MovieChat Forums > 61* (2001) Discussion > Hall of Fame

Hall of Fame

posted 17 years ago by brandnewband
18 replies | jump to latest

I find it interesting that Maris isn't in the hall. I researched online and saw that prior to 1990 only 11 players had hit 50 homeruns or more in a season. Of that 11 only 2 aren't in the hall. Granted Maris doesn't have the numbers the other greats do, however we so easily will put in guys from the juiced homerun era in the hall over roger and over many other greats who didn't use performance enhancing drugs. Those guys played against many great pitchers and in ballparks with huge foul territories that all helped the pitchers. Today pitchers can't even knock a guy off the plate without being ejected. Hitters clearly had it tougher 20 years ago and before. But today we seem to compare the current players to the greats without realizing if they played back then they'd probably of hit for less than .250 and maybe parked 20 homeruns. As for Roger not making the hall it seems it may of been more that he wasn't loved by the media. If it were Mantle and he only broke the record but his career faded out after then he would of been in the hall. We may never see Ron Santo, Andre Dawson, and many other greats that routinely get snubbed by the hall but we will see many players who were caught up in scandal and ultimately brought shame and disgrace to the game.

[–] DJMan-51 17 years ago

Maris also has two consecutive Most Valuable Player awards. The only other guy with that credential who is not in the Hall of Fame is Dale Murphy, who will probably get there one day.

As a young baseball fan, I suffered through 1961 with Maris, and have the highest regard for him, but I can't really endorse his election from the record.

But if they do it, okay. There are numerous less deserving players in there.

[–] yudds 17 years ago

I just don't think Maris had the longevity.

To his credit, Maris' first MVP was in 1960, a year before the 61 homers. He was more than just the single season or breaking the record.

Jim Rice comes to mind about guys who had possibly good enough numbers but poor relations with the press.

[–] DJMan-51 17 years ago

Maris *could* have gotten in 1999, just after McGwire's HR chase had dragged him back into the limelight. As there are several Hall-of-Fame-ers with poorer credentials, that would have been fine with me.

But the Hall Brass found some way to keep Roger off the Veteran's Commitee ballot that one year. Now it's too late.

Ah well, the Vets Cmte has been handcuffed since the Mazeroski induction. They won't induct anybody until the rules are changed again.

[–] jc52091 17 years ago

Yea a life time .260 batting average 275 home runs and 851 RBIs are not Hall of Fame stats. A-Rod now beats each one of those stats and A-Rod is only 31. Just because he had two good years doesn't mean he deserves to be in the hall of fame. If anything Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall.

[–] LWesley7438 17 years ago

Maris needs to be in the hall of fame. He broke the record without any performance enhancing drugs compared to Bonds. He was a solid player, always put 110 percent out on the field, and a lot crappier players are in the hall. I think Pete Rose should be in too, but I would put Maris in before Rose. At least Maris wasn't betting on his team.

[–] champ01-1 17 years ago

One season does not make a hall of fame career. Really, he only had two great seasons, and the rest of his career is average at best. A single season record does not get you into the hall of fame. You must be great for most of your career. As stated before, a low career average, not even 300 homeruns, and less that 1000 rbi's...There are many other players who have a lot better stats who are not in the hall of fame.

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[–] seebam 17 years ago

The truth actually is if the Hall of Fame was voted on by peers and not sportwriters (most of whom never played ball professionally and are only obsessed with numbers), Maris would have gone in years ago. Whitey Herzog, a pretty good judge of talent and a contemporary of Maris', once referred to Roger as the best right fielder of his era. His "weak" later-year numbers are deceiving for two reasons: 1. He played with a bone removed from his hand from 1965 on, and 2. The late sixties saw HR totals and averages go way down all through baseball. Maris finished his career two years with the Cards. He hit third in their order on two World Series teams and batted .385 in the World Series. So to say he had only a few great years is quite erroneous. It's funny how players like Kirby Puckett (barely over 200 HRs) and Sandy Koufax (165 wins) get sympathy from the Hall voters even though their numbers weren't "Hall worthy". They were voted in because people assume had they been allowed to play for more than a dozen years, their numbers would have been more "Hall-like". Both of them, like Roger, had their careers cut short by injuries, ailments, etc. However, no voters ever say, "If Roger had been allowed to play 20 years, he probably would have hit 400 to 500 HRs." The truth is he was a more complete player than many that are currently in the Hall. Frank Thomas is probably going in the Hall of Fame for his HR totals when we all know of his ineptness in the field. If I'm a manager, I take a player with Maris' talents over a player like Thomas every day. One day people will figure this out. Unfortunately, it won't be the people who know the least about baseball greatness- the writers.

[–] andycool24 17 years ago

Roger definitely isn't a Hall of Famer, but he does have I'm sure, some bats or jerseys or pictures in the HOF in Cooperstown.

The career numbers are pitiful for HOF standards, but the 61 HR's and the two MVP's are nice. But that's not enough, plus he never batted .300 in any year. His 2nd highest HR total was 39 in 1962, a year after the record, and it WAS the first expansion year too.

Guys like Roger Bresnahan, Fred Lindstrom, even Orlando Cepeda, I say shouldn't have been elected. But it's not ALL about the numbers I guess. But Cepeda in and Jim Rice OUT???? What the hell? Rice came so close this year, by a couple percent. His numbers are alot better than Cepeda's, plus he played one less season.

Next year it's Rickey Henderson, and probably only him. I can't think of anybody else.

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[–] champ01-1 17 years ago

Whoever said that maris' numbers are better than frank thomas' numbers are plain dumb. Thomas has a career .303 avg, 513 homeruns, and almost 2500 hits....enough said...Puckett, his career was cut short due to his eye and if it was not for that he would have had 3000 hits and was still a career .318 hitter with multiple gold gloves. Maris' career, even thought I am a fan of his, was only great for like 3 seasons.

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[–] MOOVYZ 17 years ago

"One season does not make a hall of fame career."

Why doesn't it? It's the Hall of Fame. It's not the Hall of lengthy career. To do what Maris did, with all the crap he had to put up with, he deserves the HOF. He deserved it more when he was alive. He still doesn't get the respect he deserves. He is a true Hall of Famer, no doubt!

"I think that boy's cheese slid off his cracker" The Green Mile

[–] champ01-1 17 years ago

The Hall of Fame IS for a player's career moron. You obviously do not know much about baseball. If you ever watch analysts talk about if a player has "hall of famer numbers" they are speaking for the career, not A SINGLE season. Maris is NOT a hall of famer, he hit .261 with a mere 275 or so homeruns. Yes, he had a great season and even 1 or 2 more good ones, but there are far better players that deserve the hall of fame. It is a CAREER achievement. Thats why they wait 5 years after you are retired to vote you in and not the instant you had ONE good season.

[–] MOOVYZ 17 years ago

You are the moron. Obviously, you don't understand how the HOF works. There are scores of players with numbers similar, or far lower, to Maris'. Johhny Bench. Career batting avg. .267 with 389 HR. Luis Aparicio Career BA .262 83 HR.

I can go on and on. It's about recording history and honorring players who were exceptional to the game. What Maris did meets all of those criteria and more.

"I think that boy's cheese slid off his cracker" The Green Mile

[–] champ01-1 17 years ago

Well idiot. Do you realize that Johnny Bench had 10 gold gloves? I'm pretty sure that had something to do with it. Also, for his position he was the best hitting catcher ever until Piazza came. It's hard to find great hitting catchers and Bench was a great hitter along with a phenomenal defensive catcher. Aparicio had 9 gold gloves, along with 500 stolen bases. You do know that defense does play a part in hall of fame voting, right? Look at Ozzie Smith. Terrible power numbers as a hitter but 13 gold gloves is unreal. While I am a big Maris fan, I do not believe one year makes you a Hall of Famer. It is a privilege, not a right to be inducted. Maris had average career numbers with only 3 gold gloves....And ripping Johnny Bench shows you do know nothing.

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