Was the 'Biker from Hell', .......... - Raising Arizona (1987) Discussion

[–] dlonney 14 years ago

Not sure?

But one thing I read once, The Biker is an "evil force" the Coen Brothers put in their movies, who chases the main characters. It's something specific they do. Like Anton Chigurn from No "Country for Old men", The Sheriff from "O'Brother Where art thou"

reply

[–] vanguard59 14 years ago

dear dlonney:

Interesting!

It is not just the same tat, but "the Biker", had bronzed baby shoes, HI said he did not have parents,(that he knew), and a psychic connection to the "Biker ". "The Biker" probably sold H.I. into adoption?

reply

[–] land-on-the-moon 13 years ago

I was wondering too about a certain relationship - not father though, the biker didn't seem too old.
But the tattooed woody-woodpecker they had both was something intriguing; anyway, the irony is that they were trying to kill each other, and in the end one (ironically again, the one - H.I. - which wasn't very keen on killing) saw the tattoo but it was to late. So, maybe it's a sort of meditative bit - how humans kill each other, ignoring we might have some interesting things to share ...

reply

[–] vanguard59 13 years ago

land-onthemoon:

I believe the tat was from a thrush muffler ad.

The reason, and there are many, is the bronzed baby shoes Smalls has with him, HI was abandoned as a baby. Hey, how old does a guy have to be to be a father, i.e., conceive a child?

I just thought it added a biazarre twist to the tale that the Coen boys hinted that Smalls is HI's dad.

reply

[–] land-on-the-moon 13 years ago

:-) I don't know what a thrush muffler ad is (I'm not from US), but HI tattoo on the arm looked the same with what big Small had hidden on the chest.

And he obviously didn't have a certain age , but I also remember his tattoo on the arm, the big, in-your-face one, about the mamma + the dirty baby shoes suggesting more respite at an abandoning parent, if not just pure loathing for an unfair life/destiny ... that's why I thought of HI & Small being more like brothers

reply

[–] vanguard59 13 years ago

Dear land-onthemoon:

That is a totally cool theory. The problem is with the Coen boys, one never knows!

reply

[–] Case36 13 years ago

OP: I took him to be Hi's worst nightmare.

lol this movie is hilarious

reply

[–] vanguard59 13 years ago

Case36;

I totally dig this film---never tire of it. It still holds up!

I still think that Smalls is either his brother or father-------We will never know?????????

It is one of those PERFECT films!

reply

[–] courtneykarl-966-769117 11 years ago

I am sure he was HIs brother, given up for adoption in 54, with a metaphysical connection to HI.

reply

[–] land-on-the-moon 13 years ago

My problem with the Coen Bros is that they never seem to have any pity for their stupid/baddie characters ;-D

reply

[–] vanguard59 13 years ago

land-onthemoon:

I assume, they feel if you are that stupid or evil, then fate rears its' ugly head upon you?

Sometimes their films read like a "Ren& Stimpy", or a Warner Bros. "Roadrunner/Coyote" cartoon.

reply

[–] land-on-the-moon 13 years ago

yup, sort of persistence into the sin :-) that's why I find their (human) comedies quite scary (and funny as in "intrigued smile" ).

reply

[–] drtoni70 13 years ago

I thought that the biker represented H.I himself. When he killed him, it was as if he killed his bad side and walked the straight and narrow from that point on.

reply

[–] sean_ohlson-1 13 years ago

That's how I always took it. Smalls and H.I. were always the 'good and evil' aspects of the same entity.

reply

[–] MrSiegal 13 years ago

Interesting notions. I don't know what the exact connection between HI and Smalls but I believe the link between the two is established by the Thrush woodpecker tattoos. Also, the last thing HI says to Smalls, "I'm sorry" establishes some kind of connection between the two. Anyway, I think it's more likely that they were long lost brothers or Smalls was the darker half of HI's dual nature. Not his father as I think they were too close in age.

How do the angels get to sleep when the Devil leaves his porch light on?

reply

[–] MaximumMadness 12 years ago

From a symbollic standpoint, the Biker seemed to represent H.I.'s psyche in a way. (Basically the personification of his insecurities, fears, etc. His darker side and darker feelings.) The fact that it's left vague just who he is works for the film. He essentially is H.I.

And FURTHERMORE, this is my signature! SERIOUSLY! Did you think I was still talking about my point?

reply

[–] FEL123_2000 12 years ago

I always took the biker to be HI's rebelious, evil side. The side that got him in prison so much. When he killed the biker, it was a metaphor for killing his rebelious side and becoming someone who can raise a good family.

____________________
"If you put your mind to it, you can accomplish anything." -George McFly

reply

[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] midnight_muse 11 years ago

I thought Smalls was HI's father. Didn't he say he sold a baby on the black market in 1954? That would make that baby about 33 at the time of the film -- much likelier HI than Smalls, age-wise.

Edited to add:

I just checked and Smalls says he himself fetched $30k in 1954. It seems unlikely for him to know that, even if true; but more importantly, he looks easily 50 to me (the actor was 47). HI is the one who seemed more 30-ish to me, especially given those multiple stints in an adult prison.

Also, I thought the bronzed baby shoes the biker carried were a trophy or remembrance from the sale of his son. But who knows, maybe they are brothers. Obviously, Smalls is symbolic, but I'm not sure he's entirely so, since Nathan Sr. and Edwina both interact with him in a relatively realistic way...

At any rate, nicely ironic Steinbeck reference -- this Lenny Smalls kills rabbits because he means to.

_____________

I don't come from hell. I came from the forest.

reply