MovieChat Forums > Sailor Moon (1995) Discussion > Adapting a live action Movie Part VII - ...

Adapting a live action Movie Part VII - Gay Characters


Disclaimer: We already know that the misuse of Naoko Takeuchi's original material has caused great offense, and the exclusion of LGBTQ characters and subplots are just part of the reason that she never renewed license to English distributors and other companies. That being said, this is still a rousing debate.

Should a live action movie, which might be geared towards children, and most certainly garner the attention of conservative groups around the world, include the gay subplots and characters such as Zoicite and Malikite, return Fish Eye to a male form, and include of course the most famous of lesbian love stories, Sailor Neptune and Uranus? There is also a question of the transgender metamorphosis of later senshi, the Sailor Starlights. How do you think this would play out to modern audiences in terms of both critical and financial reception? Will it harm or help the live action film?

reply

I'm a relatively conservative Christian myself, but I think there can be a balance without sacrificing the author's intent. Neptune and Uranus should stay lesbians. That's just how they are and to change it (especially with a ridiculous cover story) is to go too far.

Now, with a first movie, we probably wouldn't deal with Outer Senshi, so they don't really matter. The other question is Zoicite, and here I'm conflicted. On one hand, the Four Generals sort of parallel with the other four Sailor Senshi. Having them all be male works. But Zoicite was always VERY feminine. I mean, all of them were sort of pretty boys but Zoicite would turn up in a swirl of rose petals for crying out loud. I also never really felt a relationship with Malikite. It wasn't like Neptune and Uranus. It just seemed like Zoicite was Malikite's bitch, and he was just using him. I don't see the point of introducing gay characters if they are just going to be stereotypes.

I also don't remember how much of that (if any) was in the original comic. A movie is going to need time to develop characters, and spending extra time with the villains as well is probably just too much. There's a part of me that likes Zoicite being a woman because she does a better job than Jadeite or Nephrite did. But it may be we can leave them all men and just not call attention to it.

That's the big thing: keep it subtle and not use it as a soap box to promote the homosexual agenda. I want Sailor Moon to still be Sailor Moon and not turn into Glee. In the anime, the girls were confused by Uranus early on since she dressed as a man. Keep that. Don't act like it's totally normal; it can be confusing for people. Over Christmas some family member had a butch-looking girl (probably lesbian, not going to guess though) over. She had essentially a men's haircut, khaki pants, shirt and tie and boots. A bit on the huskier side so not the most obviously noticeable breasts. And kind of a husky voice. Anyway, a seven-year-old cousin was convinced she was a boy and had a very hard time being convinced she was not. And I think Sailor Moon can address a bit of that confusion. I don't want a movie to CAUSE that kind of confusion.

So basically: Zoicite male or female I'm fine with it either way, but I don't think the movie needs to get into the relationship with Malikite. Have to think about whether the very feminization of the Generals is a help or a hindrance. Though I don't remember it being so overt in the manga; maybe stick with that.
Uranus and Neptune should be lesbians, but keep it somewhat coy like in the anime early on. That way little kids can see them as just friends and everyone else will know better. Changing that would bring HUGE protest attention and hurt the box office. But going out of their way to promote the gay characters would also do more harm than good. I don't see a movie series involving them though until a second or third film.

I don't think we need involve FishEye at all. As to the Starlights, it's different in the manga. They are always girls (Naoko says that all Senshi are female), and they just disguise as boys, they don't physically change gender. I've read she was unhappy with that change in the anime. I'm also not sure we even need to do Sailor Stars in movie form.

The movies should be a blend of the anime and the manga, and we should remember the anime had a bunch of filler in it to pad out the story. Keeping it tighter means some of these issues aren't as prominent. I'd also just want to make sure if something is changed, that it's done with Naoko's blessing.

-TK

"I've always admired atheists; I think it takes a lot of faith." -Dr. Joel Fleischman

reply

[deleted]

I think we are coming into an era where gay is no longer taboo. Gay and family can now (or has a path to) be synonymous. I don't think there is any need to cater to any particular crowd with this kind of movie, least of all a religious crowd, since Naoko has written in a plethora of Christian symbols and themes. One of the main principles to stand by when writing in gay characters and not typically throwing egg at religious people who have a stance on it is to stay away from their actual principles on the matter:

Don't advocate for marriage (since the original does not have gay marriage or advocate for it, there's no need to write this in. Also, stance on this issue is usually that marriage between same sex is not allowed).
Don't advocate for intercourse (same with the first point, this does not have sex between any of the gay couples so there's no need to write it in if it isn't necessary).

I am gay though, and I'm unapologetic. While it wouldn't be my proclivity to write a movie with religion in mind and evading any offensive maneuvers, it's not my propensity to worry about offending them either. I honestly don't believe there's need to satiate any demands by groups which would boycot this movie based on having a gay character as they are not likely to see it anyway.

One of the best things about having two gay characters in the first film (Zoy and Mal) is to get people used to the idea of gay characters in the future. It's also a great tool to help the audience empathize with a pair of villains that are otherwise very treacherous. 2 hours runing time is enough to invite us into the background of the generals, letting us know them and giving us time to care about their downfall (or root for it).

reply

It's also a great tool to help the audience empathize with a pair of villains that are otherwise very treacherous.

But no the flip side, having gay characters as villains will anger others about how gay characters are always portrayed as evil. Hollywood has a history of evil gay characters. So if the only gay characters in the movie (again, Neptune and Uranus probably wouldn't turn up until a sequel) are villains, that strategy could backfire.

-TK

"I've always admired atheists; I think it takes a lot of faith." -Dr. Joel Fleischman

reply

I doubt it would backfire. Especially since the revelation of Uranus and Neptune having a lesbian relationship is such en established plotline by the cult following. It would be difficult to defend the position that having gay villains is a slight at the gay community after learning that there are gay heroes in the wings.

reply

[deleted]

The James Bond movie Diamonds Are Forever has a pair of gay hit men. This was in 1971.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0066995/

Today, of course, the villains being a gay couple wouldn't be a joke, but would be a part of their character development (oh hey, they don't just sit around hating everything all the time; they're a couple; they have hopes and dreams and romance too).

As long as the impression is not given that they are villains because they are gay, then it shouldn't be offensive. Just being gay doesn't make you good, the same as just being gay doesn't make you evil.

I doubt Haruka and Michiru would be in the first movie, but for Metallia's sake yes, they are and should be lesbians.


BTW, I've always thought it funny that the Moral Guardians of America, you know, the sort who want to shout "Tinky-Winky is GAY!" or "Spongebob Squarepants is GAY!" couldn't notice the two animated characters, Uranus and Neptune, who really ARE gay. That just makes me all laughing and bewildered.


I disagree with you, but I'm pretty sure you're not Hitler.
- Jon Stewart

reply

[deleted]

I... really can't argue with that.

I disagree with you, but I'm pretty sure you're not Hitler.
- Jon Stewart

reply

There is absolutely no way that you can make a Sailor Moon movie up to the point of Sailor Moon S and not have Neptune and Uranus' lesbian relationship. There just isn't. It would disrespectful to the source material, to Takeuchi herself, to the fans, and most of all to gay people. I think you really need to watch what you're saying here because you're bordering on acquiescing to the homophobes of the world.

I can't see this movie being made in less than five years, and in that time, gay rights will be in such a different place. It will likely be a center issue in Western Countries, and an emerging issue in Eastern ones. But even if you leave out Malikite and Zoycite's relationship, that would mean the Neptune/Uranus relationship would be another five years away, and who knows what the opinion of gay people will be then around the world.

The courage we have now to stand up for those who need it, to right wrong and triumph over evil, will resonate throughout time. Only by acting now will we be able to change the future.

Let's be friends!

reply

I think that you are right. It is important for us to remember that, though we be without henshins and tiaras and Silver Crystals, yet still we have our chances to, in small ways, right wrongs and triumph over evil (and that does NOT mean you, so relax).

I disagree with you, but I'm pretty sure you're not Hitler.
- Jon Stewart

reply