These people killed over a lousy $1,200 drug debt? A beatdown I get. Slash his car tires? Sure. Steal his car, rob his house? Why not. But murder for a minimal amount of $1,200?
shareIn the movie they don't kill for the drug debt, but because they are afraid of being arrested for kidnapping (something they didn't think was so serious when they did it), so they panic and miscalculate that their chances will be better this way.
Incidentally, I think this miscalculation is the less beleviable aspect of the story as it is shown. One would suppose that in order to be in the drug game for any time you should at least have some brains. They were under stress, and maybe the whole process was poisoned by Elvis' desire to push forward, but still it was a very simple choice. Did it really happen that way?
I see many posts saying that Nick should have ran, or that the witnesses weren't taking the thing seriously enough, but I think that Nick behavior was very rational... I wouldn't have been worried too, after all that people have seen me and know what's the situation is, and the only thing the kidnappers can do is turn the whole thing into a joke for their own good. He just had not taken in account the irrationality of the other guys.
my vote history: http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=43162133
It really happened that way.
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Let me tell you a little story. You're an idiot!
If Truelove/Hollywood had listened to his lawyer they all would have made out better. Nick was "kidnapped", but not in a traditional sense. There never was a formal ransom made, only a cryptic call to Nick's brother.
The lawyer suggested a sit down, claim big misunderstanding, write a check for "damages", etc etc. Suggested that that there might be jail time, but it would be minimal - 2 years tops. Truelove is stubborn, no jail time, no jail time. Kid dies and he gets life.
@bpaluses-1 worse.....death row
that whole scene in the movie was soo gut wretching, i started to cry....
If it wasnt for that Dbag Elvis, Nick would have still been alive. It's been a while since I've seen the movie but if I remember correctly Truelove had told Frankie to take Nick home. They would have worked out some sorta deal
shareNo, he never told Frankie to take him home. He LIED to Frankie that they were gonna take him home, while plotting with Elvis behind Frankie's back. That's pretty much how it went down in real life. And it's all because that douchebag lawyer told Hollywood he was going to jail for life just for grabbing up the kid in the first place. What a piece of crap, that guy.
I'm reading the book My Stolen Son by Susan Markowtiz right now. It pretty much agrees with the movie on all the important details. It's also really well written and very emotional.
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there will be snark
I read somewhere, and don't hold me to this, all of you more familar with the story please correcte, but wasn't JJH either intimidated or afraid of Ben? I think it was more than the money. I swear I read that somewhere.
I remember two things very clearly: I am a great sinner and Christ is a great Savior.
He was, yes. JJH was a midget, Ben was a big guy who acted as his enforcer a few times. Look at that scene where "Jake" is trashing "Johnny's" house and even though Johnny's got a gun, he still hides behind the bathroom door, hyperventilating. That just beautifully sums up what a puss toot that little bugger was.
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there will be snark
One of the points of the film is that these guys AREN'T really hard core criminals. Sonny Truelove is much more of a hardened criminal and he understands the horrible mistake they made. I got the impression hat Sonny never would have killed the kid because he understands how things work and he's much more calculating than Johnny. These kids are just suburban pot dealers who want to seem like tough guys.
"Unless Alpert's covered in bacon grease, I don't think Hugo can track anything."
Yeah. If only Johnny had let Sonny smooth things over, huh?
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there will be snark
They were stupid, but think of the geniuses who wrote the laws. If they could have sued in small claims court and had the deadbeat junkie's wages garnished or if they weren't facing life imprisonment for returning the kid alive the outcome would have been a lot more peaceful if less lucrative to the criminals on top.
shareYeah, having comparable sentences for kidnapping and murder can only push kidnappers to kill their victim, since at least there would be less chances to be caught. But in this case I can't imagine they would have really got a life sentence, considering the circumstances of the kidnapping. The lawyer only said that on the phone because he was being asked a generic question, but later he told Truelove that he could get out of it with minimum jail time.
my vote history: http://www.imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=43162133
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the Ben Foster character actually tried to pay him 600 (I believe), but he wouldn't accept it, it was all or nothing. Who does that?
It was obvious that the guy was making some kind of effort at paying his debt.
The sun shone, having no alternative, on the nothing new. Samuel Beckett
Thats the most idiotic part on Hollywood/Trueloves fault. Ben Markowitz (fosters character) was a strongman/debt collector for Hollywood. On top of it he moved some weed when he could. Over the 2 years of their business, be brought Hollywood a lot of customers. He also helped him collect quite a few debts. I heard in real life, the E pills that Fosters character said were 'bunk' were stolen off of a neighbor of a guy that owed money to Hollywood/Truelove. Hollywood/truelove and foster/markowitz went to this guys house, beat the *beep* out of him, duct taped him up, and the guy ratted on his neighbor saying he had 300 bumps of E. They went to the neighbors house, broke in, and got hte drugs. They agreed that Mazursky would sell the pills, pay off Truelove, and keep the rest for himself.
Mazursky goes back and tells him the pills were bunk and got 800 dollars before people at the rave started wising up, and that was that.
But hollywood didnt buy it. I read on an article that his friends constantly asked him what they would do when markowitz would rip him off, b/c he had ran up over 60 grand in Weed debts to other dealers and boldly refused to pay them.
The difference was, unlike the drug dealers that Markowitz had been ripping off, Markowitz and Hollywood were old school friends and markowitz most likely wouldnt have ripped his boy Hollywood off.
So anyways, after constantly being paranoid that Markowitz would rip him off, Hollywood didnt want to take *beep* and went aggro for nothing.
Markowitz probably brought in 30 gs, at the least, to hollywood. To burn him b/c of a 1200 dollar debt that markowitz wasnt responsible for (the 1200 dollar debt was b/c a dude owed that money to hollywood and markowitz stepped up and collected it for him -see above-. Markowitz went out of his way to get his homie his money and Truelove was blind to it. He pissed his life away over 1200 dollars.
Stupid. IN the drug business, your gonna get burned. you gotta eat it up and keep going and make that money back. He was just plain stupid.
I am the devil, and I am here to do the devils work
They're not Don Corleone. They're not in suits. They're petty thug kids and $1,200 buys a lot of weed. In their eyes.
"Oh, my God. Bear is driving! How can that be?!"
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