The Full Monty with ugly women? - The Full Monty (1997) Discussion

[–] Pocketacejack 16 years ago

Calendar girls made a 100 million dollars worldwide with the premise of old women taking their gear off to make money.

Watch more movies before you make a statement that is woefully misinformed. Also, it seems like you're really REALLY shallow.

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[–] bersarhin 16 years ago

Um... I don't think a single male in the world would deem Helen Mirren to be unattractive.

And how is it being shallow to study the representation of gender and bodily aesthetics in film as a way to analyze the patriarchal state of today's film industry?

Last seen:
The Muppets take Manhattan (A-)
Four Weddings and a Funeral (B-)
The Full Monty (B+)

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[–] bron-tay 12 years ago

Calendar Girls was my answer to the question, too. And not all of them were Helen Mirren by a longshot!

I think the question's perfectly legitimate. The conceit of both films was to thrust ordinary people into a situation that's normally reserved for the impossibly gorgeous.

~~~~~~~
Please put some dashes above your sig line so I won't think it's part of your dumb post.

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[–] apjooz 15 years ago

"This reminds me of Hollywood's current trend to show average/below average men getting beautiful women (Transformers, Knocked Up), while the opposite is far from being common."

It's reality. Women are more shallow than men in a way because they are attracted more to status, money, fame etc and not the the person himself. All men want is a person they love, women want more. So it's completely logical that woman might be attracted to a ugly man.

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RIP Terminator franchise 1984-1991

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[–] Samurai_Joe_Marshall 15 years ago

"It's reality. Women are more shallow than men in a way because they are attracted more to status, money, fame etc and not the the person himself. All men want is a person they love, women want more. So it's completely logical that woman might be attracted to a ugly man."

So men are less shallow because they only date beautiful women?

"Visits? That would indicate visitors."

~~ Plan 9 From Outer Space

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[–] apjooz 15 years ago

That is not what I meant. What I meant is, it's not really shallow to fall in love with a person you adore. Be it ugly or beautiful. What is truly shallow is to fall in love with the person's money.

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RIP Terminator franchise 1984-1991

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[–] Samurai_Joe_Marshall 15 years ago

Oh. I thought it had something to do with the subject of the board.

I agree with the money part. Not all women are like that, though.

"Visits? That would indicate visitors."

~~ Plan 9 From Outer Space

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[–] jess-brohier 15 years ago

All the men in the Full Monty are unemployed not rich. Women enjoy this film cos they're lovable guys. If they were all rich idiots no one would like it. I also don't know any woman who are attracted to money (although I'm sure there are some). I agree with the the person that set up this thread that if this film was based on women it wouldn't have been as popular. Although, that could be because it's difficult to portray women in the same kind of lovable cheeky way. It might not be just to do with looks.

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[–] BoxOfficePoison 14 years ago

Off the subject, but this discussion reminds me of the swimming pool scene in "Cocoon", with old people in place of the young, sexy ones we would usually see in such a scene.

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[–] carzy_6 14 years ago

After watching this brilliant British comedy, I realized something.

Would people be willing to watch the same story but enacted by overweight, ugly, middle-aged women? I seriously doubt it.

Why is it that in today's (and last decade's) society, an ugly man getting naked is brave, but an ugly woman doing the same thing is grotesque?

This reminds me of Hollywood's current trend to show average/below average men getting beautiful women (Transformers, Knocked Up), while the opposite is far from being common.

Any thoughts?

My first thought was "oh, please". Men seem to be criticised a lot more for their appearance these days than women are; with stick-thin models being criticised for their weight and larger women being defended for what people -- idiots -- perceive as being attacks on them, women couldn't have it easier appearance-wise (with the exception of thin women; God knows how Keira Knightley puts up with that "she's anorexic" crap).

Meanwhile, men don't have any such defence. The media tends to reflect women's opinions. When was the last time you saw a fat character in a film or television show who wasn't the comic relief character or a villain? It's no surprise that Dave's weight in The Full Monty was treated as a joke. Same goes for Horse's woes about his penis size. And it was a woman who gave Dave the confidence to strip, since men obviously weren't up to the task of doing that.

If women stripped, it'd also be treated as that "celebration of female sexuality" garbage that the media likes to perpetuate. Stripping for themselves and nobody else with an "I don't need no man" attitude. Yet Gaz went out to strip in The Full Monty when he found out his ex-wife -- who was a supreme bitch but never called up on it, who left her perfectly pleasant new partner at home to watch men strip AND who was the gatekeeper of all things to do with her son -- was in the audience. And let's not get started on the fact that women watching men strip = entertainment while men watching women strip = perverted.

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"Just deal with your girlfriend's cheesy feet. She puts up with your cheesy face." - Jack Dee

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[–] hodie 12 years ago

The day has not yet arrived when men are judged on their bodies more than women are.

There was a relationship between the guys who stripped in TFM and their audience. Those were THEIR guys, taking care of business the best way they knew how.

"Joey, have you ever been in a Turkish prison?"

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[–] smjensen312-158-669840 12 years ago

"The day has not yet arrived when men are judged on their bodies more than women are."

Unless you have a population comprised largely of gay men, that day will probably never arrive. Most "heterosexual" women are not actually attracted to men physically. Women are exploited (or themselves exploit) their beauty and are devalued if they're not beautiful. Men are exploited for their money (or use it to attract women) and are devalued as losers if they are economically unsuccessful. When women do watch male strippers, they're doing it strictly for yucks (thus the hysterical laughter that usually ensues). They're certainly not viewing men in lust, or out of admiration for their bodies.

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[–] GoSiberian 14 years ago

This movie couldn't have been made with women as the central characters.

This movie isn't about stripping. Among other things, it's a collection of love stories: between Gaz and his son, Dave and his wife, Gerald and his male associates, and what these men will do for that love.

I see the men's average physical attractiveness is important to the storyline in that these men never before had to use their appearances to further their careers (something women do often) and now must face being judged by their appearances (something women do daily).

To this American woman, a man who exposes his emotional vulnerabilities is very attractive indeed.

Women do judge by looks, but we *love* men who make us laugh and feel important.

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[–] neko-neko-1 14 years ago

This reminds me of Hollywood's current trend to show average/below average men getting beautiful women (Transformers, Knocked Up), while the opposite is far from being common.
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Megan Fox is hardly beautiful, Michaela looked like the school slut

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[–] wears-alan 14 years ago

you are obviously not from northern England. The answer to your question is Yes! they would pay to watch ugly women. People in England don't go to strip acts (done in working mens clubs and pubs,not strip joints) for anything other than the spectacle!!

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[–] SpiltPersonality 14 years ago

I'd like to precursor this by saying this is my views on society... not my views personally. I do not believe the OP's 'gender reversal movie' of this type would work.

I think it comes down to men and women appealing differently to the opposite sex.

Women are attracted to men who are successful and powerful.

Men are attracted to women who are pretty.

This is because (at a deep seated level) women want someone who is going to provide for their progeny, where as a man wants someone to have sex with.

I do believe this is at such a deep level that it will never change. It is at the base levels of what our biological purpose is. Women carry the child, men provide for the child. It will alter somewhat as women become more and more 'self sufficient'. At the moment we're still reacting through older 'women stays at home' philosophy of the last century (look at Bewitched & I Dream of Jeannie from the 1960's). Once that generation is well and truly in the past you may notice things alter somewhat.

The reason why this movie worked is because men and women could see the men (characters in the movie) who were not successful or powerful (due to economic circumstance) took control (power) and changed their circumstance (success).

In the reverse (again, in the deep psyche of society, not necessarily you or me), women aren't meant to be successful or powerful... they are meant to be pretty, which is necessary to increase your chances of producing offspring.

SpiltPersonality

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[–] ah_cynicism 13 years ago

"Women are attracted to men who are successful and powerful.
Men are attracted to women who are pretty."

I'm attracted to men who are pretty.

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[–] WalkAwayRenee 13 years ago

I'm attracted to men who are creative, spontaneous and into music. As long as he fits that general bill, for all I give a rat's a$$ he can be a manager of a McDonald's, driving a Chevette past the drive thru everyday. See how much trouble generalization can get one into ;)

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[–] smjensen312-158-669840 13 years ago

The fact that none of the men in "The Full Monty" are particularly attractive is really not material. Very few women really find men attractive in a purely sexual way- most "heterosexual" women think penises are ugly and disgusting anyhow. They're more attracted to men with money or status. It's true the men in this film don't have money or status either, but they have enough personality and audacity to make it work (in the film). Sadly, in real life, these men would remain out of work and most women would see them as "losers".

There have been a lot of stories in the media lately about a seismic shift in the relationship between the sexes. Younger women actually earn more money than their male contemporaries. Universities are over 60% female. The women it seems haven't shifted from viewing men as "success objects" to eye candy- they have, to a very large extent, stopped thinking of them at all. Another interesting fact is that over 14% of young women now identify as lesbian, while only about 6% of young men identify as gay men. That runs counter to the perception that homosexuality is far more prevalent among males. Women, it seems, only tolerate males when it's in their economic interest to do so. In the United States and other western counties a new pattern is emerging with a successful and autonomous female population and a growing male underclass. Some women speak of advances in reproductive technology that will eliminate the need for men altogether.

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[–] WalkAwayRenee 13 years ago

Yeah, I don't fit into any of that either. I think all parts of the male body are beautiful on the objects of my affection. I suppose when you're someone like me who believes themselves to be the "loser" or at least doesn't feel terribly adequate or desirable to anyone, you tend not to judge other people over minor things that don't matter in the grand scheme. I don't make any money either. I'm underpaid, and I'm an average Jo. People are not trophies or status items to me. They're someone I can have a conversation with, share things with, share my life with. There are guys out there who maybe are just like the guys in this movie that I would feel pretty special in the company of. As for reproductive technology making men obsolete, that kind of option/technology also works for people who may not have the same shot as everyone else to get even the simplest things in life. If in fact there are some women out there who can afford to blow off the male species then that's their prerogative. Personally, I would much rather that my long held dreams of starting family were with an actual person that I cared about and not in some sterile medical facility somewhere with a bunch of strangers who are probably looking at me with pity because I've had to resort to the "turkey baster method." Maybe they aren't doing that, but that's the way it feels. I suppose my point, if I have one, is that all of this is still just generalization. Not everyone, male or female, thinks relationships are all about how much money someone has or whether they could give George Clooney/Angelina Jolie a run for their money in the looks department. When you have nothing at all, then the basics look pretty hot.

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[–] a_mbow 11 years ago

"Very few women really find men attractive in a purely sexual way- most "heterosexual" women think penises are ugly and disgusting anyhow."

hmmm, speak for yourself, not this heterosexual woman.

"Women, it seems, only tolerate males when it's in their economic interest to do so."

No, not really. Men are beautiful, we need them (not their money) this movie illustrates the whole concept. Watch the scene where Jean confronts her husband, he explains what/why he is doing it, and says 'who wants to see this dance?" "I do"

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[–] smjensen312-158-669840 11 years ago

To each her own. I hear women all the time describing the male body as ugly and unappealing, and they seem not to mind expressing this viewpoint in earshot of men (although I doubt they're speaking for effect, it seems a candid reflection of their views). I'm also not the first person to notice that unattractive men with unpleasant personalities (Ted Turner & Donald Trump come to mind) have no trouble attracting women. What possibly could explain this appeal other than money? Conversely, there aren't many men throwing themselves at Oprah Winfrey or Martha Stewart, just because they're billionaires.

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