MovieChat Forums > The Seventh Sign (1988) Discussion > Father Lucci + the Cardinals

Father Lucci + the Cardinals

posted 16 years ago by Babo2
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Having been around for 2000 years (and apparently sick of living) Peter Friedman's character, Father Lucci, has positioned himself within the hierarchy of the Catholic Church. The Cardinals send him to investigate strange phenomenon all over the world as part of their vigil for signs of the apocalypse. When he reports back to them, they pepper him with questions in order to assure themselves that the phenomena they have read about are not THE signs. The Cardinals' interview with Lucci concludes with something like "I will tell his Holiness... he will be relieved."

The clear implication in this scene is that if the Cardinals were convinced the phenomena really were signs of the apocalypse, they (or the Pope) would have taken specific action. I find this intriguing because I have seen this suggested before in other films. I can't think of which ones off the top of my head, but in both film and literature, it has been suggested that the Church will do something to intervene if/when the apocalypse draw nigh.

Did anyone else view this scene in the same way? What exactly would his Holiness do if the Cardinals told him the signs were the real deal? I am not Catholic and know relatively little about the Church; I would love to hear insights from those of you who know something about this either by faith or scholarship.

By the way, it seems silly that a scheming Father Lucci could out smart all the church leaders as he does here. Come to think of it, priests, monks, and other men of the cloth are often portrayed as bumbling fools who are easily outsmarted by the agents of evil in these sorts of films. I remember something like this happened in the Omen when the monks who were trying to kill the infant Anti-Christ in "The Omen" (1976) were fooled into stabbing each other to death.

[–] bastasch8647 16 years ago

I doubt that the church would do anything except enjoin the faithful to pray. Evangelical Protestantism seems much more "into" apocalyptic issues, the more conservative groups being somewhat fanatical on the subject.

My presumption is that Lucci was commissioned to investigate as a matter of legitimate ecclesiological curiosity. Naturally the Vatican wouldn't want to be behind on such big news. Their somewhat relieved reaction strikes me as plausible - they're not just priests, they're diplomats and politicians, and, after all, who wants the world to end? Especially when the best critical biblical scholars in the church have explained to you that the NT's apocalyptic references are mostly metaphors directed to and written only for people two thousand years ago, not for moderns, and certainly don't provide an "End Times" timetable.

Realistically, Lucci would probably find himself swamped in a sea of evangelicals who also would be aware of the strange events depicted in the film - he wouldn't be a lone investigator. So I think that the portrayal of the church commission was fairly accurate. If there's a possibility that Christ's return is near, then send one of your scholars out into the field, then analyse his report. Probably they would send a team of scholars - biblical exegetes, archaeologists, linguists, historians, etc. - they wouldn't depend on the report of just one investigator.

I had twelve years of Catholic education, had a cousin-priest and an aunt-nun, I was an altar boy, etc., etc. No one took "End Times Prophecy" seriously. The phrase itself is derived from Protestant fundamentalism. Yeah, Jesus will come again. Yeah, signs will accompany his return. Yeah, the current age will end and then heaven will reign on earth. Beyond these basics, there was zero interest and little preaching re: the Second Coming.

The only stuff we heard about it came from fundamentalist Catholic circles who looked to Marian apparitions and the like in order to intuit The End (Fatima is infamous for inspiring fits of apocalypticism among ultra-conservative Catholics).

I think the idea was: it's God's plan and God will execute it in his good time. When that happens, we, as members of the church, will be saved _as_ the church - the corporate body of Christ. No worries per the Second Coming. (Catholic worries were mostly (as with pre-conversion Martin Luther) with scrupulosity, the efficacy of good works, are we in a state of grace, are we receiving the sacraments "worthily," etc.) At least that's how I remember it.

I was born into the pre-Conciliar church, watched with excitement the innovations of Vatican II under "good Pope John" the 23rd... and in all that time there was no special emphasis placed on the Second Coming as a public issue. What the faithful were reading or discussing outside of official church channels never really effected the rest of us very much.