Screw Job?


If youre a wrestling fan, you either stand on one side or the other with this guy and the infamous screw job at Survivor Series. After watching the PPV first, then the documentary, listening to several interviews on both sides, I'd have to say Bret did get screwed.

He promised Vince that he would drop the title the following Monday Night Raw however Vince wanted him to, so Vince 'for the company' orchestrates an ending in which Shawn Micheals takes the title by a quick bell.

If I were Vince, I would have trusted my employee who has always been fair to me on his word. By orchestrating the screw job, Vince obviously did not trust Bret with what appears to be no reason.

So was Bret screwed or not?

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I remember watching the PPV and not realizing what had happened. Back in 96 when Bret's contract had run out he had been in negotiations with both companies like he says. Turner offered him a 9 million dollar contract and Bret once said on Squared Circle (A CRN call in show) that the money didn't matter to him. Even two days before he showed up on RAW he didn't know where he was going.

That PPV I thought: Oh they were running out of time! And someone goes no Bret got screwed. I'm not a rube or anything and do have a healthy understanding of the sport but that was unheard of.

As someone else said Vince was worried of a repeat of what Madusa did with the women's title. But come on who didn't think that's where the belt belonged?

But who truly wasn't happy Bret went to WCW fan wise? Too bad Bill Goldberg ended Bret's career.

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If you read up on this properly, you will find that Vince McMahon had been underpaying Bret's contract for a number of months leading up to his exit. As this documentary shows well, Bret was a moral man and really had a hard time leaving the WWF bcos of his loyalty. If Vince had shown an ounce of that loyalty to Bret, he'd have let Bret beat Shawn in a dusty finish and drop the belt at RAW the next nite.

Did Bret get screwed? You bet ur ass he did, nothing Vince says can disprove this, he knew exactly wot he was doing.

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I absolutely agree with the fact that Bret got screwed. He was ripped off, lied to, and cheated out of a dignified exit.

And if I were Vince, I would have done the EXACT SAME THING! You want Vince to trust one of his most loyal employees? He did...his name was Hulk Hogan. Look what happened. Yeah, Vince totally screwed Bret, but friendship and loyalty just don't have a whole lot to do in the land of *buisness*. Did anybody ever look at things from Vince's side of the story? Did Vince release a documentary entitled "Vince McMahon: Trying to deal with a whiny b*tch while keeping the company from losing to a rich b*tch." Anyone out there who's involved in a large buisness of any sort knows what I'm talking about. It wasn't right. It wasn't funny. But I think it *was* justified. One could also very easily say that Bret should have dropped the title cleanly to Shawn that night. You don't wanna lose in front of your home fans? What...like you'll never wrestle there again??? Get over it man.

And as the final note...ever think that the one who *really* screwed Bret...was Ted Turner. Vince McMahon handed Turner one of the worlds greatest professional wrestlers, hot off of one of the absolute biggest events in wrestling history. Bret had everything going for him, he was possibly the worlds biggest face coming out of the screwjob...and WCW, rather than create a story specifically for Bret, pulgs him into the WCW vs. nWo feud, and has him mock his own career with the "fast count on Sting" angle. Total BS.

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I agree, people talk about Vince's out of control ego, but you NEED a powerful ego to control all the powerful egos running around in your own locker room. Vince is, indeed, a business man above all else. He can't make friends with the guys, it's dangerous, certain ones may expect special treatment. And yeah, WCW is the true screw-up company for pushing a no talen moron like Goldberg(the spear! the jackhammer! It's over in two moves! Multiply that by however many hundred before Goldberg FINALLY lost and you have his career) Hart had real talent, but was forced back. Vince did what he had to, Turner just plain screwed up

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What vince did wass 100% right for the business, no way should he have let bret walk out of Montreal with the WWF title.

If you watch WWF vs WCW: The Monday Night War, Bruce Prichard explaines how Hall, Nash, Rude and Luger all gave Vince there so called Words, but they did not mean Jack S**t. He was right not to trust bret.

I was proud of vince, and the Bret Screwed Bret interview was pure genius, and the start of the Attitude era.

Vince 3:16

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Hey I am a big bret fan, don't get me wrong, I loved watching him perform for the WWE, week in week out, but I still stand by the fact that Bret Could not leave Montreal with the Title, you could bet that if he had kept the belt, as soon as bret got home, bishoff would have been on the phone Manipulating him, and the Bish is very good at influencing people.

I have had the honour of meeting bret and he was one of the nicets men i have ever met. Please don't take my theory as an indictment of his character, but i still think Vince was justified.

As for The Attitude era, Where as it was not created by the speach, it was certainly kick started by it.

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Now that you mention "Owen Hart" and "the screwjob" at the same time, do you think Vince planned Owen's demise for more hatered against Bret Hart/The Hart Family? I might sound kind of stupid saying this but really has anybody ever thought about that? {to whoever reads this} tell me what you think..............

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Don't get me wrong, when Owen died at 'Over the Edge', that was one of the first thoughts that entered my head.

But Owen stood by McMahon, he didn't have the money to be able to quit WWF after his Big Bro was "Screwed" (bulldog walked), and roumers are Vince was very pally with Owen, alot of people say this kind of upset Bret that Owen and vince got on well. there is no way Vince or the WWF would do something like this.

Saddly, in my eyes this was a 100% bone-fide Accident. That robbed us of a fine young performer, just entering his prime.

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I suggest everyone on this board do some research before commenting on the screwjob. The reason being is that most of you do not have the complete facts and don't understand the situation, which was more complex. If you actually want to know the entire story behind the screwjob, you should go to Bret's official site, where he has posted the entire issue about the screwjob, directly from Dave Meltzer's Wrestling Observer Newsletter. Meltzer is, without question, the top journalist in this industry. So if you actually want to read up on the real story, go to www.brethart.com and then click on Montreal, to the side of your screen. It is extremely interesting, and Dave does the best job of explaining in detail what led up to the infamous match in Montreal. So please do that before commenting, because when you don't know the whole story and comment on it, it really makes you look bad, since you need to know the story in order to undrstand what happened.

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With respect, if you want people to check their facts before commenting, do you really think it's wise to ask them to read a website which by its very nature would be heavily biased (in this case, towards Bret)? Let's face it, no-one will ever know what really happened. Personally I admire HBK's situation and admitted his part. He's let it go, moved on. WWS was a very well-made documentary but we don't know how accurately it was edited. Indeed many people have come forward and corroberated what much of it says but we will never know the true facts.

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You're not being asked to read Bret Hart's opinions on the screwjob, but Dave Meltzer's, as previously said the best in the biz at reporting on wrestling. Anyone who can say vince did right, you are clearly trying to be contoversial, please dont waste your time as it is obvious that Bret was no Hogan, no Hall, no Nash, no Lugar, no Flair, Bret was a true gentleman, and i blame fully Vince McMahon, Michael Hickenbottom (HBK) and Bill Goldberg for ruining the fortunes of one of the most important families in wrestling history.

As for linking the tragedies of Owen's death to simple revenge, you are a disgraceful human who is just trying to fan the flames of hatred. Owen's death was a terrible accident. Also Vince would not let Owen go to WCW and threatened Bret with legal actions for 'sticking his nose in his business', when Bret was simply trying to help his little brother.

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When the whole "screwjob" thing happened, Vince was tired of Hart's huge ego and his lack of drawing power. Vince was just looking out for the business. If Hart wasn't willing to drop the title, and the company needed it dropped, Vince was more than willing to put the company needs before Bret, and I hold Vince McMahon with the highest level of respect because of that.

Hogan drew a lot of money, Piper drew a lot of money, Rhodes, Flair, and Savage all drew big money. Hart didn't. He just wasn't as important as he thought he was.

GIT-R-DONE!!!!!

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if vince had a problem with brets 'ego' or 'drawing power' then why only a matter of months before did he offer and sign bret on a 20 year contract.

Also vince agreed before the match that bret had a degree of control over how the match ended and vince aggreed that he would retain the title in montreal and give it up on raw...HE AGREED TO THIS. Why did he do this knowing he was gonna screw him over. If he didnt want to run the risk of bret leaving with the belt all he had to do was put his foot down and say to bret that he would have to drop the title in montreal...sure bret wouldnt be happy about it but im sure he would have rather it happened that way than the humiliating way that it happened. And im sure there wouldnt have been so much heat between hart and mcmahon for so many years.

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Not to step on any toes or anything but Ummmm Bret was and always will be the best. I don't care about Piper Hogan or Rhodes. The simple fact is, He was screwed. Shawn has admitted it, Vince has admited it as well as many others have. My husband is a 110% HBK fan and even he agrees Bret was screwed. The simple fact is that Bret was becoming a bigger name than old man Vince and he couldn't handle it. IMO Bret was and still is a million times better looking than ince, His wife is hotter and younger than the old bag Linda. Who wouldn't be jealous of that? Talk about an ego trip Vince has his head so far up his own butt he doesn't care about anyone but him and his selfish children. No matter what anyone else says, Bret Hart IS the BEST there is, The BEST there was and by far the BEST there ever will be. Vince could have atleast let Bret leave with his dignity. But no, What Vince wants, Vince gets because he is worse than a 2 year old in a toy store.

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From the Dave Meltzer of Wrestling Observer the full account

"October 20, 1996 - Bret Hart was in a hotel room in San Jose, Ca, hours from making the biggest decision of his life - who would win the biggest bidding war in the history of pro wrestling. He had pretty well leaned toward staying with the World Wrestling Federation despite a much larger offer from World Championship Wrestling, but had changed his mind a few times over the previous two weeks as each side presented new offers. In the waning hours, Eric Bischoff and Kevin Nash were trying to convince him to change his mind and how great life was with an easier schedule. Bischoff was offering big money and a shot at becoming a movie star, a goal Hart had been pursuing while on semince McMahon was offering him, in the now immortal words of Arn Anderson, not just a spot but the top spot in the company, and almost literally to be WWF 4 life. Many close advisers of Hart's tried to tell him going to WCW was the best move for his present, and more importantly his future after wrestling. But largely out of loyalty, and that obviously wasn't the only factor involved, he declined the offer. McMahon, not to lose a very public fight, offered him the famous 20-year contract where he'd, after retirement in about three years, become almost a first lieutenant when it came to the booking process. Hart would earn somewhere in the neighborhood of $1.5 million per year as an active wrestler, and a healthy but far lesser figure working in the front office for the 17 years after retirement as an active wrestler. As part of McMahon's offer, he also was going to allow Hart to explain live on television his decision making process, should he sign with WCW. Hart flew to Fort Wayne, Indiana, where the WWF was holding it's live Raw taping after having already verbally agreed to the deal, signed the contract, and gave the interview saying basically that he would be in the WWF forever, figuring to be positioned as the top babyface and perennial champion until he finished his active career riding off into the sunset in a blaze of glory, like Hogan and Savage and the rest of the Superstars before him didn't. As is the case in wrestling, not all the promised scenarios that everyone believed were going to happen transpire as originally planned. And just over one year later, the feelings between McMahon and Bret Hart had taken a 180 degree turn, to the degree nobody would have ever believed.

March 10, 1997 - Top babyface didn't last long as McMahon asked him to turn heel. At first Hart balked at the idea but after three days, McMahon presented him with two lists. One list was his prospective opponents as a babyface - Vader, Mankind, and Steve Austin. the other list was his prospective opponents as a heel, Undertaker, Michaels, and Austin. Hart agreed for drawing money. His opponents as a heel made up a better list and he and McMahon agreed that he would turn back babyface over the last few months of his contract and end his career on a positive note. He and Steve Austin did the double-turn at Wrestlemania. Hart himself then came up with the Anti-American angle, where he would remain a babyface in Canada and Europe and do interviews that would for the most part speak the truth, so he could, when the time came to turn back in the U.S., have a reasonable explanation.

September 8, 1997 - Vince McMahon and Bret Hart had their first meeting where McMahon seriously approached Hart about his contract. About three months earlier, McMahon had told Hart that the company was in bad financial straights and that they might have to defer some of the money until later in the contract. This time his approach was more than point blank. He wanted to cut Hart's regular salary, around $30,000 per week, more than in half and defer the rest of the money until later in the contract period when hopefully the company would be in better shape financially. Hart declined the suggestion, because he didn't want to risk not getting the money in the future after he was through taking all the bumps.

September 20, 1997 - About one hour before the beginning of the PPV show in Birmingham, England, McMahon approached Davey Boy Smith and asked him to put over Shawn Michaels that night for the European title. Smith was apparently shocked, having been told all along in the build-up of the show, that Michaels was going to do a job for him, since Europe was promised to be "his territory." The explanation, which made and still makes logical business sense, is that they wanted to build for a bigger show - a second PPV show from Manchester, England, Smith's former home town, where Smith would regain the title - the same scenario the WWF did to draw 60,000 fans in San Antonio with Michaels in the other role working a program with Sycho Sid. So while it all made sense, it was rather strange he wasn't approached with this idea until just before the start of the show. At around this same time period, McMahon approached Hart about working with Michaels. Hart said that he had a problem with that since Michaels had still never really apologized to him for the Sunny days comment, and said it would be hard to trust somebody like that in the ring due to their past, and told McMahon that he would figure that Michaels would have the same concerns, since a few weeks earlier after first making it clear he would never work with anyone in the Hart Foundation, Michaels had finally agreed to work with only Smith, saying he still couldn't trust Bret or Owen.

September 22, 1997 - On the day of the Raw taping at Madison Square Garden, McMahon told Bret Hart flat out that they were going to intentionally breach his contract because they couldn't afford the deal. He told a shocked Hart that he should go to World Championship Wrestling and make whatever deal he could with that group. "I didn't feel comfortable doing it," Hart said of the suggestion. "I feel like an old prisoner in a prison where I know all the guards and all the inmates and i have the best cell. Why would I want to move to a new prison where I don't know the guards and the inmates and I no longer have the best cell? I felt really bad after all the years of working for the WWF." Hart had an escape clause in his contract since he had so much negotiating leverage when making his WWF deal 11 months earlier, in that he could leave the company giving 30 days notice and that he would have what the contract called "reasonable creative control" of his character during that lame duck period so that he couldn't be unreasonably buried on the way out. There was a window period for giving that notice and negotiating elsewhere that hadn't begun yet, so McMahon, showing he was serious, gave Hart written permission to begin negotiating with WCW and Hart contacted Eric Bischoff.

The same day, during a meeting with Hart, Michaels, and McMahon - Michaels told both of them point blank that he wouldn't do any jobs for anyone in the territory, word that when it got out made most of the other top wrestlers feel even more warmly than usual toward Michaels. Michaels later reiterated that statement to Hart on 10/4 in St. Paul when the two agreed that for the good of the business that they'd work together. At a meeting, McMahon proposed a scenario where the two would have their first singles match in Montreal, where Undertaker would interfere causing a non-finish. This would lead to Hart wrestling Undertaker on the 12/7 PPV in Springfield, Ma., where Michaels would interfere causing Bret to win the title, which was poetic justice since it was his interference that caused Bret to win the title in the first place, and that Royal Rumble on 1/8, in San Jose, would be headlined by Undertaker vs. Michaels. During the meeting, Hart told Michaels that he'd be happy to put him over at the end of the run, but Michaels told Hart flat out that he wouldn't return the favor to him. Michaels and Hart spoke again on the subject on 10/12 in San Jose, when once again Michaels told Hart that he wasn't going to do a job for him.

October 21, 1997 - McMahon approached Hart wit the idea of losing the title to Michaels in Montreal but promised that he would win it back on 12/7. Hart, remembering his conversations where Michaels was adamant about not doing any more jobs in the territory, was reluctant, saying after the way the angle had been done with him representing Canada and it becoming a big patriotic deal, that he didn't want to lose the title in Canada. He was then asked to lose to Michaels on 12/7 in Springfield, Ma. Hart told McMahon that since Michaels had told both of them that he wasn't doing any more jobs in the territory, that he had a problem doing a job for somebody who wouldn't do a job back. He told McMahon that he didn't want to drop the title in Montreal. Later, McMahon, Pat Patterson, Michaels, and Hart had another meeting where Michaels, teary eyes, said that he was looking forward to returning the favor to Bret and once again talked about his mouth saying the stupidest things. Hart still refused to lose the title in Montreal.

The night before, he had been asked to put Hunter Heart Helmseley over in Oklahoma City via pin fall due to Michaels' interference, but changed the finish to a count out. On this night he was asked to tap out to Ken Shamrock, before the DQ ending involving Michaels, which he had no problem doing because he liked and respected Shamrock and wanted to help elevate him. The personal problems with himself and Michaels, which had become legendary in the business, resurfaced once again when the two and McMahon made an agreement to work together but to leave their respective families out of their interviews. It took just one week before Michaels did the interview talking about Stu Hart being dead but walking around Calgary because his body and brain hadn't figured it out yet. By this point, Hart had already stopped watching Raw because he had problems wit the content of the show because he has four children that were wrestling fans that he didn't want seeing the direction it was going, so he was reacting to the remark based on the fact that his father and brother Owen heard the remarks and were upset about them.

October 24, 1997 - McMahon, before the show at Nassau Coliseum, told Hart that the money situation in the company had changed and they would have no problems paying him everything promised in his contract. Hart told McMahon that WCW really hadn't made him a serious offer and that he really didn't want to leave but that he was still uncomfortable doing the job for Michaels in that situation. He left the country for the tour of Oman with the idea that he was staying with the WWF, but knowing due to his window in his contract, he had to make the decision to give notice by midnight on 11/1.

October 31, 1997 - Never one to work without a flair for the dramatics, Bischoff finally caught up with Hart who was basically incommunicado in a foreign land most of the week. Just one day before Hart had to either give notice or stay for another year, Bischoff made a huge concrete offer. We don't know the exact terms of the offer, only that Hart said of the $3 million per year figure that both Jim Ross and Jerry Lawler talked about on the 11/10 Raw, that "they don't have any idea what I was offered", but other close to the situation say that figure is "close enough that you couldn't call it wrong". Hart neither agreed nor turned down the deal, but gave the impression to WCW that they had a great shot at getting him.

November 1, 1997 - Hart had until midnight to make up his mind. He called McMahon and told him about the WCW offer and said that he wasn't asking for anymore money to stay, but that he wanted to know what his future in the WWF would be over the next two years as an active wrestler and that at this point he was leaning toward accepting the WCW offer. McMahon said he'd think about it and call him back in an hour with some scenarios. Before McMahon called back, Bischoff called again trying to solidify the deal. McMahon ended up calling back four hours later from his barber shop and told Hart he didn't know what he was going to do with him but that he should trust his judgment because of their past relationship. That he had made him into a superstar and he wanted him to stay and that he should trust him and asked Hart to give him idea of where he wanted to go. During the conversation, McMahon still brought up the scenario of wanting Hart to drop the title in Montreal, but promised that he would get it back in Springfield. "I realized he had given the top heel spot to Shawn, but to turn back babyface it was too soon," Hart said. Like in the negotiations one year earlier, it was going down to the wire and he had until midnight t make up his mind. When he was talking to McMahon, McMahon told him he could extend the deadline for giving notice. Hart asked for the permission in writing but McMahon told him that he was going out to a movie that night with his wife and said he was verbally giving permission to extend it and to get written permission from the chief financial officer of the company.

When Hart called to get the written notice he wasn't given it because he was told he couldn't get it in writing in such short notice. At 7pm Bischoff called again and presented a deal that, according to Hart, "would have been insane not to be taken". At that point Hart was really having mixed emotions. He somehow felt bad about leaving the WWF and was hoping McMahon would lay out a good set of scenarios for him and convince him to stay. At 9pm, McMahon called and, reversing fields once again, urged him to take the WCW offer. Hart told him that his heart was with the company and it would break his heart to leave, and that he appreciated everything McMahon and the company had done for him. McMahon told Hart that he wanted him back as a babyface, and had been wanting him to turn babyface for two or three months but just hadn't brought it up until this point. He then presented a scenario to Hart, presenting it as a way to get Hart to stay, but obviously designed to get Hart to take the WCW offer. He wanted Michaels to win the title in Montreal. For Springfield, they would do a final four match with he, Michaels, Undertaker, and Ken Shamrock, that Michaels would again win. At the Royal Rumble, the two would have a ladder match, which Michaels would win. On Raw, on 1/19 in Fresno, Ca., Hart would open the show and say that if he couldn't beat Michaels and win the title that night, that he would retire from wrestling, and in that match he would regain the title. And then in Boston at Wrestlemania he'd drop the strap to Austin. Hart looked at the scenario of four major losses with only one win and before his midnight deadline, gave official notice to the WWF and signed the contract WCW had sent over, with the agreement from all parties that the word wouldn't leak out until 11/10 to protect the Survivor Series PPV. Hart went so far as to have his few confidants sign written confidentiality letters to make sure word of his negotiations and signing with WCW didn't get out until 11/10.

November 2, 1997 - Hart and McMahon started a very amicable conversation with the pressure finally off and the decision for Hart to leave having been made. He again suggested that Michaels win the title in Montreal and in what will go down as perhaps the ultimate irony, said they could do s screw job ending to steal the title from him, and that the next night, on Raw, McMahon suggested the two get into a mock argument where Hart would punch him, blaming him for the screw job. McMahon even suggested to hardway him to make it look legit. Hart again refused to do the job in Montreal, saying that he had never refused to do a job but he wasn't going to lose on Sunday or Monday (at Raw in Ottawa). He agreed to put Michaels over in Madison Square Garden on 11/15, Springfield or anywhere else and said he'd put over Vader, Shamrock, Mankind, Undertaker or even Steve Lombardi. McMahon then made legal threats to Hart if he wouldn't lose in Montreal. Hart talked about the clause in his contract giving him "reasonable creative control" but McMahon claimed that refusing to drop the strap in Montreal wasn't "reasonable".

The two argued about the finish in Montreal and the legalities of their respective positions all day Sunday and well into the night before finally agreeing to do a DQ finish in Montreal. Then in Springfield, in the final four match, Michaels would win the title. Bret would then go out on Raw on 12/8 in Portland, Me. and give a farewell interview as a babyface to the WWF fans and put the company and McMahon over as big as possible. He would apologize to the American fans and try to reasonably explain his actions in a way to end his 14-year association with the WWF on the highest note possible, something largely unheard of in pro wrestling, so that all parties and the fans could come out if it and his legacy with the company with a good feeling. Technically there was a problem, in that his WCW contract began on 12/1 so Hart called Bischoff, who when presented the scenario, agreed to allow him to work through 12/8 with Titan. Hart asked an associate who monitors news for him if he thought it was possible to keep the secret from the public until 11/10. Hart specifically asked about being able to keep it secret from one person until after the show and the associated laughed and said they would be a million dollars that person already knew.

November 4, 1997 - McMahon called Hart and said that he had changed his mind. He suggested now that Michaels should lose clean in Montreal, then he'd "steal" the title with a controversial finish in Springfield and Hart would get to do his farewell speech in Portland. He said he was going to call Michaels and present the scenario to him. By this point word that Hart had signed with WCW had actually been reported the previous night on the Observer and Torch hotlines and it was only about one hour later before the folks who call those hotlines for much of their news started breaking the latest "biggest story in the history of wrestling" as their "exclusives". In response, WWF Canada released a press statement originally totally denying the story, claiming it was simply propaganda being spread by WCW. However, as the word got out Titan Sports in Connecticut a few hours later contradicting that story saying simply that Bret Hart was exploring all his options but not going any further, with the feeling that they wanted to protect the PPV show. Hart wouldn't publicly talk to anyone.

November 5, 1997 - The internet had paved the way for stories in the Calgary Sun, the Toronto Sun and one line in the Montreal Gazette in a PPV preview story about Steve Austin a line which resulted in the paper getting an incredible switchboard-blowing response of phone calls. McMahon called Hart and said that Michaels had agreed to the previous day's scenario, but that now he had changed his mind. He said the news was out everywhere and that Bret had to drop the belt before Monday because he couldn't have Bischoff go on television on 11/10 and announce the signing of his world champion while he still had the belt. Hart said that he would get Bischoff to postpone the announcement, but with Bischoff on a hunting trip all week in Wyoming. Hart couldn't get a hold of him. McMahon then asked Hart to drop the title on 11/8 at the house show in Detroit. Hart again refused, feeling the way everything had been built up, he wanted the match with Michaels, which in the wake of all the insider publicity was building up a life of its own like no match in the recent history of wrestling, to not come off as anti-climatic and for that to happen he needed to go into Montreal as champion. He said that he would drop the title any time after 11/12 suggesting he'd do it at the house shows in Youngstown,

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This is gonna ruffle a lot of feathers, but I have an idea about this whole screwjob thing. I believe it was a work...staged for our benefit. Bret was on his way out of the company anyway. Why would Vince just do that to one of his most valuabe employees? The guy he risked everything to get back just a year earlier? There was no room for the 40 year old Bret Hart in the WWF's new attitude era plans, with the anti-hero Steve Austin about to take over, so he just walked away.

Now, how does he walk away? With his head held high, saluting the fans, and giving an emotional speech? While it is a nice thought, it is a boring one. Would we still be talking about that almost 10 years later? I doubt it. They create this "real life" story about Bret and Vince arguing about the finish, and about the title, and we all believe whatever they tell us. Bret gets screwed, and conviently enough, the heel Shawn Michaels looks bad in our eyes. What a crazy thought, the WWF making their heel champion hated by the fans.

Also, this little stunt opened the door for Vince's most successful time, the whole Austin vs McMahon angle, which made him a billionaire. Convient, once again, that Vince was so hated by the fans so he could begin that whole storyline?

And lastly, the documentary made about him. Does anyone else find it strange that a camera crew just happened to be along for this little ride? And why would Vince or Bret allow a camera crew present during these stressful times? Oh, I remember why. Bret Hart is an actor on a television show. Why did we believe so quickly that it was real? Seems a little coincidental to me.

Anyway, this is just a thought. I have similar feelings on the Steve Austin walkout from 2002, but that will be for another time.

Thanks, Brodie

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I just realized the whole thing didn't go through so heres the rest

OH, on 11/13, Pittsburgh on 11/14, or in Madison Square Garden if they wanted it that soon rather than waiting for 12/7. Jim Ross on the company's 900 line acknowledged the statement that Hart was exploring other options said that nobody knows the real story, and in hyping the big match tossed in the phrase they'd be pushing in the final days leading up to the match--it will be their first meeting in 18 months, and most likely the final match between the two ever.

November 6,1997 - In a story in the Toronto Sun, Tiger Ali Singh, at a press conference promoting the WWF house show the next night in Toronto said of Hart's leaving. "It's very disheartening. He's not only been a mentor, but I've been a great admirer of him since I was a kid, and if he leaves you're going to see a whole bunch of other people leaving. And I'm not going to mention any names but WCW has been approaching a lot of people."

November 7, 1997 - There is no question that the power of online services when it comes to influence of pro wrestling was established this past week. It was generally portrayed that it was a power struggle between Hart and Michaels, that Michaels had won out, and to a lesser extent Hart was leaving over the direction of the product. While there was some truth to all of this, probably the greatest truth of all is it was simply a manipulation by McMahon to get out of a contract that in hindsight he wished he'd never offered. Whether Michaels who the wrestlers feel has McMahon's ear right now and has convinced him that what turned around WCW is Kevin Nash and Scott Hall and not Hulk Hogan and Roddy Piper, and that he should and the company should do what they do to get WCW over. There is also a feeling amongst WWF wrestlers that Michaels pushed McMahon in the direction to rid the company of his hated rival who had apparently one-upped him when signing the new deal that made him so much higher paid. Maybe it was simply economics because the company is in financial straights. Hart did have a lot of problems over the direction of the company and his own decision was partially made based on that, but it's clear in hindsight that McMahon had a strong hand in manipulating Hart decision to get out of the contract. In the vast majority opinion online from people who really had no clue as to what was really going on, Titan, McMahon and Michaels were coming off as major heels. The WWF's own online site said to be the domain of young kids with no clue about wrestling was besieged with reports about Hart leaving and the so-called marks were reacting very negatively toward Titan to the point Titan pulled all it folders by the early afternoon which caused another outcry of censorship of opinions from wrestling fans.

Finally McMahon responded publicly online with a letter of his own stating, "Over the past few days I have read certain comments on the internet concerning Bret Hart and his "alleged" reasons for wanting to pursue other avenues than the World Wrestling Federation to earn his livelihood. While I respect the "opinions" of others, as owner of the World Wrestling Federation I felt that it was time to set the record straight. As it has been reported recently online, part of Bret Hart's decision to pursue other options is "allegedly due to his concerns with the "direction of the World Wrestling Federation." Whereby each and every individual is entitled to his or her opinion I take great offense when the issue of the direction of the World Wrestling Federation is raised. In the age of sports entertainment, the World Wrestling Federation REFUSES to insult it audience in terms of "Baby Faces" and "Heels". In 1997, how many people do you truly know that are strictly "good" guys or "bad" guys? World Wrestling Federation programming reflects more of a reality based product in which life, as well as World Wrestling Federation superstars are portrayed as they truly are--in shades of gray...not black or white. From what I am reading it has been reported that Bret may be concerned about the morality issues in the World Wrestling Federation, Questionable language, Questionable gestures, Questionable sexuality, Questionable racial issues. Questionable? All of the issues mentioned above are issues that every human being must deal with every day of their lives. Also, with that in mind, please be aware that Bret Hart has been cautioned--on "numerous" occasions--to alter his language by not using expletives or God's name in vain. He was also told--on numerous occasions--not to use certain hand gestures some might find offensive. My point is: regardless of what some are reporting, Bret's decision to pursue other career options IS NOT genuinely a Shawn Michaels direction issue, as they would like you to believe! In the personification of DeGeneration X, Shawn Michaels character is EXPECTED to be living on the edge--which I might add Mr. Michaels portrays extremely well. The issue here is that the "direction" of the World Wrestling Federation is not determined by Shawn Michaels, OR Bret Hart for that matter. It is determined by you--the fans of the World Wrestling Federation. You DEMAND a more sophisticated approach! You DEMAND to be intellectually challenged! You demand a product with ATTITUDE and as owner of this company--it is my responsibility to give you exactly what you want! Personally, I regret the animosity that has built up between Shawn Michaels and Bret Hart, but in the end, it is the World Wrestling Federation that is solely responsible for the content of this product--NOT Bret Hart --NOT Shawn Michaels--NOT Vince McMahon for that matter. May the best man win at the Survivor Series!"

This only made the situation worse in regard to how fans were viewing McMahon and the company. "You demand to be intellectually challenged?" By doing racial angles. The fans chose that direction? They asked to see Michaels pull his pants down and jump up and down on television? Hart was booked for his first public appearance before the house show that night at the Sky Dome in Toronto. It was on a half hour TSN (The Sports Network, the Canadian version of ESPN) talk show called "Off the Record." Host Michael Landsberg opened the show saying the show had received more than 1000 calls to ask Hart if he was leaving for WCW. Despite the word being out everywhere by this point Hart would only go so far as to say that he had given his 30 day notice to the WWF, that he's reviewing offers from both groups and is strongly leaning going one way. "I'd like to really come more clean on this as I can, you know, that I have, but I have to do this thing by the book kind of thing." Hart categorized the split as not being a money issue but said that he and the WWF had "reached" kind of a crisis or we've reached professional differences as to what direction that the wrestling shows are taking. You know, I'm not saying I'm always right, but I feel that some of the content of the shows goes against my belief in what wrestling should be and can be. Later in the show he criticized Michaels and then stated that "wrestling is often scoffed at as a form of entertainment sometimes, or it used to be. I believe it came way up and I was very proud in the direction which has a lot to do with where I am right now today. Wrestling was cleaned up and it became something families could watch.

He talked about inner workings of the business having to trust the guy you are working with because you give them your body and said the real animosities and hatred that exists have to be set aside. He said that everything he has said about Shawn Michaels is about the Shawn Michaels character, but said that Michaels has said things that have hit a raw nerve with him to the point of it being unprofessional. The show aired the footage of the Shawn Michaels interview where he blamed the Hart Foundation for trashing the NOD dressing room and insinuating that Hart was a racist. Hart said that he doesn't blame Michaels for that, "That's obviously a promotional direction and that's a poor concept. I think that racial tension is something to be very very careful with. When you start messing around with racial things that I don't like." Hart said that he stopped watching Raw about five weeks earlier because he didn't like the direction and agreed when the host brought up Michaels calling him the Grand Wizard (a KKK reference, not a reference to a famous wrestling manager of the 70s) and then brought up what Michaels said about his father that he didn't see. You know I don't mind if anyone pokes fun at my dad. Jerry Lawler's made a living the last two or three years saying comments about my mom and dad but he's always fairly humorous about it. Actually I used to get offended at some of the things he used to say about my mother--until I realized that my mother thought they were humorous and this it was kind of OK with me. He then spoke at length about Brian Pillman. By this point in certain circles and particularly within the industry, interest in he match on Sunday due to all the uncertainty some of which was known and most of which actually wasn't had reached a level not seen in years.

For all of Hart and McMahon's wanting to keep the story quiet, word getting out was the greatest thing for the buy rate. There were 14,374 fans paying $496,674 at the Sky Dome one night before the show. To credit the huge house to the interest in Canada since Hart leaving had been reported in the local newspapers would be incorrect as WWF officials a week before the event had figured on a crowd of 15,000. Obviously some fans knew and there were chants of "you sold out" directed at Hart. Although this should have been expected and Hart had been a pro wrestler for 21 years and been around the business a lot longer than that, the chants in his home country knowing what he was going through did get to him. The main event was a six-man tag with Undertaker & Mankind & Austin vs. Bret & Smith & Neidhart, subbing for brother Owen who was supposed to start back but wasn't ready to return after a severe concussion from a few weeks earlier. Bret was asked to do the job for the stone cold stunner, debated the question for a while then refused figuring he was the only Canadian in the main event in the U.S. vs Canada type match with the big nationalistic angle and Austin ended up using the stunner on Neidhart instead.

November 8, 1997 - The WWF ran a house show in Detroit at Cobo Arena for what would turn out to be Bret Hart's final match in the United States as a wrestler for the World Wrestling Federation. Tensions were really high and the prospect of a double-cross were looming by this time in many of the more paranoid types. By really this was 1997 and this was the World Wrestling Federation. That's stuff from the 20's where the real bad guy low-lifes were running the business. The days of making Lou Thesz world champion because you needed someone who could handle himself in the case of a double-cross had been over for more than three decades. That day Hart went to the one member of the front office he knew he could trust, Earl Hebner. While there are what you call a lot of good acquaintances in this business Hart and Hebner were genuine close friends for years. Hart said he'd use his influence to get Hebner to referee the match because he wanted someone in the ring that he could trust. Hebner said he understood the situation and told Hart "I swear on my kids lives that I'd quit my job before double-crossing you" On a personal basis a little more than 24 hours later, remembrance of that conversation crushed him more than anything. At about the same time the WWF braintrust was in Montreal one day early. Vince McMahon held a meeting at the hotel with Jim Ross, Jim Cornette, Pat Patterson and Michaels. Reports are that at least two of the aforementioned names looked extremely uncomfortable leaving the meeting. Ross on the WWF 900 line filed a report saying due to the tension between Hart and Michaels that there would be armed security backstage and the two would dress as far apart from each other as possible. That was a total work since Michaels and Hart actually dressed together and were on professional terms the next afternoon. He also said that McMahon was not going to announce the show and instead would be handling any last minute problems backstage. Ross also hinted that it could be Hart's final match in the world Wrestling Federation something Hart at that point wasn't aware of.

November 9, 1997 - The Prelude - Imagine giving into the most anticipated match on the inside of pro wrestling in years and on the day of the show not having any semblance of a finish? McMahon and Hart met that afternoon and McMahon said something to the effect of "What do you want me to do? You've got me by the balls." Hart said that he just wants to leave the building with his head up. Hart said to McMahon "let me hand you the belt on Raw (the next night in Ottawa). Everyone knows I'm leaving I'd like to tell the truth on Raw Monday. At this point the "truth" wouldn't include talking about finances, contract breaches, arguments about finishes, or anything that would make McMahon or the company look bad publicly. McMahon said he agreed, that it was the right thing to do and the two shook hands on it. Hart and Michaels were dressing together putting together a match. Both were professional with one another and talking about putting on the best match possible in Hart's last hurrah. Agreeing to a DQ finish in about 17:00 after a lengthy brawl before the bell would even sound to start the match. As they were putting their spots together Patterson came in. He had a suggestion for a high spot in the match as a false finish. There would be a referee bump. Michaels would put Hart in his own sharpshooter. Hart would reverse the hold. Hebner would still be down at this point and not see Michaels tap out. Hart would release the hold to revive Hebner. Michaels would hit him when he turned around with the sweet chin music. A second ref, Mike Chioda, would haul ass to the ring and begin the count. A few paces behind Owen Hart and Smith and possibly Neidhart as well would run down to the ring. Chioda would count 1-2, and whomever got to the ring first likely Owen would drag Chioda out of the ring. While they think they've saved the day on the pin on Bret suddenly Hebner would recover 1,2, and Bret would kick out.

That would set the pace for about five more minutes of near falls before it would end up in a disqualification ending. Before the show started both Vader with his Japanese experiences and Smith told Hart to watch himself. He was warned not to lay down and not to allow himself to be put in a compromising position. He was told to kick out at one, not two and not to allow himself into any submission holds. Hart recognized the possibility of the situation but his thoughts regarding a double-cross were more along the lines of always protecting himself in case Michaels tried to hit him with a sucker punch when he left himself open. The idea that being put in a submission or one of the near falls while working spots would be dangerous for him would be something to worry about normally, but he put it out of his mind because he had Hebner in the ring as the referee.

The Match: People on the inside were watching this as close as on the outside. Would Bret do the job? Would Shawn do the job? Would Bret give Shawn a real beating before putting him over? The Molson Center was packed with more than 20,000 rabid fans, who up to that point had seen a largely lackluster undercard. While the fear going in about the word getting out of Hart leaving hurting the PPV most likely turned out to be just the opposite, the sellout was not indicative of that either or it was well known by the advance that the show was going to sellout one or two days early. It appeared that about 10 to 20 percent of the crowd knew Hart was leaving and there were negative signs regarding his decision and negative signs toward the promotion for picking Michaels above him or the direction that seemingly forced him to leave. Some things were also strange and not just the absence of McMahon from the broadcast. Hart the champion in the main event wasn't scheduled for an interview building up the match. When his name was announced early in the show there were many boos from fans who knew he signed with the opposition.

Once he got in the ring for the introduction, Michaels wiped his butt, blew his nose and then picked his nose with the Canadian flag. He then put the flag on the ground and began humping it. Hart was immediately established as a babyface. The two began the match as a brawl all around ringside and into the stands. The crowd was so rabid that it appeared there was genuine danger they'd attack Michaels. As one point they were brawling near the entrance knocking down refs as planned, knocking down Patterson as planned and as planned Hart and McMahon had an argument almost teasing the idea of a spot later in the match where Hart would deck McMahon. Yet it was also clear that everything going on was 100% professional and the only curiosity left at that point was how good the match was going to be (it appeared to be very good) and how would they get "out" of the match (with something nobody will ever forget). But one thing was strange. Why were so many agents circling the ring and why was McMahon right there and acting so intense? About eight minutes before the show was "supposed" to end, Bruce Prichard in the "Gorilla" position (kind of the on-deck circle for the wrestlers) was screaming into his headset that we need more security at the ring, Why? The had already done the brawl in the crowd. The finish was going to be a DQ and it was still several minutes away.

The Double-Cross: Hart climbed the top rope for a double sledge on Michaels. Michaels pulled Hebner in the way and Hart crashed on him. Just as planned. Michaels for a split second looked at McMahon and put Hart in the sharpshooter, just as planned. The next split seconds were the story. Chioda listening to his headpiece for his que to run in heard the backstage director scream to Hebner it was time to get up. Hebner, listening himself, immediately got up. Chioda started screaming that he wasn't supposed to get up. Owen Hart and Smith readying their run in were equally perplexed seeing him get up. Prichard was freaking out backstage saying that wasn't supposed to happen. Bret still not realizing anything was wrong laid in the hold for only a few seconds to build up some heat before the reversal. Michaels cinched down hard on the hold and glanced at Hebner and then looked away which more than one wrestler in the promotion upon viewing the tape saw as proof he was in on it, but than fed Bret his leg for the reversal. Hebner quickly looked at the timekeeper and screamed "ring the bell." At the same moment McMahon sitting next to the timekeeper elbowed him hard and screamed "ring the *beep* bell!"

The bell rang at about the same moment Bret grabbed the leg for the reversal and Michaels fell down on his face on the mat. Michaels' music played immediately and was immediately announced as the winner and new champion. Hebner sprinted out of the ring on the other side, into the dressing room through the dressing room and into an awaiting car in the parking lot that already had the motor running and was going to take him to the hotel where he'd be rushed out of town with his ticket home instead of staying to work the two Raw tapings. Michaels and Hart both leaped to their feet looking equally mad, cursing in McMahon's direction and glaring at him. Hart spit right in McMahon's face. The cameras immediately pulled away from Hart and to Michaels. Vince screamed at Michaels to pick the *beep* belt up and get the *beep* out of there.

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I think if it was a work then Bret would've admitted it by now. But I do think you were right about some of what you've said. I think the reason Vince screwed Bret over, the only logical reason he could've done it, is to make himself and HBK the most hated guys in the business. It probably added a *beep* of heat to the Austin/McMahon feud. I definitely don't think Bret was in on it though.

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the real bad guys in the screw job, is earl hebner, and vince mcmahon, they both were in on it.. they knew wtf was going on, and it was really earl hebner who screwed bret, i mean, why did he get up after he was knocked down, the plan was for earl hebner to stay down, until mike chioda came in the ring, and initially bret would reverse the sharpshooter and bret would ultimately win the match.

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I agree with ya Killa, it was a classless way for the WWF to close
the book on Bret Hart. He deserved better.

You know, the one thing that cracks me up is the way that the WWF(now
WWE) always acts surprised that Shawn Micheals takes heat whenever
he has a match in Canada. Wrestling with shadows has aired many times
on TSN and gets frequent replays on the Documentry channel so this
controversy will never go away.

The only thing that might settle it is for Bret to be admitted into
the WWE hall of fame and receive a public apology from McMahon but
I doubt that will ever happen


"pack of monkeys in my pocket,
my sisters ready to go"

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Thing is, Shawn gets grilled for it, but he wasnt in on it. He says that when they are in the locker room. Even at the end you can see Shawn yelling at Vince before he storms to the back.

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Did Bret get screwed?

From Vince’s perspective-

The reason Vince was terrified of Bret turning up at WCW with the WWF title had nothing to do with Medusa and the Women's title.

Remember when Ric Flair left the NWA with the world title and immediately began working for the WWF? Flair was going to have to drop the title and instead decided that he would keep it (partly because they wouldn't return his $38,000 collateral on it). It's all covered in his autobiography.

Imagine if Bret had beat Shawn that night and then didn't bother to turn up on RAW the next night. He'd be on the competition's show (who were more popular at the time) and could bury the WWF title if he wanted to. I don't think Bret would have done that, but could Vince really take that chance?

Bret Hart had creative control for the last few weeks of his contract yes, but Vince sure as hell didn't foresee that meaning Bret could walk out of the WWF with the title.

As far as most promoters and wrestlers are concerned, you’re leaving a promotion - you drop the title. Not very complicated.

I can also see things from Bret's point of view -

He worked loyally for the WWF for many years while almost everyone else jumped back and forth between promotions; he always worked hard and picked up the pieces when the latest "star" fell flat on his face.

Was it too much to ask for him to keep the title at Montreal and gracefully hand it over the next night? Not really. He would have been happy, Vince would have been happy and it would be a nice way for the fans to say goodbye.

Sadly, this is wrestling and things are never what they seem. Vince had a legitimate argument and Bret had a legitimate argument. It was a stalemate, Vince knew it so he made a decision.

I feel so bad for Bret that it ended that way, but looking at Vince it's obvious that he didn't want the Hitman's departure to be so painful either.

But the good news is that in the not-too-distant future we may actually see these two guys together in a WWE ring. Now who isn’t excited at the prospect of seeing a true shoot between these guys after all these years?

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I find it interesting when people say Hart didn't draw, when his stardom was during the steroid scandal. Would you really want to tune in to see juiced athletes. I felt ashamed for a while because of those pricks who took the easy way out of things. But the fact, Hart was a star during the steroid problem, so it's no wonder he didn't draw.

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One of the many problems that WWF had at that time was that there were simply no world-class opponents for Bret to wrestle. Shawn and Undertaker aside, who else did they have? Bam Bam? Kama? No wonder no-one was watching WWF. Hogan was a very poor wrestler, but his opponents made him loook awesome. Bret was an awesome wrestler, the countless guys he carried dragged him down.

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To the person who said Shawn wasn't in on it, because hw was angry also...that was some acting on his part. He was instructed by Vince, Briscoe, and Patterson to act pissed so Bret wouldnt freak out and maul him. Shawn has already admitted his role.

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One thing needs to be pointed out. Bret could not show up on Nitro following the PPV because of the contract. WCW could have announced they signed Bret....which was the fear, having WCW announce they signed Bret..the champion.

I am a huge Bret Hart fan, and because of this situation...I've always held a grudge towards HBK, Vince and every one else who was in on it....but I still respect what they have accomplished. HBK for instance....is one of the greatest.

With that said and from hearing both Bret and Vince speak about the situation now......communication seems to be what caused all of this. Vince had a great reason for doing what he did....he shouldn't have done it though. It was low class but it was for the buisness. Its unfortunate that they couldn't have come to a agreement where both sides were happy. Vince should have put his foot down to Brett and said..."Hey, I can't risk WCW ruining our company...you have to drop"....now that could have been adding Shamrock or the Undertaker to the match....two guys I think Bret would have liked to lost to over HBK in Montreal if forced to lose in Canada. Again...the contract with control comes back in.

Ugly mess all around and its a shame that both sides couldn't have worked it out before that night. Brett shouldn't be blamed as the Big Show hints at in the Vince DVD(Big Show uses the past crap of that Bret wanted to walk out the champ...which isn't true). So for reminders....Bret could not have shown up on WCW the next night....the fear was WCW announcing they had signed the WWE champ. Another fact...Bret was willing to job to a lot of wrestlers...including HBK....but Vince had put him into some very akward positions.

My opinion on it.

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You know, I noticed you all blaming Vince and Shawn, but hey... what about Triple HHH? He was in it too. You can't see this? No disrespect, but,
I mean come on, Look at it, Bret get screwed even though Bret says he will drop it the next night, but they screwed him. Now, Shawn is fooling around with the DX Reunion after years later...with Triple HHH... what that tell you? They all in it man, all that stuff going on in the WWE today, it all a game of loyalty. Now, today, you got...


Cena he has a movie coming out... whoa, since when some wrestler comes in the ring less than 5 years and become somebody to be a movie star produced by WWE?

Basatia, whoa, he been fooling around with those Divas backstage since he dated Melina and now Rebecca Diperto whatever her name is and getting title shot after rehab of recent surgery with Booker T, who in the WWE get that chance? If I remember correctly, Austin neck was having problems and he never get a title shot like that in 1 month or 3. He waited All damn year! Don't give me storyline crap.
.
Ric Flair, so damn loyal and close since Triple HHH is the best man for his 4th wife whatever it is for keep his carcass in the bussiness to get his paycheck even if he not getting a belt around his waist and talking trash about Bret in the papers.


and Randy Orton, Wow! I surprised they didn't fire his carcass after all the suspension and crack he did with people back stage. But lucky he close to Vince Son in Law, Paul, or should I say, Triple HHH, Randy is not in the Unemployment line. But as you can see now, he not working much with HHH and Ric Flair or the main event since he got suspended. So, it possible he won't get any title shot in the next 5 years. Besides, no one want to work with him.


Those guys are getting around since that they hang with Triple HHH and Shawn back stage. They all getting easy shot because of those two since they close to Vince. Oh hey, don't forget since Triple HHH married to the "BOSS" daughter, don't you noticed since that time, The Rock, Steve Austin and lots of guys in the back are leaving since?

I know for a fact, well all of us know, that The Rock doesn't like Shawn, but Triple HHH, it a different story since The Rock family is close to the Mcmahons, so he has to like him without a choice. Since he close to the Mcmahons, he gotten a chance in Movies since Vince produced The Rundown. Don't give that Scorpion King and Mummy 2 crap, The Rock movie carrer barely got anywhere since after The Rundown. Jesus Christ, Admit it.

Steve Austin, well, I know he doesn't like Triple HHH that much... But Shawn, Austin doesn't hang much with him, just business to him. since he pretty cool with Owen Hart because those times when he with Owen's good friend, Debra, Austin Ex-wife, and now as you can see, he doing well with Bret since the Hall Of Fame 2006. Now, Austin getting a chance to be in movies, whoa, at last the Mcmahon takes some money from their pocket to help him out since they make a huge Billion forturne from the Austin 3:16 era for the last 10 years unlike Cena.


Since that Screw job on Bret, everything changed in the WWE. HHH and Shawn has been getting the easy way out in that business more than anyone else. Title shots, fames, storylines, more that any other wrestlers in the back, past and present. Even Shawn admitted that he screwed Bret on TSN Off the Record. Triple HHH waggles his eyes when Bret spoke at the Hall of Fame 2006. Get the picture people, I am surprised you people didn't see this all this time. Vince has the last say and Loyalty is the key to him.


Now, as far I concerned, I am a Canadian, I just like all fans of Austin and Bret, I am huge one too since I was a kid. But I do like Triple HHH, but I don't forgive what he done to Bret. Not by a longshot. As far as Shawn Micheals goes, I don't like him one bit. Past or Present. They can say all the crap, the reborn Christian, the way that Dean Malenko said "he one the most professional wrestlers to work with" and all that.. is pure BS. I am not blind, I know a loyalty when I see one. I watch wrestling all my life, I seen how they go with the storylines and all that....because, I was there at the Survior Series 1997. I seen all at the front row.

Bottom Line..

Yes of coarse Bret got screwed from Vince.

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I have 2 questions that noone has been able to answer:
1. Who was Bret Hart talking about when he said he wanted to keep it a secret? Bret Hart's associate said he would bet a million dollars that that person already knew. Who are they talking about?

2. Dave Meltzer reports that the whole story has not come out yet and will not until one of the person's dies. Who is he talking about and what more could come out that we don't know?

If anyone can provide any insight into this, it would be greatly appreciated.

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OK 1st thing is you need to chill ksubzero. But you can't say that the screwjob led to DX being the main guys. Triple H knew what was happening (HBK said that in his book) but at that time he didn't even know Stephanie McMahon. But what I really wanna know is what does the DX Reunion, Randy Orton, Batista, Steve Austin's movie and John Cena got to do with The screwjob. Your post doesn't make sense.

As for the screwjob I think it's about time that WWE should move on. Everyone should realise it's 10 years ago, everyone has changed and we should leave the screwjob alone. Vince even moved the venue for Suvivor Series 2007 from Canada to America. The only thing that needs to happen to prove that it's over and done with is no Bret talk during the build-up to Suvivor Series 2007. Then we shall see if this is over.

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Yes sir, yes he was. He put so much "Hart" into his craft and all that Bret wanted was to exit gracefully and win in front of his countrymen. For Vince to embarrass Bret in front of his home crowd just showed how petty he really is. I mean, come on! Bret wasn't getting any money or losing any. He was just to show up and put on a show for Vince. Bret wasn't asking for money or anything. All's he wanted was to go out with a bang. Vince robbed him of this along with those little DX fairies. They say they were not involved but you could so tell that everyone was involved. Is there proof? Yes, Owen would be murdered shortly thereafter to further silence everyone. I think that Vince belongs in jail for he is a very crooked man with no morals whatsoever.

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After hashing and rehashing this story for almost 10 years, I think that Vince McMahon did all Bret was allowing him to do. How could Bret, who gets painted like the selfless, "Do anything for the business", refuse to do a job at a big pay per view when he is on his way out.

I think it was Terry Funk who once said that a true wrestler goes out on his back. Bret refused to give back to the company that made him a star, and capitalize on his status as champion with his new employer.

So, in closing, it is clear to me that it was indeed Bret who screwed Bret. While I don't think Vince McMahon did the right thing in Montreal, it was all that he could do. He was backed into a corner, and I don't think he should be painted as the villian in all of this...as the old saying goes, it takes two to tango.

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Brett did it for his legacy if you want to talk about selfishiness ITS HOGAN he is terrible. WWE is *beep* now, Vince wasn't backed into a corner he was just paranoid and yes Wrestling has died out UFC is the new thing and POKER !!

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If Shawn had jobbed to Bret like he was supposed to at WM 13, instead of vacating a title belt (for the 'nth time)- then I could see the argument that Bret screwed Bret. But if Shawn did not want to lose to Bret, why should Bret want to lose to Michaels after he already put the prick over at WM 12 and Shawn hadn't returned the favor?

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Its funny, but back in 1997, I always thought that Shawn's character was getting really lame, with that "lost my smile" speech. I always had a feeling that he would jump ship to WCW to be with his buddies, Hall and Nash. In early 1997, Hart was more entertaining, especially with his feud with Austin. Towards the end of that year, however, when DX was formed and the screw job occured, I just knew that Vince was desperate to beat out the competition. I like HBK and DX for that matter. I think that they revolutionized wreslting, dont get me wrong, but what those guys did to Bret Hart was despicable. As far as Bret dropping the belt in Canada, well I think that Vince shouldv'e let him do it the next night. I don't think Bret would've screwed him by going over to WCW with the belt. I don't think Bret had that much disrespect for Vince.

That said, as I mentioned a couple of years back, Bret and Shawn, have gone on with their lives. They both have experienced many things (Owen dying, Bulldog dying, Shawn's drug problems, and injured back), and I think that now, they both are at peace at what happened. If not well, that is up them.

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"If Shawn had jobbed to Bret like he was supposed to at WM 13, instead of vacating a title belt (for the 'nth time)- then I could see the argument that Bret screwed Bret. But if Shawn did not want to lose to Bret, why should Bret want to lose to Michaels after he already put the prick over at WM 12 and Shawn hadn't returned the favor? "

This guy hit it right on the money. This is what is true here. Shawn refused to lose to Bret long before the screwjob. Vince screwed Bret before the screwjob as well. Vince made a decision when he told Bret that he couldn't afford him anymore. Bret would have stayed for less money, yet McMahon forced him out of the company which created the entire scenerio in the first place. McMahon chose Michaels long before. Bret should have never been in a situation where he was even leaving the company to begin with. Vince created that situation, not Bret... and because of that, he couldn't let Bret go with title, and screwed him.

And how the hell did DX revolutionize wrestling? They were the WWF's second rate version of the nWo.

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DX was not a second-rate version of tne NWO. They were totally different. I likeed them both, but they were different. But I agree with you on the first part.

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Bret Hart just comes across as a whiner, to me. If you wanna be in a position where you get to have a say in the outcome of matches, then you become a booker. Wrestlers are there to wrestle. They get paid millions and their share of the limelight, so the least they can do is to do as their boss asks. Yes, it was unscrupulous of Vince to go back on their agreement - but Bret had already shown himself not to be a team player, thinking of his own reputation before making sacrifices to move the company forward. The key word is 'entertainment'; there's no such thing as integrity of character in a profession that is coordinated using pre-planned results.

You look at the rare breed of performer who've had an unbroken run with one company - I bet during their tenure they've had angles they disliked or didn't totally jive with, but they've worked it out somehow and done as requested, because that's what they're paid for. Millions of ordinary civilian workers have aspects of their jobs that are tough to swallow, but they take it as part of the deal... Why should wrestlers expect to be treated differently?






Born when she kissed me, died when she left me, lived whilst she loved me

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Bret is a whiner, and so are the canadian fans who whine,"Bret got screwed."
No, he didnt.
Bret was a childish baby. The honor tradition is you lose, not only do you lose, you lose your last few matches. Look at how Nash-Hall left, they were jobbing left and right. Vince did right by Bret, he wasn't jobbing left and right, he was the d@mn champ. What does Vince ask, put the guy over we are giving the company too "Shawn Michaels, idc if you like the guy this was "WWF's" guy. " Try this at your job, it wont fly with the boss.

Bret "hands" the title over to Vince, and HBK goes out he can't beat Hart. How does this make WWF look strong, no, Bret was a little baby. He needed to job the title, end of story.

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