time to explain to you why I related to it, found it intensely gripping, and why I agree with every major film critic.
The movie starts off looking in Mason’s face regarding the world around him. Pretty soon, as we see that his world is in dysfunction, the camera’s peering is expecting a reaction. The conversation with his dad about why he has not been present in his life has Mason ask a couple of questions, but as soon as we hear dad’s unconvincing answers, the questions stop and the puzzling expression on Mason’s face begins.
As the years go by seamlessly, we see the camera continue to search for clues to what Mason is thinking and the distance between what he thinks and how he expresses himself. At this point I was already hooked by the movie as I think this is a crucial part of psychological development, and I see it in my own children.
As Mason gets older, he has internalized his pain and has become gloomy, in the words of his girlfriend. Still, he also matures and sees the ridiculousness of the adults and social structure around him. He develops a bit of a wry smile, and gathers some strength from the idea that the adults can no longer push him around.
The distance between what you think and how you express yourself is monumental in your development, and how you handle that difference makes up your ‘boyhood.’
Yes, I hung on every word of this movie, and clearly I was not alone. Every glance, every dramatic gesture, every scene became a kind of incubator, rife with tension, danger or discovery. Texting while driving, throwing a circular saw blade, disapproval, sulking, firearms, bullying, all of it had some excitement bubbling under the surface.
One of my favorite scenes is the “15th birthday“ scene you can watch on You Tube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92IZH6YaJKQ
Look at Ellar’s acting, it is stellar. Very subtle, but after he asks his girlfriend for some gum, he gives a nervous glance to the house, he gives his girlfriend a raise of the eyebrow and a tight smile when he gets the gum. He walks in with some trepidation, closing the door very quietly and moving slowly into the room when his mother sees him and smiles. He is trying not to get noticed, not to have anyone smell his breath, not to upset the scene. His latest ’dad’ asks him what time it is, and when he says his line, “like uh 12:15” he gives a look like he isn’t going to care if someone gives him crap. When the guy says ”Happy Birthday” we see the sense of relief on his face with also a sheepish grin. He is high this whole time, but doesn’t want to announce it. His mom asks: Have you been drinking?” he responds “have you?” with a wry smile. He has a good point, and he knows it, and that’s what’s on his face. This is a gorgeous scene of him handling himself maturely in a situation which could have lead to some unnecessary drama and more psychic harm.
There are some people who decry the ‘gimmick’ of the movie. First, ‘gimmick’ is the incorrect word. Why? Because you are using the pejorative, it says more about you and your attitude than the subject. If you want to talk about the idea of the film in a more neutral way, I would say the production of the film has a central conceit. You can either like or dislike the conceit, but unfortunately the use of the word ‘gimmick’ is immature.
So what do I make of the central conceit, does it matter to show the camera peering into those same faces all this time? Yes, I do think it matters and has a profound effect on the film. The reality of the time passing gives weight to how the character of Mason has developed, over time. The fictional character went through a years-long process just like the boy. And I find this very moving in a way that a conventional production could not be, where every thing is pre-planned from day one. It is not a real-time production period (since they only filmed a week at a time), but the character had a real time gestation. That is not the pejorative ‘gimmick’ but something we can actually sense in the movie. A years-long maturing of perspective. Not simply through calculated moves, but through a natural progression.
Thanks for reading. If you can’t relate to the film, I understand. There are films I can't relate to, but then I don’t insist I am right. In the face of tremendous praise, I realize the fault is mine if I am left out in the cold.
Thank you. I liked your opinion. I particularly agreed with you about 'gestation', as I think it allows for subtle shifts not present in conventional films…
However, I have already said that it was never your opinion I had a problem with, but rather the way you treat people who express theirs in a less poetic way than you do… Their view may lack the sophistication of yours, but it is still valid.
"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
Fair enough.
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"Your mother puts license plates in your underwear? How do you sit?!"
I thought Mason was just fine too until he was around 14 and turned into a stick-in-the-mud emo hipster.
Sadly that's how it sometimes happens in real life. You can be a cool kid one minute and an emo pretentious know-it-all teenager the next. I'm sure parents know first hand how their kids can change over night.
That being said I agree I liked when they were kids much better in the first half than the college years.
-Di share