Better than Smallville


I've been watching the repeats on The Hub recently and it's far better than Smallville.

reply

I ENJOYED Lois and Clark more than I enjoyed Smallsville, but don't feel you can honestly call one better than the other. Each show created a Universe specific to how they defined the characters and where they wanted to take them.

Lois and Clark was modeled after Remington Steele/Moonlighting, with emphasis on work and romance for people in their twenties. Their audience were the folks who watched and identified with "Friends," just with the fantasy element of Superman mixed in. Smallville wanted to create an alternate origin, where their Universe could be open to anything, but still stay within the history. Both shows were successful in what they set out to do. So I don't think you can really compare unless they were both attempting to do the same thing, and clearly they were not.

But I, too, am enjoying the reruns on The Hub, and am always happy when new fans pop up who love the show. For me, season one of Lois and Clark was perfection - but so was season one of Smallville. It was after that things started to unravel, but not to the point where I couldn't still enjoy the characters (even when the stories made no sense).

reply

Yeah, I much preferred L&C to smallville. To me Smallville was 90210 set in Kansas, about the trials and tribulations of the cliquish "cool kids" at the local high school with the freak of the week storylines and the one oddball kid who could bench press a Buick trying to fit in with the other cool kids.

reply

Dean Cain = HOT

Tom wellington = NOT


LOIS and CLARK fan 4 EVER!

reply

This is how I feel about it. If you want a shorter and better origin story, watch the two-part pilot of Lois & Clark, even I'll admit that trumps Smallville with as big a fan as I am of the latter. If you straight-up want a show about Clark's iconic Superman years after he's hit 25, Lois & Clark is what to watch, you get the tights and flights (despite being on a moderate 90s TV budget) every episode. You won't get that with Smallville except in the rarest of circumstances, given outside roughly ten easter-eggs with flight (on top of a few training lessons) and some rare future-peeks, this series saved its Clark Kent/Kal-El character fully mastering flights for keeps and donning his mother's full-fledged suit for the final hour.

Now if you want a more comprehensive take on the origin story and don't mind the "No Tights, No Flights" rule, Smallville is what to check out. It's got a much bigger budget... or at least far more modern special effects, the ten years explore the greatest range in Superman and DC mythos for live-action than I've seen anywhere else, plus you get to see the precise hows on WHY Kal-El's enemies get to where they're at in his iconic years alongside Clark. For what it's worth, I do really appreciate the show's last two and a half years for exploring what Smallville represented as the Man of Steel's early years, with Clark Kent's dual-identity beginning half a dozen eps into Season 8. It's very similar to the first few seasons of Lois & Clark as we got the character's first three years at the Daily Planet and the entire Clark/Lois/Kal-El triangle.

I talk more about my feelings of it here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0348150/board/thread/204768604?d=207911015 #207911015

"Just tell the minister, I'm gonna be a few minutes late". *Cue John Williams' Superman theme*

reply

I don't get the "no flights, no tights" rule. If it's about Superman, I want flights and I want tights. Waiting ten years for Smallville's CK to finally don the tights was ridiculous.

I'll go one better, I think L&C is THE best version of Superman ever made, including the Christopher Reeve movies. Before L&C we all thought that Superman was the real guy and Clark was just the disguise. L&C turned that on it's head. The best line from L&C had to be, "Superman is what I can do, Clark is who I am."

Like the old George Reeves series that started out, "In his guise as Clark Kent of the Daily Planet...." The Chris Reeve movies did show his origins as Clark, but he was still a bumbling baffoon. L&C captured perfectly the idea for Superman as the disguise and the need for the disguise, Something not done well in the Chris Reeve movies, watching those we are to think he just likes flying around in a cape and tights. If anything L&C set the stage for Smallville, which examined in excruiating detail for 10 seasons, the need for Clark to develop the Superman disguise.

reply

I don't get the "no flights, no tights" rule. If it's about Superman, I want flights and I want tights. Waiting ten years for Smallville's CK to finally don the tights was ridiculous.


And that's probably why the executive producers were so up front about the kind of story they were telling right from the pilot, they didn't wanna mislead any viewers and on the contrary, stuck to their word right up to the end. The "No Tights, No Flights" guideline was basically telling any viewers what kind of Clark Kent/Kal-El story they were getting and while the rules could be bent, they would never be truly broken for keeps until the final hour. If they didn't want that kind of perspective, they need never to have tuned in, that simple.

I'll go one better, I think L&C is THE best version of Superman ever made, including the Christopher Reeve movies. Before L&C we all thought that Superman was the real guy and Clark was just the disguise. L&C turned that on it's head. The best line from L&C had to be, "Superman is what I can do, Clark is who I am."


I will agree on one half of that side, I think Dean Cain definitely portrayed the best 'Metropolis Clark' persona, even if a bit of the geek in me thinks the introverted-less-goof 'Metropolis Clark' from Superman: Birthright and what Superman Returns kinda did was more smart. As for the best live-action Supes, I'm always gonna have to go with Welling's portrayal of Kal-El in the Man of Steel's early years from "Prey"/"Identity-"Finale" once the alias was in gear. Sure he wasn't the full-fledged Superman of the later iconic years, but there were pretty big strides that got taken in adapting the dual-identity.

Where credit is due, I also really like how Tom got to play essentially both sides of the 'Metropolis Clark' persona. Despite being without the Glasses for 99% of the time, he played the cooler post-Crisis 'Metropolis Clark' akin to Dean's for "Prey"/"Identity"-"Masquerade", then from the climax of "Masquerade" up to the final hour and beyond, gave us the somewhat nerdier pre-Crisis 'Metropolis Clark'. That's one thing we never really got to observe with the other live-action Supermen, seeing them play more than just one of the sides to that persona of Kal-El's life. It's always the cooler 'This is who I am' Clark (George Reeves, Dean Cain), the overtly-geeky 'Whoops!' Clark (Kirk Alyn, Christopher Reeve), or a more introverted take on the latter (Routh).

Looking forward to Henry Cavil's performance and I may always change my mind about my favorite live-action Man of Steel after Zack Snyder's movie comes out, but Welling will nonetheless remain my favorite portrayal of the Hero of Metropolis until that day.

If anything L&C set the stage for Smallville, which examined in excruiating detail for 10 seasons, the need for Clark to develop the Superman disguise.


True enough and in some respect, the show creators said they didn't want Smallville to come off too much like Lois & Clark, in spite of -- much later -- playing out the entire Clark/Lois/Kal-El triangle and having Lois figure out the secret in a very similar fashion. I do recall Al/Miles pointing out in an interview how Lois & Clark had just come off the air, literally only three years prior to when they were greenlit Smallville's pilot, when they decided not to go with the tights/flights formula and strip the character down to his barest of essentials. The formula worked to their credit because it always kept viewers interested in seeing where the story would go and how it'd end, regardless that we viewers knew where the ending would be.

Smallville also worked in its early seasons because of two main factors, it started out at a point where super heroes weren't quite as cool as they'd be half a dozen years down the road and because a hero was needed after the dark aftermath of 9/11. It was the best of both worlds, showing how a hero's story was shaped and yet a hero any person over the age of 5 not living under a rock could be aware of who this person was. Then later after the middle years (Clark's confusing early 20s) put some excessive stalling in his character development and Al/Miles didn't really know where to go, the writers that took over their departure knew from the growing super hero popularity to excel Kal-El forward into dual-identity hero terrain and thus keep Smallville interesting.

"Just tell the minister, I'm gonna be a few minutes late". *Cue John Williams' Superman theme*

reply

Wow, thanks for the in-depth response!

Let me clarify my statement about L&C being the best Superman. The relationship between the characters is what made it the best. But no one can top Christopher Reeve's look in the suit. He was and still is the classic, definitive Superman, period. Dean Cain was okay, but he kept reminding me of Mickey Dolenz in a Superman costume. Plus, Cain's acting chops weren't all that great. If not for Terri Hatcher that show may have flopped. Terri Hatcher carried that show, plus the writing was good and the way they expanded and redefined the Superman character was outstanding.

By contrast I thought Margot Kidder was a horrible Lois Lane; "Oh, you're not Superman anymore...BYE!" Kidder was an okay actor, but her part was badly written, both characters were one-dimensional, and the relationship between them was always awkward.

I did like Smallville for the first 5 or 6 seasons, when Ma & Pa Kent was still around and Clark really was trying to find his way and learn his purpose on Earth. But then it got silly, (as do most shows that go on too long), with the justice league stuff and doing backstories on each justice league member. It got kind of boring and morphed into a soap opera with superheroes. Tom Welling's acting also left alot to be desired.

As for Kirk Alyn and George Reeves, they were great Saturday morning cartoon serials, but that's about it. I loved the old George Reeves show as a kid, likewise the Adam West Batman. But when the Chris Reeve movies came out, then the Michael Keaton Batmans, they transformed superheroes from cartoon to real life.

reply

Wow, thanks for the in-depth response!


No problem!

I did like Smallville for the first 5 or 6 seasons, when Ma & Pa Kent was still around and Clark really was trying to find his way and learn his purpose on Earth. But then it got silly, (as do most shows that go on too long), with the justice league stuff and doing backstories on each justice league member. It got kind of boring and morphed into a soap opera with superheroes. Tom Welling's acting also left alot to be desired.


And that's a huge issues many, including myself, have with the era of Smallville spanning the second half of Season 5 through most of Season 7 (between the 100th and 150th eps). The show creators decided to put much more focus on Lex and Lana, introducing new super heroes, and overall trying to find some 'valid' excuses to stall Clark's progress (mourning his father's passing, dealing with Phantom Zone baddies, his Supergirly cousin Kara). The reason for that is because Al/Miles didn't really know what to do with him in trying to stick toward their own status quo rather than going the more tradition routes; giving Clark a new girlfriend, getting out to explore the world a bit more when not being forced, starting up the dual-identity.

I think that by the last three eps of Season 7 and first five eps of Season 8 when Smallville almost feels like it's being rebooted, Clark's character evolution is finally put back on track after over two years of pure stalling, almost too little too late. He more or less puts his relationship with Lana behind him, sees the merits of getting back to his journalism roots, gets a job at the Daily Planet, and relies less on the farm to keep him grounded toward what he always perceived to be his own humanity. Half a dozen episodes into Season 8 with the unofficial two-parter "Prey" & "Identity", THAT is when Smallville definitively got back on a solid path regarding Clark's character IMO, essentially reversing where the prior main writers took things with Lex and Lana after the 100th ep as the 'Man of Steel' alias of Clark's began.

If ya' ever feel the desire to pick back up on Smallville, that's the point I'd strongly suggest getting back on and best of all, you'll finally have an actress worthy of serving justice to Lois Lane. Sure the Justice League heroes are still around (the second half of Smallville kinda becomes their origin story as well), the budget is less (Season 8 being the cheapest since Season 2), and you still gotta wait for the final hour to get Clark into full-fledged Superman territory, but I feel it's worth watching for an all new take on the early years. I'm still debating which of two Clark/Lois/Kal-El triangles I prefer, Lois & Clark Seasons 1-2 or "Prey"/"Identity"-"Salvation"/"Lazarus" in Smallville.

Also if you're curious, here are the 'super hero' looks Kal-El comes up with in those early years:

'Year One', "Prey"/"Identity"-"Doomsday": http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/SSJConan/FirstPerception.jpg
'Year Two', "Savior"-"Lazarus": http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/SSJConan/BlackSuit.jpg
Remaining six months pre-naming, "Ambush"-"Prophecy": http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/SSJConan/RedBlueUpgrade.jpg
One-shot Phantom Zone armor-suit: http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/SSJConan/TomInCape.jpg
Final hour, "Finale": http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c187/SSJConan/Destiny_Fulfilled.jpg

As for Kirk Alyn and George Reeves, they were great Saturday morning cartoon serials, but that's about it. I loved the old George Reeves show as a kid, likewise the Adam West Batman. But when the Chris Reeve movies came out, then the Michael Keaton Batmans, they transformed superheroes from cartoon to real life.


Totally agreed!

"Just tell the minister, I'm gonna be a few minutes late". *Cue John Williams' Superman theme*

reply

The reason for that is because Al/Miles didn't really know what to do with him in trying to stick toward their own status quo rather than going the more tradition routes; giving Clark a new girlfriend, getting out to explore the world a bit more when not being forced, starting up the dual-identity.


Where Al & Miles afraid once Lana once was no longer the love of Clark's life the show would take a turn for the worst like with Lois & Clark getting married too soon?

reply

Well Dean Cain liked it enough to want in so hey.

reply

[deleted]

Smallville started out good for 1 or 2 seasons--but then they introduced things which did not come in until later.

reply