ABBAcat wrote:
You will probably disagree with that and argue that there is only one set of fixed messages here.
There is not one right interpretation of a work of fiction, but there's can certainly be ridiculously wrong interpretations.
then the next time I can see things that make Madeline into the antagonist.
Well, if you're going to post that, you may well find that someone says you are being ridiculous.
Yup, Peg didn't like Madeline because she is a force pulling George away from his home and his roots.
That is nonsense. You cannot support that from the dialogue. George had not been home in 2 1/2 years when he met Madeleine, and it is obvious that he does not want to be home now.
Madeline didn't make an effort to ingratiate herself to them either.
Madeleine wants to be accepted by George's family and she works at. She succeeds with Eugene and Ashley. Johnny is overtly hostile from the first time they meet. Peg is also but it is less obvious.
One of the first things she says is that they made the trip only to meet that artist.
She says that she was the one who wanted to stop by and meet his family. George didn't. But you see that as an insult?
Then she called Peg "Pat",
We see her having trouble with the names in the car. That is the easy mistake to make. No one sane would be offended by it.
and made little effort to fit in or humble herself a bit.
She made every effort to fit in, and she never acted superior or looked down on them. She actually does not feel superior to them any more than she does with her outsider artists.
However I don't think Madeline is very perceptive about people in general. She gets so much wrong - from breaking that ceramic bird
So, in your view a physical accident in an unfamiliar house is an indication that she is unperceptive about people. Do you object to my calling that ridiculous?
and not catching onto Ashley's attempts to help her save face to the awkward physical miss-messaging with Johnny.
Madeleine had no need to save face. She is a very empathetic person and she comforts people physically. Johnny is being a jerk.
Kind of ironic for a person who is tasked with finding artists with highly individualized styles.
That is actually good evidence that you are wrong. She gets along with and does not judge some very strange people. Madeleine talks to Wark while she is going to the bathroom. There is no door on the bathroom. She is unfazed by all of this.
Madeline may well want to be accepted into George's family
Madeleine is never going to be anywhere near George's family again except maybe for a funeral.
but unlike Ashley who oozes with natural charm,
LOL You call that natural charm? I would call it childish naïveté. I agree that it is charming in small doses.
she seriously lacks adaptive social skills.
Sure. That is why she is able to get along with the outsider artists that she deals with.
The only social skill she seems to have mastered is her sexuality. She and George married after a week, and are very sexual
I think I'm coming to understand why you dislike Madeleine so much.
but don't seem to connect on many other levels.
You are making that up because it is what you want to believe.If you are going to have people treat your posts with respect, you have to get at least some things right.
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ABBAcat
8 years ago
Ok, I see your point. Madeline is perfect, and George's family are mean and awful in-laws. A daughter-in-law disliked by her husband's family. Of course, I see how that is such a clever and original story now. I do appreciate the time you took to copy/paste, quote and correct all of my ridiculous comments.
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ppllkk
8 years ago
ABBAcat wrote:
Madeline is perfect,
Madeleine grew up in a variety of cultures, and she understands about cultural differences. Now she deals with outsider artists, some of whom are quite strange. Madeleine is not at all judgmental about different cultures even in extreme cases.
and George's family are mean and awful in-laws.
No, only two of the four of them. Madeleine gets along extremely well with both Ashley and Eugene.
A daughter-in-law disliked by her husband's family.
A daughter-in-law disliked by her mother-in-law for what I think are obvious reasons. That is commonplace when you have a mother like Peg.
Of course, I see how that is such a clever and original story now.
The family dynamics that the story deals with are classic and rather easy to understand. When
ida96 posted
I got a big whiff of Cain and Abel in the scene in which Johnny suddenly hits George on the head with a wrench,
she showed that she understands what is going on in this movie. You have not given any indication that you do.
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[email protected] (690)
8 years ago
While I agree almost 100% with your analysis of this film, you could be a little more tactful with your disagreements.
People seem to forget this is a movie, albeit naturalistic, and there is tension meant to be created that we might find puzzling. I think Mad does her best to be friendly to her new in-laws, but she has a cultured veneer that some might find off-putting, and there isn't much she can do about it. The minute Mad stepped into the kitchen for a late night tutoring session I knew it wouldn't end well, and she should have been aware of how she might come across, but she seems to think everyone shares her relaxed "European" sensibility.
I also don't find Peg to be as awful as a lot of people are making her out to be. It's unfortunate the affect she may have on her loved ones, but she's just a rural matriarch who's rigid in her mindset. Eugene is no pistol; life may have disappointed her, too.
But I really like this movie. Another favorite with difficult family issues is The Sweet Hereafter. Solemn but moving.
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