MovieChat Forums > Angels & Demons (2009) Discussion > 'Ambigram: the same read backwards and f...

'Ambigram: the same read backwards and forwards.'


And then he (Hanks) flips it upside down. A palindrome can be read backwards and forwards the same; an ambigram can be read the same right side up and upside down. (Facepalm). Such a stupid mistake, so early on in the movie.



Edited to fix typo in title.

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Also the lead is a "symbologist"! WTF?

There are many semioticians - most famously, Umberto Eco - but I've never struck a 'symbologist' let alone a Professor thereof.

I suspect Dan Brown had such a low opinion of his readers, that he decided it was best not to risk confusing them with unusual words like 'semiotics', even if it made his writing look silly/sillier.

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Also the lead is a "symbologist"! WTF?
:D Nice catch! I had a quick look at the goofs again, and it seems this one hasn't made the (long) list yet, so you could submit it to Imdb. They took the ambigram one, so if you care enough to correct...

You know, I actually liked Brown, and Angels and demons more so than the Da Vince code (my brother worked on his Phd in Cern at the time, he gave us the books before they became world famous). But reading an old article in Vanity Fair about Lewis Perdue's claims to Brown's plagiarism was off putting, to say the least. Here's the link to a thread where this was talked about. Let me know if you want to read the article, the scans are buried in one of my posts but I can't find it right now. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1467010/board/flat/157294624?d=174815175&am p;p=1#174815175

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Given my diffidence towards spiritual issues and religion, Dan Brown was always going to have a tough time getting me (and the other five, like-minded humans) to like his books. Still, I did read The Da Vinci Code because it caused such a stir when it was released. (I remember it well, because it was the first electronic book I ever purchased and read at a computer and I still have back-ache to prove it! Now I have an iPad, so ebooks are not such a painful experience.)

Personally I don't like Dan Brown's writing; he reminds me too much of extremely dilute Umberto Eco, but without the depth of references and the ability to make me empathise with his characters. (Eco's Foucault's Pendulum was at least partly a satire of the whole The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail argument, that Dan Brown based his first book on.)

Worse, about halfway through The Da Vinci Code, some vague memories of a BBC documentary - and Foucault's Pendulum - stirred, so I even anticipated the rough outline of the ending.

I hadn't heard mention of the further accusations of plagiarism until your post, so I'll do some Googling about Perdue. Thanks for the link: plagiarism is always a serious business, but in this case, with such vast sums of money involved, it's doubly so.

Clearly, a lot of people do enjoy Brown's novels and screenplays, and the last thing I'd want to do is diminish that enjoyment, even if it were within my ability.

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Still, I did read The Da Vinci Code because it caused such a stir when it was released.
Somehow, it makes me not want to read a book if it becomes a phenomenon in its own right. Doesn't make sense really, but I started the Harry Potter books eg years after they had gone global. And then I was hooked all the same!
Personally I don't like Dan Brown's writing; he reminds me too much of extremely dilute Umberto Eco, but without the depth of references and the ability to make me empathise with his characters. (Eco's Foucault's Pendulum was at least partly a satire of the whole The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail argument, that Dan Brown based his first book on.)
Confession time: I've never read an Eco. The film The name of the rose came out when I was still a child, and after that reading the book seemed pointless since the outcome was known already. Plus, didn't reviews say that he became less readable after a while? Sort of like the Silmarillion after The lord of the rings. But now I feel like missing out; which of his books would you recommend I start with? And about Dan Brown: there were rumblings early on that he had massive help from his wife http://bit.ly/nENCm0, a historian I think. Translators for The lost symbol said they detected large chunks of the text had a completely different syntax, which could point to ghostwriters. Honestly, I could care less, if the book were good (since the ghostwriters, if true, would be paid for their services).
Worse, about halfway through The Da Vinci Code, some vague memories of a BBC documentary - and Foucault's Pendulum - stirred, so I even anticipated the rough outline of the ending.
Holy ****. This is getting worse and worse. Thanks for the info, and reminding me of Eco :)
I hadn't heard mention of the further accusations of plagiarism until your post, so I'll do some Googling about Perdue. Thanks for the link: plagiarism is always a serious business, but in this case, with such vast sums of money involved, it's doubly so.
Agreed, that's what bothered me about it too. There were other people accusing Brown of plagiarism, but he fought them off successfully in court. Their names are out there, but Perdue's is not. Btw, did you read how the judge who gave the verdict in the other cases made it into a little mystery novel, clues and all, just like one of Brown's books? Cute huh. As for Perdue: my post and/or the thread where I posted the links to the scans of the VF article have since been deleted it seems, so here they are again: for anyone who cares to know the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. After reading both books, my conclusion was that Brown was far superior in his writing and that his book absolutely was the more enjoyable, but that he took (at least part of) the basic premise and plot from Perdue. That is plagiarism, and like you said, especially in this case it stings.

VF article, in hopefully the right order:
http://bit.ly/nYuiCk
http://bit.ly/oYhmPs
http://bit.ly/pH6v6T
http://bit.ly/qX519p
http://bit.ly/neH0Ll
http://bit.ly/nngQiH
http://bit.ly/qIqZ8l
http://bit.ly/rqjvuj
http://bit.ly/nEsCV7
http://bit.ly/qxw2nH
http://bit.ly/obQnOU

Btw, and absolutely OT: may I ask what the best book you've ever read is? (Sorry to go so ot, but: other Imdb-readers, feel free to join in. I want to know what you are reading too! ) For me, it would have to be The quincunx by Charles Palliser. At 1200 pages a staunch read, but once you're hooked (say, after the first 100 pages or so) I dare you to put it away for a longer period of time. A friend to whom I gave this book for his birthday was equally under its spell. I'm just curious what your all time fave is...

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Sorry for the delay in replying: the reason will be clear towards the end.

Regarding Eco, I thought Foucault's Pendulum was just as readable as The Name of the Rose. although that might have been because I was staying in a 15th C Spanish college, with four metre high rosy crosses painted on the walls of the stone corridors, not far from one of the oldest surviving Knights Templar temples in Europe. (I really would read The Name of the Rose even if you've seen the film. Books are a pleasure in themselves, IMO.)

I don't think there's any question that Brown based The Da Vinci Code on the (allegedly factual) book The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail, and it sounds like he borrowed heavily from Perdue, but I suspect plagiarism is hard to prove; unless Perdue could point to complete paragraphs that Brown had copied, verbatim, from his book, it's not strictly plagiarism; it's just immoral.

Again, thanks for the links.

Regarding my all time favourite book, I've been thinking about this, on and off, for days, and I simply cannot name one; worse, when I've re-read novels (e.g. The Magus or Knut Hamsun's Hunger) they sometimes seem totally unlike what I remembered from the first pass, so I suspect my taste changes a lot.

That said, I can't say a bad thing about Mervyn Peake's Gormenghast trilogy [0]: nobody has succeeded in making a good film from these books, 'though the BBC did try with some success. Peake's books are a fanciful metaphor for the decay of Great Britain, but if you like pure fantasy I'd suggest Perdido Street Station. If you like historical fiction, Imprimatur by Rita Monaldi is worth reading.

Actually, I just may have an all-time favourite, which I know isn't as good as classics like 1984 or Dr. Faustus by Marlowe, etc. etc., and that is Against Nature [1] by J.K. Huysmans - a novel about a wealthy French aesthete who, tired of life, retreats to a house with his books and artifacts. I know this sounds dreadful, but it is one of the strangest (well, apart from Maldoror [2] which is unhinged) and most fascinating books that I've read. The fact that it's been in publication for 120 years has to say something in its favour. (I wish I could read French so that I didn't have to rely on translations.)

[0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gormenghast_series
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/À_rebours
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Les_Chants_de_Maldoror

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Thank you so much for your kind suggestions, Simon! Definitely will start with Eco and The name of the rose (you're right of course, there's a reason films come after the books they are based on). That 15th Century Spanish college sounds amazing btw, I'm totally jellus.

About the other titles you mention: it's a sad fact that none of these rang a bell with me. Then again, it's never too late, and since my local library does have the translated version of A rembours, that will be my starting point (after Eco). It's actually checked out at the moment, so that's saying something :) 1984 is the only book on your list I'm familiar with, I thought it was sad yet awesome; have saved your post for future reading.

I'm with you on reading in the original language, when possible. For a while I had hopes Huysmans was Dutch, as I am, but alas: 't was only his dad who was apparently. My French is so good it makes French people switch to English when talking to me, an accomplishment in itself really. Many thanks for your carefully crafted reply and ideas!





I'm definitely out of books. I'm gonna be bookless. Yeah.

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