Call me crazy but if CW picked this show up, without complains - Forever Knight (1992) Discussion

[–] n.debrabant 12 years ago

Well, I’m not sure fans would be too receptive of new people playing the roles.
Lets face it, we have all gotten older; Geraint Wyn Davies, Catherine Disher and Nigel Bennett as well as John Kapelos. It might work if they were to all agree, but Ger is too entrenched in working in Stratford, Ontario, on the stage which he loves to do. He did just film an episode of the Murdock Mysteries for Canadian TV. John Kapelos, I don’t think has any desire to go back as he is singing and acting Nigel Bennett is also acting in Stratford, Ontario on the stage. He and Ger were just in a play together. Deborah Duchene retired from acting after FK was cancelled, or not long after. Ben Bass has stated he would not go back and Lisa Ryder I doubt would return.

I liked season 3, I just wish they hadn’t gotten rid of DD and JK. It was good to have other Vampires around. I don’t think the main characters of Nick and Natalie were killed in the last episode, but the time for a movie was nearer the time after it was cancelled and not now, 16 years later. It lives on in Fan Fiction which is wonderful to read.

"Listen, I don't tan, I don't burn, I implode."

reply

[–] red_rackham_77 12 years ago

I meant with an entire new cast not with the original actors. although maybe some of them can make a guest appearance if they say yes.

reply

[–] knight_sentinel 12 years ago

Well eventually everything gets remade in some form.

Honestly, "Angel" and "Moonlight" were basically the same as this series, except the Angel and Mick St. John were both private detectives, all three vampires drove convertibles, which ironically are automobiles designed for enjoying the sun, all three brooded about wanting to be human again, had female friends who had crushes on them yet they nor the women ever acted on their feelings although in Angel's case he would have turned evil, although it appears if Nick got too excited he would want to take a bite.

Movies will make you famous; Television will make you rich; But theatre will make you good.

reply

[–] red_rackham_77 12 years ago

Still a forever knight with the new technology would look awsome but I wouldn't want it on CW, I would have aired it if WB was still on.

reply

[–] knight_sentinel 12 years ago

The CW and the WB are the same company, the only thing that change was the WB merged with UPN and changed the name to the CW UPN was owned by CBS, and the WB was owned by Warner Bros. execpt for some changes at the top most of the people witht the two respective companies are still employed.

I don't think the technology is the problem, I've seen many remakes with better technolgy that fell short on the over all story.

I liked the series, but honestly some of the stories were typical for the time period, and the continuity in the story lines was always a problem but this was to be expected this is the way the creator of the series wrote back then, I liked his series "Voyager" but it to had some of the same story continuity problems with all his series, although but not a lot of people had vcrs to go back and re-watch episodes and they weren't releasing series on DVD, so most people didn't pick up on these things.

I do like his current series "Covert Affairs" which doesn't have the continuity problems with it's story lines, there are single episode stories but the current season has had a continuing story line.

Also with this "Forever Knight" there was a long period between seasons. I remember at the time thinking it had been canceled, but it was on CBS, and then it was aired in first run syndication where I lived at the time early Sunday mornings around 12 midnight.

Before they decided to do "The Vampire Diaries" they were thining of doing another "Dark Shadows" series, I remember the original series, but I actually liked the remake they did with Ben Cross, Michael T. Weiss and Adrian Paul. The story line was the same except condensed down to 13 episodes, and yes they had a better budget to film the series, I didn't see the Tim Burton film but he had all the bells and whistles technologically speaking and yet the film according to critics and people on this and other boards didn't have much of a story.

As one producer stated someone who watched the series when they were a kid will want to do remake someday. Most of the series and films that get remade are done by people who were fans when they were younger.

Movies will make you famous; Television will make you rich; But theatre will make you good.

reply

[–] lexyladyjax 12 years ago

Honestly, "Angel" and "Moonlight" were basically the same as this series, except the Angel and Mick St. John were both private detectives, all three vampires drove convertibles, which ironically are automobiles designed for enjoying the sun, all three brooded about wanting to be human again, had female friends who had crushes on them yet they nor the women ever acted on their feelings although in Angel's case he would have turned evil, although it appears if Nick got too excited he would want to take a bite.

FOREVER KNIGHT inspired Joss Whedon when he created ANGEL. Some of the people who worked on ANGEL created MOONLIGHT. However, the MOONLIGHT people were unaware of the FOREVER KNIGHT inspiration for ANGEL, so they were confused when Nick Knight's fans brought up FK to them.

reply

[–] knight_sentinel 12 years ago

FOREVER KNIGHT inspired Joss Whedon when he created ANGEL. Some of the people who worked on ANGEL created MOONLIGHT. However, the MOONLIGHT people were unaware of the FOREVER KNIGHT inspiration for ANGEL, so they were confused when Nick Knight's fans brought up FK to them.

How could Joss Whedon become inspired to create Angel from "Forver Knight"?

He created Angel on "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" years before the "Angel" series,

Co-producer Greenwalt points out, "There's no denying that Angel grew out of Buffy."

This is also what the producers of Buffy stated - Early during the life of the series, some effort was made to slightly soften the original concept. For example, scenes were cut from the pilot episode, "City of," in which Angel tasted the blood of a murder victim.

The episode that was originally written to be the second episode, "Corrupt", was abandoned altogether. Writer David Fury explained, "The network was shocked. They said 'We can't shoot this. This is way too dark.' We were able to break a new idea, we had to turn it over in three days." Instead, the tone was lightened and the opening episodes established Angel Investigations as an idealistic, shoestring operation. Angel wasn't even a main character in the first season just like Spike wasn't intended to be a main character they both became popular characters and the producers decided to keep them on the series.

It's interesting that "Forever Knight" was filmed years before "Angel" and they had no problem showing Nick taste blood.

Also "Moonlight" was on CBS which is the same network that aired the first two seasons of "Forever Knight", also producers Harry Werksman and Gabrielle Stanton worked on "Earth: Final Conflict" which also filmed in Canada used all of the same actors that had starred or guest starred on "Forever Knight" years before "Moonlight" producers are responsible for hiring actors.

Do you really believe Ms. Stanton and Mr. Werksman didn't notice "Forever Knight" listed on many resumes or saw a demo reel of the actors previous work.

FYI, the very first episode of "Earth: Final Conflict" has Lisa Ryder who played Boone's wife wife who is killed by Von Flores' character, she had just come from the the third and final season on the series "Forever Knight", Von Flores also played a vampire in the third and final season of "Forever Knight" and was one of the main characters on EFC.

Kari Matchett, Lisa Howard and David Hemblen all regulars on "Earth: Final Conflict", Kari Matchett appears in the third season of "Forever Knight" and we find out she was Nick's wife and the first person he tried to bring across and it was this story that precluded the final story where Nick tries to bring Natalie across and kills her instead just like his wife.

I don't know where you're getting your information but "Moonlight" was according to Trevor Munson his first novel it was entitled "Angel of Vengeance" it later became the inspiration for the CBS vampire television series "Moonlight" which he co-created, and co-executive produced.

I'm still calling the BS flag, you have two producers who worked with several actors from "Forever Knight" either as stars in the case of Lisa Ryder and several guest stars who worked these actors on "Earth: Final Conflict" in Lisa Ryder's case she was a main lead on the third season of "Forever Knight" she would have used some of that footage in her demo reels that producers watch to see how actors look on the screen or on film.

You can choose to believe none anything or that Joss Whedon used Nick Knight as an inspiration to create "Angel" but even the producers have stated "Angel" went through some changes before they made him a detective.

I just think Hollywood regurgitates ideas and apparently large percentage of the population watches these regurgitated ideas.

One of the producers of "Moonlight" produced the first "Beauty and the Beast" series for CBS and came back and decided to do a new version for the CW which is partially owned by CBS, he regurgitated his previous series by just changing a few key details and characters.

Movies will make you famous; Television will make you rich; But theatre will make you good.

reply

[–] lexyladyjax 12 years ago

I have no desire to get into an argument with you. What I do know is what I've read about Joss Whedon when he was creating the character of Angel for the series: he was inspired by FOREVER KNIGHT 89-96.

Yes, I'm well aware that Angel was on BTVS as a supporting character prior to becoming a spinoff series. The character changed somewhat when Angel moved to LA and he became darker when he was on his own.

Do your own research or not. I have the books and the magazine articles in my possession that support my position.

Some things you just can't ride around...

reply

[–] knight_sentinel 12 years ago

I have done my research, where do you think I got the quotes from?

Interviews done by the creators.

"There's no denying that Angel grew out of Buffy." ~ David Greenwalt

"Early during the life of the series, some effort was made to slightly soften the original concept. For example, scenes were cut from the pilot episode, "City of," in which Angel tasted the blood of a murder victim.

The episode that was originally written to be the second episode, "Corrupt", was abandoned altogether. Writer David Fury explained, "The network was shocked. They said 'We can't shoot this. This is way too dark.' We were able to break a new idea, we had to turn it over in three days." Instead, the tone was lightened and the opening episodes established Angel Investigations as an idealistic, shoestring operation." ~ David Greenwalt

The WB didn't like the first written script and as Mr. Greenwalt says in that quote they abandoned it altogether.

In that same quote they also decided to come up with a new idea in 3 days, lightened the tone and then decided to make Angel a private investigator.

Source - "Buffy the Vampire Slayer (BFI TV Classics S.). British Film Institute" - Anne Bilson (5 December 2005), pp24–25.

Source - "Joss Whedon: The Genius Behind Buffy" Benbella Books by Candace Havens(May 1, 2003), p103.

Source - "Buffy, Angel and Me," from Buffy the Vampire Slayer magazine #12 - David Bilson (September 2000), page 6.

Which is where I got my information the first time I posted. I did my research and unlike you I posted it.

I haven't seen in any of those books and articles anything about "Forever Knight" they weren't even going to have Angel be a private investigator when they first conceived of doing the series. Nicholas Knight was a police officer in Toronto, and after doing some other occupations e.g. archaeology professor being one he became a police officer in Chicago.

I haven't found one quote attributed to Joss Whedon or David Greenwalt saying they were inspired to create Angel from the vampire on "Forever Knight".

I've seen a lot of people like you who have stated they've read something but they never source it. Which makes it hear say and rumor. Prove he said it, and where he said it!

Then again people are free to believe whatever they like, I'm just going by what I've read, and I sourced it, so I don't need to believe rumors and hear say.

You can actually find a lot of quotes by Joss Whedon about everything he's worked on and none of them ever say anything about his influence for "Angel" being inspired by "Forever Knight".

Considering they abandoned their first script idea for "Angel" it doesn't sound like they were going to go in the direction they went with the series. I've seen quotes from him about all his series, his films etc., and he talks about a lot of different things form television, film, books and comic books.

Movies will make you famous; Television will make you rich; But theatre will make you good.

reply

[–] knight_sentinel 12 years ago

Unlike the Beauty and the Beast crap they are doing to my beloved Beauty and the beast series.

You are aware the same people who did the first "Beauty and the Beast" series are the same ones doing it for the CW, the first series was on CBS and the same people went back and pitched their idea for a re-imagined version of their first series to the CW whose parent company is CBS.

It's odd that you're calling the new one crap when it's the same buy whose the creator/executive of both the old and new series.

Movies will make you famous; Television will make you rich; But theatre will make you good.

reply

[–] aftermidnite 12 years ago

There are some of us who love the new Beaty and the Beast. Much more than the original.

reply