I was expecting some crazy branch davidians or David Koresh followers but I guess there not here. This film was really interesting though, I think it shows the utter corruption of all governments and ours (america) is no different than others who try to cover up wrong doings.
shareThere's not a whole lot to talk about. We have a sometimes corrupt and often incompetent government. Everyone does. Some more so than others. The story of Waco is unremarkable except for it's scale. Civilians are killed regularly by government officials.
shareI thought that a government invading a group of religous people in there society was very much remarkable. And the cover up was preatty remarkable. Even though innocent people get killed everyday I thought the events of Waco were, if anything, remarkable.
share... It was known that he had grenade launchers and other heavy artillery; yet the decision was to tackle him on his own turf, rather than apprehend him on one of his daily trips out into 'normal' civilisation...
It'll be OK, to walk on tiptoes everyday...
ATF failed the test miserably here. What a foul up. 51 Days? Why not 151 days? The hostages in Iran survived much longer... and eventually got out.
This broad action by the Feds reminds me of the "destroy it to save it" kind of thinking. So light it up? Who gave that instruction? Why not infiltrate, wait, arrest him when he is out, etc? What was the evidennce of abuse so compelling as to warrant acting as a armed catalyst to an ongoing conflict?
Why was the problem solving thinking here so limited? No other soulition to this whole thing but tanks? Bigger and bigger guns? Where does any military build up ultimately aimed? War. Wasn't this an example of preemptive strike?
Didn't the ATF essentally declare war on this cult of fools and criminals? Our best and brightest can't outwit a looney bird bin? Why not?
The film was, lets face it, biased as hell towards the Davidians. But that doesn't change the fact that it still did an amazing job of letting those involved hang themselves with there own words, showing them testifying to one thing only to show footage that proves undeniably that they were lying, it was mind blowing at times.
Here's my take on what happened: My gut feeling (take that for whatever its worth) is that someone from high up, whether that be Janet Reno or most likely Bill Clinton, decided that the situation was becoming politically embarrassing and quietly demanded that the ATF/FBI end the situation immediately (regardless of whether or not they were ready) or some careers were going to be mysteriously cut short. So given that, general incompetence, the obvious indifference and even outright contempt some of them had for the cultists, they decided to basically bulldoze them out right then and there, and as saying goes "let god sort them out".
I doubt that they intended to kill so many because even if they were that morally bankrupt they would still have to realize that there would be hell to pay later, they probably thought most of them would come out willingly as soon as the first tanks struck and it was clear time had run out. But with that that being said they still acted like they thought "Hey, if a few of them get killed in the process? They're just a bunch of backwoods, rightwing nuts, no one is going to care"
It may not have been outright murder, but I'm willing to bet a lot of them could have been convicted of manslaughter if someone truly prosecuted them, they acted as recklessly as a drunk getting behind the wheel.
Most of them are dead now. Boy, the Clinton Administration really got off to a terrible start, didn't it?
shareRauol Duke, one word carnivore. In this country, they lock muslim's up for playing paintball for crissakes. Who wants to make themselves a target, even in a supposedly anonymous enviroment.
shareThe situation at Waco was completely due to OUR government allowing the FBI to act in a severely hostile and inappropriate manner that caused many innocent people to die a horrific death. Also, why would you think that any *living* Koresh followers would even want to talk about what happened on the Internet after seeing how a government agency slaughtered their friends and relatives. How could they feel safe even talking about it?
"If a king can't sing, it ain't worth being king."
Like I've said on the other topics, please try a less biased "documentary" for information on Waco. I found http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/waco/ was a particular good source, critical of the mistakes of both sides in this tragedy. The FBI and ATF most certainly fouled up in their controlling of the situation, much like the Russian military did in Beslan recently, but the Davidians were responsible for their own deaths, choosing to both start the fire as well as stay in the burning building rather than compromise their faith.
share[deleted]
some of the survivors at waco have a message board online. email me for details if interested at [email protected] ...........
shareThe majority of Branch Davidians are probably either dead, or have left, by now...
It'll be OK, to walk on tiptoes everyday...
imdb-864,Col.David Hackworth,United States Army (Ret.) said that the attitude of the Pentagon was-and probably still is,"If it's practical,don't do it."Generally speaking,governments operate on the exact same level.
sharealex jones started the effort to rebuild a church for the surviving davidians on the same site in waco. it was completed in 2000. i have lots of late breaking info about the davidians if anyone is interested. email me at [email protected]
I believe two things after seeing the film:
1 David Koresh AKS Vernon Howard was a vicious and manipulative psycopath who took over the Branch Davidians by force, got its followers to give up thier wives and children to him and lured them into a fatal showdown with the Feds.
and
2 The ATF, FBI, Janet (psychobitch) Reno and KKKlinton went on a vendetta agains Koresh. They took the compound by force and used lethal gas and deliberately killed the 50 something people inside. The films evidence was undisputable.
And to this day I will never forgive Joe Bidden for his cover up. Can anyone believe that idiot wants to be President?
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"and stubburn as they were."
are you mental? Would you honestly leave the building having witnessed the atf trigger happy show, i think i would have stuck it out rather than risk being shot up when leaving the building. They were also piping cs gas into the builing via the bradley tanks so the amounts in the air would have been more than what you would see from a conventional use of tear gas say for instance in american city centres to quash protests.
"when the intentions were clearly and unmistakingly not harmful"
what ever happened to negotiating and deliberating? I dont think repetitivly shooting at the building, piping it full off lethal gas and bulldozing down the structure could be not harmful. jeez you really do believe all the *beep* your media/government feed you. WAKE UP! This isnt a matter of opinion at all, it is a matter of your governmnent getting away with murder again!
"I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different."
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