MovieChat Forums > The People's Court (1997) Discussion > She can call him "honey" but he can't sa...

She can call him "honey" but he can't say "girl"

posted 10 years ago by CrystalBlu
19 replies | jump to latest

I love Judge Milian, but there are times when I just wanna say "whoa, wait a minute, girlie"! The episode about the stock scammer on 5/27, the plaintiff's witness refers to the women that were hired in as "girls" (which I happen to find extremely normal and okay by me. Being a female myself, I love being called "one of the girls" and such). Anyway she makes a big to-do about it... like she ALWAYS does... and says "Girls? Were they children"? No? "Okay then they were women". And the guy has to apologize, "Oh yes, sorry I meant women". I mean give me a break. Then in the next sentence, Milian's calling the plaintiff "honey"! Some people don't like being called honey and sweetheart by strangers. I mean talk about a double standard!

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

Milian is taking that PC nonsense too far when she objects to females being called "girls," especially when no disrespect was intended.

As for her calling men "honey," well, I like her down to earth, friendly style, but a judge calling people "honey" comes off as very unprofessional, in my opinion.

Maybe her producers have never called her on it. But, there was one obnoxious litigant (I think he was a lawyer) who called her on it -- and she threw him out of the courtroom.

The tape may still be on YouTube.

[–] CrystalBlu 10 years ago

Exactly, when no disrespect was intended. What I was wondering is if she never likes to say things like "having lunch with the girl's" (not meaning her daughters) or "the girls in the office and I...". I have always loved being called "one of the girls", regardless of my age, and especially now, no longer being a spring chicken! 

I have never had a problem with being called "honey" or "dear" by a stranger, whether it be waitress, or my auto mechanic. I rather like it as a matter of fact. And I wouldn't care so much about her saying it if she didn't chastise men for calling women "girls"! It was kinda cute and funny in the past when some older folks have called her by a term of endearment and she knew they were just saying it as part of their old-fashioned ways. Even she got a kick out of it.

You gotta admit, the dynamics between her and some of the smart butts can be pretty entertaining.

[–] GraceFromSoCal 10 years ago

My dear friend, Gubbio...I TOTALLY disagree with you!! 

Milian is taking that PC nonsense too far when she objects to females being called "girls," especially when no disrespect was intended.

Let's look at this a little, okay? Let's say that you're talking about some male adult people you recently hired; would you say, "the boys I hired"? *I* most definitely would not. But then, I ALSO wouldn't say, "the girls I hired." They're NOT girls unless they're under 18.

As far as I'm concerned, the only way to successfully argue that this "PC nonsense" is going too far is when the flip-side of it is also being done. (Sorry, this is hard to figure out how to write in words!) I mean that if you think calling grown women "girls" is okay, then you must also think, and do it, that calling grown men "boys" is okay. And I don't mean in the familiar way that people who are friends do, like "a night out with the girls" or "it's a boys night poker game." So if you're okay with saying things like "the boy at my doctor's office" [referring to a male physician] or "the boys in the IT department," then I guess it's okay if you call women girls.

If anyone called *ME* a girl at work, well, frankly, they'd have been fired. By me, the girl. 

--

http://www.CaliforniaDreamsPhotography.com

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

Disagree, Grace. If no disrespect was intended, your position is just PC nonsense.

The world has gone crazy, with people just looking for something to be offended over.

And frankly, this NONSENSE offends ME. 

[–] GraceFromSoCal 10 years ago

Disagree, Grace. If no disrespect was intended, your position is just PC nonsense.

So referring to GROWN WOMEN as children is okay, as long as no disrespect is intended? Sorry, but the way I see it, disrespect is INHERENT in calling grown women children. Just like it would be in calling grown men children.

I have no problem with the chummy/familiar terms "guys" and "gals" to refer to men and women, such as "the guys/gals in the office." But BOYS and GIRLS? No. Definitely not--especially since it's only the latter that actually gets used. No one refers to adult men as boys, yet you're saying it's perfectly fine for people to call adult women girls, as long as they're not intending any disrespect. The very action of equating adult women with children *IS* disrespectful.

--

http://www.CaliforniaDreamsPhotography.com

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

So referring to GROWN WOMEN as children is okay, as long as no disrespect is intended? Sorry, but the way I see it, disrespect is INHERENT in calling grown women children. Just like it would be in calling grown men children.

I have no problem with the chummy/familiar terms "guys" and "gals" to refer to men and women, such as "the guys/gals in the office." But BOYS and GIRLS? No. Definitely not--especially since it's only the latter that actually gets used. No one refers to adult men as boys, yet you're saying it's perfectly fine for people to call adult women girls, as long as they're not intending any disrespect. The very action of equating adult women with children *IS* disrespectful.

Where we differ is in interpretation. You AUTOMATICALLY assume that "girls and boys" means CHIDLREN. *I* don't see it that way or take it that way, and I would never mean it that way.

In all honestly, if a boss of mine said, "I'll put my boys right to work on it," I wouldn't think twice about it -- unless I was looking to be offended or looking for something to bitch about.

So, I cannot relate to your angst on this subject. It still seems like PC bullshít to me. We'll have to agree to disagree.....

But on the OP's original statement:

How do you feel about JM calling (either sex) honey or sweetie?

I know it's her friendly manner, but since she's play acting "a judge," I find that more of a breach of etiquette than the words "girls" or "boys."

[–] GraceFromSoCal 10 years ago

You AUTOMATICALLY assume that "girls and boys" means CHIDLREN. *I* don't see it that way or take it that way, and I would never mean it that way.

Let's see what my good friend Merriam-Webster thinks:

girl
noun \ˈgər(-ə)l\

: a female child
: a young woman
: a usually young woman from a specified kind of place

Full Definition of GIRL
1 a : a female child from birth to adulthood
. b : daughter
. c : a young unmarried woman
. d sometimes offensive : a single or married woman of any age

2 a : sweetheart
. b sometimes offensive : a female servant or employee

Source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/girl

http://www.CaliforniaDreamsPhotography.com

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

Let's see what my good friend Merriam-Webster thinks:

My good friend, Grace: Now, you are being ridiculous.

We all know that language is fluid, and things have to be taken in context.

Believe whatever you choose. I still think you're wrong -- and just looking for something to be offended over.



[–] GraceFromSoCal 10 years ago

My dear Gubster, it's okay, let's just do what you said earlier and agree to disagree on this. 

I know that language is fluid, but I also know that words that SOME people use can hurt. Like "girl" when referring to an adult female. That's because--even when, as you keep saying, there is no disrespect INTENDED--there's an inherent disrespect they're not even aware of. The type of man who refers to adult women as girls is probably, secretly a male chauvinist--but perhaps doesn't even realize it himself. Or perhaps he does. My late brother was a *HUGE* male chauvinist, although if you asked him point-blank he would deny it, vehemently. But, see, he resented "girls" who'd made it on to the same fire department he had, the prestigious Los Angeles City FD. He was absolutely convinced that there was some hanky-panky...SOMEWHERE...that got them there. Either they were having sex with someone, or their father was a big-shot in the department, or they got there because of anti-discrimination laws, or SOMETHING. He couldn't accept that they had passed the same, uber-rigorous physical and written tests he had. He saw nothing wrong with calling them girls--but I did.

--

http://www.CaliforniaDreamsPhotography.com

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

"Girlfriend,"  you can't always look for hidden or psychological meanings behind words. It's exhausting!

Sometimes, a cigar is just a cigar. 

[–] LittleBrother55 10 years ago

She's gotten better about this over the years, but unfortunately Judge Milian harbors a definite double standard about terms of address.

For a long time, she even busted on litigants who addressed her as "ma'am" instead of "Your Honor". This kind of fussiness is inappropriate, especially when interacting with small-claims litigants. True, the litigants appearing on the show who've had actual court experience-- and there are many-- should know better.

But it's just obnoxious to berate laypersons who are obviously trying to be polite, and despite volunteering to be on national TV are certainly somewhat nervous and flustered, or at least self-conscious.

Of course, it's well-known that many real-life practicing judges are self-important egomaniacs, so I guess one could say that this disagreeable trait is authentic.

Also, my guess is that the starring judges (not just the current one), producers, and uncritical fans buy into the idea that "rank hath its privileges". If so, to them it's not only realistic, it's perfectly OK if the presiding judges demand proper protocol from the (inferior) litigants while giving themselves permission to be as "folksy" as they want.

Not being an authoritarian or authoritarian-submissive type, I disagree.

[–] GaelinW 10 years ago

I can't recall of a time when she calls someone "honey" in general terms. She tends to use it either when it's someone very young or naive and she's being "motherly" or she does mean it in a subtly demeaning manner particularly when used with men.

As for being referred to as a "girl" or "one of the girls", it depends on context. Being called "one of the girls" by my mother, sister, girlfriends, or coworkers with whom I have a friendly, personal relationship is completely different than being referred to as "one of the girls" by someone who is my coworker ro boss with whom I only have a business, working relationship.

In the workplace it is a holdover from when working women were seen as less than by their male counterparts. And while I agree the speaker may not intend disrespect that doesn't mean disrespect isn't felt (it can be intentionally disrespectful. It depends on the context and speaker). I don't find fault with Judge Milian for bringing it too the attention of the speaker so he can be aware of it.

I see it as similar to calling an African American man "boy". The speaker may not mean to be disrespectful (depending on age and where/how he grew up). It may be force of habit. But it is something that should be brought to his attention as no longer being acceptable.

As you say, some people don't like being called "honey" or "sweetheart" by strangers. Same goes for being referred to as "girl" as a grown woman especially in the workplace. Come to think of it, I can't think of many men of any race who would appreciate being called "boy" by their boss in the workplace either.

I don't trust people who don't like pets and I don't trust people who pets don't like.

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

Being called "one of the girls" by my mother, sister, girlfriends, or coworkers with whom I have a friendly, personal relationship is completely different than being referred to as "one of the girls" by someone who is my coworker ro boss with whom I only have a business, working relationship.

In the workplace it is a holdover from when working women were seen as less than by their male counterparts.

This is PC nonsense. People are just looking for something to complain about.

I see nothing wrong with saying "the girls in the office" if no disrespect is intended.

My 81 year old neighbor like to go out and have "lunch with the girls," and not one of them has been a "girl" in 60 years.

You're being ridiculous.

PS - And, Milian DOES often call a male litigant "honey" is a dismissive tone when she disagrees with him, or is trying to clarify his testimony.

I'm not offended by it, but I would think that level of familiarity unprofessional of a REAL judge.

[–] GaelinW 10 years ago

I see nothing wrong with saying "the girls in the office" if no disrespect is intended.

Hate to break it to you, but what YOU feel is irrelevant to what someone else feels. The world doesn't revolve around you. Others are allowed to feel differntly than you without being belittled for it.

My 81 year old neighbor like to go out and have "lunch with the girls," and not one of them has been a "girl" in 60 years.

And as I said - in the part of my post you quoted as a matter of fact - being referred to as "the girls" by someone with whom I would "lunch" is different from being referred to as such by someone with whom I only have a professional relationship.

You're being ridiculous.

Well, what you think I am being is irrelevant to both my point and yours. So saying such was unnecessary. But if attempting to belittle me makes you feel better about you, go for it.

PS - And, Milian DOES often call a male litigant "honey" is a dismissive tone when she disagrees with him, or is trying to clarify his testimony

.
And I said as much in the first paragraph, except I used the word "demeaning". But I guess in your rush to call me "ridiculous" or dismiss what I've written as "PC nonesense [sic]" actual comprehension of my post escaped you.

I'm not offended by it,

Bully for you. But as I've already said, the world doesn't revolve around you and what you feel.

but I would think that level of familiarity unprofessional of a REAL judge.

Yet, apparently in your opinion objecting to that "level of familiarity" in an office is "PC nonsense. Go figure.

I don't trust people who don't like pets and I don't trust people who pets don't like.

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

PC nonsense.....

[–] GaelinW 10 years ago

Yes, it is so much easier just dismiss and name call than to actually argue a point.

I don't trust people who don't like pets and I don't trust people who pets don't like.

[–] Gubbio 10 years ago

Yes, it is so much easier just dismiss and name call than to actually argue a point.

There's no point to argue. You're entitled to your opinion, and I'm entitled to mine.

My opinion is that you are spouting PC crap.

You obviously need to have the last word, so have at it.

Bye! 

[–] rrattbbooyy 10 years ago

You wanna see PC nonsense, go look up the word "cisgender". "Honey" or "girl" is nothing.

[–] CrystalBlu 10 years ago

I sure appreciate all the input. Just goes to show that there are differing opinions regarding every aspect of language and life.

I did chuckle to myself during a recent ep when Judge Milian referred to herself as a "Florida GIRL"!

I imagine that context really does make a huge difference. I just don't recall ever being insulted when being called one of the girls in the office, even by my boss. Maybe because I've always had good relationships with my bosses and co-workers, and never in the least thought they were speaking in a derogatory or chauvinistic manner.

I get that point about being called "boy" as well, but that also can easily be misconstrued by someone of a more sensitive nature.