Nothing against Mol, but this woman should not have been given this role. Not only does she look NOTHING like Bettie but she does not have 1% of Bettie's sex appeal. This movie is pretty bad. Such a shame, Bettie deserves better.
shareI agree 100%. Mary Harron was a bad choice as director, too. Her directing style is slow and detached.
"Is there even a school just called Boston College"?"-jayz4all
Totally disagree about the casting comment.
shareWhy? I can find you 20 girls on myspace right now that would have been a better representation, and prolly could have acted the part better. And another thing, what is up with Mol's nose? I would think this one feature alone would nix her for the part.
And another thing, to be Notorious implies you sleep with a lot of men. Is that represented in the movie? Sleeping with a lot of men is not what Bettie is known for. This movie continues to disapoint the more I think about it.
First of all, I totally disagree with the original comment that Mol was a bad choice. While I don't think it was a great movie, she gave a fantastic performance. And she's very beautiful, but that's a separate issue.
But Chain, to address something you said: did you even watch the movie? The word "notorious" comes from the scene where she is auditioning for a play and the director says, "It's great to finally meet the notorious Bettie Page." She looks hurt and embarrassed.
That's kind of the point of the movie. The title is meant to be ironic. She wasn't dark or dangerous at all; just a woman looking to make it in show business the best way she knew how.
Also, Chain, I don't know what dictionary you have that defines "notorious" as "sleeps with a lot of men."
To be notorious is to be famous for something most people would be afraid of or look down upon. As in a "notorious" bank robber. Though sexual promiscuity could be considered a notorious act, the word is not limited to that and there certainly is no reason you should assume that's what was meant by the title.
No wonder reason seems like a chain to you.
Doy, when you are reffering to a woman it is about sex, and what woman from this time period was more about sex?
So you are going to first admit that it can reffer to such, then call me an idiot of saying so.
So what are you like the directors Mother?
Also, momo, my screen name is how it can be painful when things make sense. A chain can not deter reason, only heighten it.
sharePerhaps I'm being a bit too generous, Chains, but I'm assuming that English is not your first language. Honestly, I had to read your answers to me three times before I grasped what you were trying to say.
If you are new to this country, let me say bravo for at least learning the language. Don't worry, it'll get easier. If, however, you were raised speaking English, please consider suing your local school system.
First off, I never called you an "idiot". I'm sure that it is a term you've heard directed at you many, many times, but not by me.
The only person doing any name calling is you. ("Momo"? What are you, fourteen?)
I'll try to explain my point as I would to my seven year old nephew: the word "notorious" can imply many things, only one of which is sexual looseness. You latched onto that one possible implication and used it as proof that the movie was not what it promised.
You said that when directed towards a woman, "notorious" automatically means looseness (or, as you so eloquently put it, "sleeps with lots of men"). I advised you to check your dictionary.
Also, please look up the words "irony" and "reason".
Whatever the word "notorious" implies, as used in the title of this movie, it was meant to be IRONIC. Can you follow that, Chains? Did you see the scene where she tried out for the play? That's why the movie was called "The Notorious Bettie Page."
I'm sorry that you didn't get to see her sleeping with lots of men, and that the "movie continues to disappoint" because of that, but that's not what the point of the movie was.
Maybe I should look up reason as well. I'm arguing with someone who, in their original post, wrote, "What's up with Gretchen's nose? That should've nixed her right there."
Not a good example of reason on my part. I'd do better arguing with the homless guy that hangs out by the supermarket near my house.
But you were right about one thing. Anyone who defends an actor's performance is automatically the director's relative. That's a proven fact.
Wow, you are all riled up huh? You know, I could take the time to make you look silly but I doubt I could top your own work on that. Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, if you win, you are still retarded.
My screen name is from a Rush song, "throw off your chains of reason, and your prision disappears." So in the context of the song its like, the truth hurts, and can hurt you. This might be a little above your intellect. In the future I will stick to boy band refferences for you.
I think you would be better off with the guy at the supermarket, birds of a feather Momo.
Again, you say that notorious can refer to a loose woman. By you saying this is incorrect in the same breath inplies that this in not the intention of the adjective. Well what is Bettie page known for, bowling? You are retarded and I would love to hear what movies you think are good. Give me some so I can trash them too, this is fun.
All of your assumptions about me and this movie are incorrect.
Wow. Gotta love that tried and true tactic of telling the other person that they are all riled up (even though I've been relatively polite while you've resorted to gradeschool name-calling).
That's such a pathetic move. "You're all mad, I'm relaxed. Why you so mad?" Seriously, I'm guessing you're about twelve to fourteen.
Also, I'm truly doubting your ability to read. I'm sure you know all the letters of the alphabet and all that, but I believe you can't make the mental journey through complete sentences. All of my assumptions are wrong? Uh, the whole point of this is that you're the one making assumptions.
(You call me "the director's mother", while in my first post I say I don't think it's a great movie. I just praised Mol. Also, I'm a guy, dude.)
I'm sure it's in vain to explain again the difference between one possible meaning of a word and saying that the word automatically implies that, but here goes.
You said in your original post "notorious implies that you sleep with a lot of men". And since that wasn't represented in the movie, you said that made it even more disappointing. Those were your words, junior. Go back and read them, since I'm sure you've forgotten.
I corrected you, first by explaining that the title was meant to be ironic, secondly by explaining that words can mean various things.
You expected to see her sleeping with lots of men and were disappointed when you didn't get to. That's what your post says.
I explained quite clearly what was meant by the title. It's a sad joke, she wasn't really a notorious-type of person at all. Closer to an innocent, actually.
You want to know what movies I like so you can trash them? You don't know what they are but you're hoping you dislike them so you can put them down 'cause "it's fun"?
That's probably the saddest thing I've read on these boards in quite some time.
You invalidate your whole rant about how arguing on the net is dumb. You love to argue, it's what people like you live for.
I find it very difficult to believe you're a Rush fan. I'm not a mega-fan or anything, but I know Peart's lyrics are usually about lifting up the image of man. He's a huge Ayn Rand fan, as am I. He's an advocate of reason, and while I don't know what song that quote is from, it seems a bit contrary to what I know of him. Perhaps he was speaking through a character, being satirical, like the priests in 2112.
Well, we've established you don't understand irony.
In any event, you seem to be the exact opposite type of person Peart would admire. You're another angry little loser, trolling the boards, hoping to "get into it with someone", hoping to dislike movies so you can rant.
But I give credit where credit is due. You have succeeded in one of your goals. I do feel pathetic.
I came on this board to talk about Gretchen Mol and Bettie Page, both of whom are super hot. Instead, I'm arguing with the comic book guy from The Simpsons.
Regardless of what Peart's true intention of that lyric was, you were right about one thing. The truth does hurt..and it can hurt. But it's still the truth.
And I think we both know what the truth about you is, don't we? And I think we both know why you hide it.
Chainsofreason hunted me down on the "Boogie Nights" boards. It's a thread called "You know you're obsessed with Boogie Nights when..."
It's funny as hell.
One of my posts was "You work at a carwash, you work at a nightclub. School never occured to you." It's a quote from the movie.
I posted it like five months ago or something.
Chainsofreason, apparently reading my message board history, just wrote "So, you work at a carwash, huh Snow? I thought you work at a supermarket with the homeless guy."
Proving, yet again, Chains, all of the following: you can barely read, you get yourself involved in conversations that you don't even understand, and, the most obvious, you are pathetic, lonely and insane.
Does anyone know if IMDB offers restraining orders?
Ha ha, you are so stoopid. You are late for your shift at the carwash. Go get your shine box.
Like you know anything about irony or Rush. You might be someone who lives your life as you think others would have you but I don't and I am sure if Neil were to comment he would agree with me.
Again, I am not going to pick apart your latest hate speech because it is not worth it. You don't like what I have to say? Then don't post about what I say.
Dude, you started with me. Your latest statements confirm you are as hurtful and stoopid as you claim I am.
Uh. What?
Can I ask you a serious question, Chains? I'm not trying to be insulting here, I swear. Do you have a learning disability? Or are you usually drunk when you respond to posts?
I'm serious. Your answers don't even seem connected to what's been written. It's like you read the first part of a sentence and stop.
You're not "going to pick apart the latest hate speech" because you can't. Instead you say meaningless things like I "live life as others think (I)should." Tell me what I've said that would make you draw that conclusion. Seriously. Tell me one shred of a basis that would allow you to believe I'm a conformist.
You can't. Same as your comment that I probably listen to boy bands. Meaningless nonsense from a quasi-intellectual. You like to talk crap to people, then backtrack and hurl insults when you're questioned.
I started with you? I corrected you on a comment you posted. You're the one who started with insults. And you're the one who has followed me to other boards.
I've read some of your posts on other boards now, since you decided to follow me.
You do the same stuff on other boards. Insult people, call them stupid, imply that they're gay, call them retarded, and give zero facts on anything.
I really must believe you're drunk or something. I work as a bartender and you remind me of a lot of the people I have to deal with. You ignore the general point of any discussion and then focus on one minute detail.
You're going to chastise me for not knowing Rush? I never said I was the world's biggest fan. I have 2112, Moving Pictures, Signals and Fly By Night. I don't know the newer stuff. But I know what the lyrics on those albums are about.
And I think it's a safe bet that the person who wrote those lyrics would think you're an idiot.
You are an angry little loser. Face it. You have like fifteen posts on The Sopranos boards, all about how much you hate the show and how anyone who likes it "has been brainwashed."
According to you, Chase is a hack who "is laughing all the way to the bank" and people who disagree are "in love with Tony or something."
I also read your posts on the Vanilla Sky boards. One my favorite movies; beautiful movie. But your posts are just your usual nonsense: calling people stupid if they don't have the same interpretation as you.
Now, I won't get into particulars on Vanilla Sky, for spoiler reasons, but what you say is going on in that movie is totally incorrect. Do you even listen to the dialogue when you watch a movie?
I don't think you've even seen Vanilla Sky all the way through. Maybe you're thinking of the Spanish original, which I haven't seen. But in any case, what you say about Vanilla Sky is completely wrong.
Give it up snow, there is no reasoning with some people.
We Ourselves.
[deleted]
oMG, this is ridiculous!
The Notorious Bettie Page refers to her noteriety of posing nude and being in Bondage photographs, very risque at the time. How the word 'notorious' comes to denote 'slut' (which is basically what Chains is insinuating) I will never understand.... maybe because it simply moronic connection.
....be gentle.
Wow, an oldie but a goodie. I think it is funny that the basis for everyone here is that I have made the connection that being notorious can refer to someone who sleeps around. Of course this is not the exact defination, but it can be used to infer that a woman is "famous" for sleeping sround, as When this word is used to describe someone who is not famous. It means they have a reputation of having loose morals. Is bettie famous? I guess that depends on your meaning of the word. Is Jenna James famous? What about the unnamed kids in child pornogtraphy? The women who posed for the very first nude photos? What about the whores in Tombstone, known and talked about by countless Ranch hands, before the state was created?
I wanted to illusitrate how this title was stoopid. Because people who argue love to have something to show as a win, I guess litteral definations of words works for that. I am not so petty.
The fact remains this was a horrible movie and Mol was miscast.
Chains of reason you have to be the dumbest poster ever.
Notorious means famous for something bad.
Jesse James was notorious. Billy the Kid was notorious. Betty Page was notorious to some people who thought pornography was bad, but she did not see herself that way. Where in your limited train of thought you come up with someone who sleeps around is beyond me, but whats worse you make yourself look like a bigger jackass by attacking people and then think you are smarter than them, and then more audacious is you have the nerve to say a movie was horrible and someone was miscast. Like after all your idiotic posts anyone would value your opinion at all
"Let us die young or let us live forever
We don't have the power but we never say never
Ok so this argument is old and no one will ever read this and I shouldn't bother with it anyway, but I simply must point out that the alternate spelling of "stupid" as "stoopid" is in fact a positive adjective, meaning that in an attempt to insult someone you have actually complimented them.
shareGretchen Mol was fine as Bettie and the movie is a nice little film that works.
"Notorious", as already noted, is used in the ironic sense in the title. It does not automatically mean she's the town pump (credit to "The Sopranos" for that one).
Rush has a bunch of decent songs, but Neal Peart's lyrics are not one of the band's strong points.
That's what I think, that's what I say...
Gretchen Mol was amazing in this film, in my opinion. I can't wait to get the DVD.
Coming is my style, but I have to go.
http://imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=15368636
I think when he said 'jenna james' he was trying to refer to jenna jameson not jesse james.
shareshe had nice tits, that was about it. i have to agree with the first posters here. i happened to see a trailer for this and it looked entertaining, then i saw the movie last night, and i actually found it a pretty uninteresting biography picture, and i fell asleep so i don't know what happened in the later part, to be fair it was nighttime. it's funny how everything here is color when most of the movie seemed to be b&w. that was kind of hip how it changed between b&w and color. definitively watchable, but of what i saw pretty uninteresting.
a little hit made yesterday,
that made an echo all over the place,
folks are starting to turn their trust away,
dont wanna ruin the facade,
of our cosy way,
there might have been some damage done,
as other power around was looking on,
so come here lets talk,
to the lovely place where we are,
infront of the rolling of the bands,
while fooled right into our hands,
a little tap on the shoulder, things are okey,
come on, let's make some money,
over the bruise of the hit we made yesterday.
LOL!
shareJust reading and laughing at this thread.
I thought English was a second language to Chains as well, after that last post.
If only I understood Rush!
[deleted]
You misinterpret the use of the word Notorious in the context of the film. Go take an indroductory writing class at you local community college.
shareCouldn't disagree more. Go look at some images and film clips of Bettie Page and educate yourself.
shareThe film is like a series of events--instead of a probe into the character of a unique woman.
Illusion is the first of all pleasures
-Oscar Wilde-
I don't know who Bettie Page was, much less what she looks like. The dvd included a very short film of Bettie stripping and I thought that Gretchen Moll captured the important aspects of Bettie when I compared her performance with that of Bettie. The most obvious likeness was in the smile.
To say a little often is to tell more than to say a great deal.share