Toomey is played as the bad guy in this movie. I don't understand why. He was a drill Sgt. It was his job to train the recruits to be soldiers, not to be nice to them. If he did a bad job, many of them would die. He just tried to do his job.
If there was a bad guy in this film, it was Epstein who just refused to fit in and disrupted the training regimen for the whole platoon. Just my opinion.
Agreed. I just watched it and I couldn't get behind the men trashing him as crazy. Until the end he never did anything that seemed out of line or even up to the regular level of torture you'd expect from a DI.
Movie didn't work for me, it all felt intensely flat and unconvincing. Like an after-school special.
"It's that kind of idiocy that I empathize with." ~David Bowie
"Toomey is played as the bad guy in this movie."
Well, it wasn't done very well then, since I missed it.
I didn't see Toomey as a BAD guy. A bit eccentric, but not bad. Why do you assume there has to be a bad guy in every movie and that in this case, it was Toomey? Agreed, his job was to prep raw trainees for battle. But also agreed, I hope you will anyways, he was eccentric.
Some xamples of eccentricity...
Taking money out of a chest and then pretending to let on that it was stolen by one of the troops is eccentric, wouldn't you say? Maybe he had a good point, but to use that ploy as a means to "train" someone to be more careful is a bit odd, and certainly not necessary.
To "pretend" Eugene was "telling" him who had to do pushups was also eccentric. Not "bad" but eccentric, and not the most direct way to train troops. At least when I went to basic training (Vietnam era), no drill sgt used those kinds of ploys.
In fact, per Eugene's narrative, the guys in the unit seemed to miss Toomey's eccentricity as he described the next drill sgt as, I forget the exact words, but it sounded to be as if he was normal and, well, boring.
I did not see this movie as a "bad guy-good guy" movie. I term this kind of movie as a series of character sketches. It takes character types and draws out their eccentricities.
Try watching it as if Toomey isn't the bad guy and see how it changes the flavor of the movie for you. Don't assume there are any "good" or "bad" guys at all, just folks with eccentricities that become exaggerated under stress and fit together to create conflict/friendships as the case may be.
Not only was Toomey NOT a "bad guy".. but HOLY CRAP! That was one of the most calm and easy going drill srgts ever ever seen! when I went though Basic Training in the 90s all our drill srgts was not only A-holes but all looked like they could and would kill you at the drop of a hat. Always yelling and cursing at you and dropping you everytime you or your buddies messed up. An old timer I met on a plane told me that when he went through the Army's basic Training in the 40s, his drill srgts were a bunch of "Animals"! Who would beat you mercilessly. I WISH I had Toomey as my drill srgt ! lOL
shareTaking stuff left outside as a form to teach you not to, is just normal behavior in many Asian households.
shareI don't think he's a bad guy at all. In fact, he spends the entire film trying to make these boys into men and save their arses. Everything he does is calculated to teach them the skills to survive the war. Walken's last scene is proof that he gives a darn about the guys and about the army itself. He uses his final night as their leader to try and teach them something. He's the hero in my book.
The bee hunts in pairs....and other fruits...
Toomey was more eccentric than a villain.
Its that man again!!
I agree with the OP. Epstein was a total jerk and had the arrogance to think that his theories of training an army would work better. If there were a villain in this film, it would certainly be Epstein.
shareToomey was by no means easy going.
This takes place in 1945. Basic training was much different back then than what you see today. This hectic "D.I. in your face screaming" stuff that the USMC does (and to an extent, all the services) is fairly new. Did they yell back then? Yes, of course. But the men were tough without necessarily having to confuse the hell out of recruits with orders screamed a mile a minute (let alone multiple DI's like the Marine Corps does.)
He's not a bad guy. Just eccentric and demanding, but without putting on a show.
The guys were not in boot camp, they already went through it at Ft. Dix. They were at Biloxi for combat skills training. That's why Toomey was more easygoing.
share I agree with what's been said about Sgt. Toomey. He was not a bad guy. He was a drill sargeant. It was his job to be tough on his men.
But I don't think Epstein was a villain either. He was eighteen and "knew everything". WhaT teen-ager does NOT think he knows everything and the adults around him are clueless?
Fort Dix was inprocessing. 10 weeks of basic training means "ten weeks of basic training."
Basic = Boot Camp.
I never saw him as a bad guy either, he ws my favorite character in the film. I can't stand Epstein though, obnoxious.
share