MovieChat Forums > Superman: The Animated Series (1996) Discussion > I wish Darkseide wasn't in the series! ...

I wish Darkseide wasn't in the series! MAJOR SPOILERS


I think it would've been better because I just watched the last season and I didn't like the way it ended. He kills off Dan Turpin and in the last 2 episodes he brain washes Superman into thinking he is his son. Then he has Superman go to Earth and kill a bunch of people. Then the world doesn't trust him anymore! I hated that! I'd heard that at the end of the series Lex goes to jail and that didn't happen either. Anyone here dislike Darkseide? And dislike what he does to Superman?

"Ray the Sponges migrated about a foot and a half." Peter Venkman, Ghostbusters 1

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Nope. Made for great storylines.

Always-Severus Snape

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Even though this guy really hates it, I think how into the series he was really does show how effective the series did its job, making one of the most outdated and cheesiest heroes into a serious character that the audience invests in.

But yeah, Darkseid is what made the series.

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I never cared for Darkseid or the whole Warworld thing. In fact I know everyone considers Jack Kirby the man and all but a lot of the characters he created fall very flat with me.

"They have a grill, it's this grill. Now you have it...it's called America."

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Um, Darkseid and War World are two completely different things. I think you mean Apokolips.

So Captain America, Fantastic Four, Hulk, X-Men, Thor, and the Silver Surfer all fell flat with you?

Always-Severus Snape

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Yeah, and also given that Darkseid was one of the only villains to actually develop Superman as a character, which is more than you can say for most of his villains in the series.

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You're right, totally meant Apokolips, sorry about that.

X-Men worked for me, though I always thought that was Stan Lee's brainchild (not a big Marvel guy in general).

The others were not my cup of tea no. When I think of Jack Kirby I think of characters like that stupid Newsboy Legion that was in the Superman comics for a while. While I understand Jack created some great stuff, not everything worked, but because so many artists and writers respected him and used all his creations, good and bad.

Anyway don't think too much about my opinions Preach. I've seen you talk to other people on other forums and you just beat down their opinion till it's about as comfortable in the thread as a divorce settlement and I really don't feel like going through that.

"They have a grill, it's this grill. Now you have it...it's called America."

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[deleted]

One thing to take note of is that Bruce Timm and Co. like ending their shows on a downer. They ended Superman TAS on a down note, and also ended the first Justice League series on a down note. Personally, I like it. I like a kick in the guts at the end, and also the potential for more stories. It makes for great storytelling. The ending of Superman TAS setup many things for Superman and others to deal with in later series (Superman's brainwashing was even mentioned in Batman Beyond and the reason Batman had Kryptonite) Also, Luthor went to jail at least twice (Once during Justice League, and again at the end of Justice League Unlimited Season 2) and it did not stop him either time. So Luthor going to jail at the end would not have been conclusive. It's all okay in the end though, JLU did have a happy ending...sort of.

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[deleted]

well here is what happened Superman's memory was erased like a computer program. That jerk military solder hated him in some episodes. Like called him "Alien" I mean i can not believe how people can just get the wrong idea like that. They seen Darkeside hold Superman on that huge tank like the amazon women were held. (For example i mean) Anyway The world thought he became a monster Lois is his only Alibi to what happened. If there is a fan fiction there should be a way to tell the city Superman is really Innocent to his crime. Jimmy said "Don't you think he gets a second chance" His friends know what happened he went on a mission got caught and got brain washed. He had no time to even stop Darkside or know he was planing something. I just think Lex Darkside and That Military guy was all in it.

Justin

Bond James Bond

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I don't know why but after making myself watch the episodes with Darkseid I kind of like it.
I liked this line from the end of the series.
"I am many things Kal El. But here I am god."
I don't get why these poor people are helping him but they seem to be loyal reguardless of what he does.

"We are Venom, now!" Venom/Eddie Brock Spider-Man Tv Series 1994

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They help him because He truly is their God. Darkseid has so totally and completely destroyed these people's lives, annihilated any possible optimism and so thoroughly crushed any shred of hope they could ever have that even when he's been beaten they couldn't bring themselves to revolt. He's just that good (in an evil sense of course).

He only needs the Anti-Life Equation for the rest of the universe, on Apokalips, they're already dead.

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I'm thinking in general, I don't really like it when the plot involves traveling to other planets or dimensions. I'm sure there are some exceptions I just can't think of any.


Half Man/Half Amazing

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Well remember this, Justice League is the true ending to the whole shebang(from batman to Superman). Also the show did what most others wouldnt. Paint the world in grey.

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Personally I like it when shows will do what you don't expect, while still staying true to the material. It actually allows you to invest in the characters struggle because your not sure exactly how its going to turn out. This was a precedent that was set with the death of Dan Turpin, and carried on into the Justice League shows.

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I actually liked Darkseid and the rest of the New Gods characters in this series. Though I can see how someone might not like it. Darksied was one of the hardest enemies for Superman to fight and cause him shame from time to time. These two characters really hate each other. The ending to this series was exceptional, you had Luthor sceheming on on side and Darkseid ready to rumble on the other. This series went out with a bang.

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This series made me the biggest Darkseid fan! I feel like he's the greatest villain in the DCAU, and apparently it seems Bruce Timm does as well, since he closed out both this series and "Justice League" with Darkseid as the antagonist.

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I agree. That's one thing I liked about the ending of Justice League is it gave Superman some closure that he didn't get in 'twilight' when darksied 'died'.

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On the DVD commentary, they say that they had originally intended to have a fourth season, which would have focused on Superman's regaining the world's trust.

Unfortunately, there was no fourth season. (I haven't seen any of the Justice League episodes yet. They're next on my list.)

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Superman is a character with few villains who can match him in power. Luthor uses intellect and advanced science, Brainiac uses science again. The Parasite was a match if he could leech off Superman's power. After that, you have tricksters (Toyman, Puzzler), gimmicks (Metallo) or magic (Mxyzptlk). Darkseid was one of the first villains that presented a physical threat to Superman, and might actually be more powerful (lots of room for debate there). Also, Darkseid is an interesting psychological opponent for Superman and true oppostites from a moral stance. The best villains are the counterparts of the hero: Luthor is intellect to Superman's physical power, Darkseid is amoral terror against Superman's altruism and hope.

As for Kirby, I went through a period where I wasn't impressed with his work, though mostly from the 70's. His figure work got blockier and his books were strange, though I later read how he was heavily sabotaged by jealous individuals at Marvel, in that period. At DC, he was just too different from the norm and he was never really given his fair shake. He was committed to a deal that required so many finished pages per month, so he had to produce other work when his books were cancelled, with less than stellar stuff towards the end. However, his concepts were so ahead of their time it took about 20 years for creative people to begin to really utilize those characters to their fullest. However, if you look at Kirby from the mid60's to the early 70's, it's some powerful stuff. His collages are something to behold and his designs are beyond most imaginations.

To my mind, Kirby's best work at DC is Mister Miracle, followed by the other 4th World books (New Gods, Jimmy Olsen, and Forever People, in that order). I like OMAC far better than Forever People. Kamandi is very popular, but I never read any of it, same with Demon. I enjoyed the Newsboy Legion in Jimmy Olsen, though the dialogue could get tiresome. Their original stories from the 40's were good, for their time.

At Marvel, Kirby shines on the Fantastic Four and Thor, for creativity, and Captain America for action (though FF was right up there on that note). Stan created nothing alone, Kirby was heavily involved in plotting everything he drew. Stan's best work was always inconjunction with an artist who could plot their stories alone, like Kirby and Ditko. Stan's writing method didn't work quite as well with Don Heck or Herb Trimpe, which is why he often pawned off those books to his brother Larry. Romita and Buscema were other artists who worked well with Stan, as did Gene Colan.

Kirby's work in the 40's is well beyond everyone else, in terms of storytelling and dynamic action, with a few exceptions (Mort Meskin, Reed Crandall, Will Eisner, Lou Fine).

Where Kirby's work suffers is when he dialogues his own work. It was not his strongpoint. His later work suffered with age and vision problems. if you want to see Kirby at his best, try these: Captain America 1-10 (early Kirby, but getting a handle on figures and action), Sandman and Boy Commandos at DC (again, 1940's, recently reprinted), Fighting American (great satire from the 50's), Challengers of the Unknown (Kirby is starting to strut his stuff here, at DC, and it would heavily inform the early FF stories), Fantastic Four , from the 40's up to the end (Kirby was really cooking here), Avengers #4 and Tales of Suspense (Kirby returns to Captain America), Journey into Mystery/Thor (more great mythological stuff), 4th World books at DC (check out the Omnibus volumes), OMAC (brilliant weirdness), Eternals (best of his 70's Marvel) and maybe Destroyer Duck (there were personal vendettas going on there, though).

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