Dont understand how Eddie used Vince
In the last scene Vince screams at Eddie and says you used me..
I do not understand how Eddie used Vince?
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MovieChat Forums > The Color of Money (1986) Discussion > Dont understand how Eddie used Vince
Im thinking that when Eddie forefited, the odds were in his favor,so the guys that bet on him all lost.Vincent included,when he asked if he wanted in on the action when he dropped the envelope off.
shareI think what he meant was that Eddie made money off of Vincent's talent. This was pure business for Eddie right from the start and Vincent was too naive to think they were friends going on a trip together...
shareFunny I should find this question. I just watched this again last night and finally paid attention to that line. I thought it was kind of out of place or, at minimum, a wrong choice of words at that moment. I took this whole thing as a battle of ego's: the teacher who used to be great vs the student who is great. However, Eddie's teaching's were not about "how to play pool" but "how to get people to think you're not good at pool".
I would have re-worded the line to something like:
"you taught me to win by losing, and the moment I win big you dump on me?"
it would have been a nice pun to throw in there.
As for the statement of Vince,"You used me,Eddie",I think that he was expecting Eddie to stick to him all throughout the road up to Atlantic City.But unfortunately,Eddie had a change of heart and decided to make a comeback of his own as a pool player.That was evident during the match between Grady Seasons and Vince in the billiards hall before the tournament. Eddie got the itch from Vince considering the latter's excellence in pool and the desire to win all the time.
Overall,I think that Eddie and Vince taught one another and learned from each other while they were together during the road trip.
Eddie learned about excellence and purity from Vince.
That was evident when Eddie asked Vince to play his best game in the green hall and when he returned his "cut" to him.
While Vince learned being a hustler from Eddie.
That was evident when Vince dumped his match to Eddie during tournament.
The student taught the teacher a lesson in humility in the end. Vincent dumped the game against Eddie and made it look legit. in AC and made it look real. In the beginning, Eddie did in fact use Vincent to get back into the game.
shareMy theory is this:
Eddie at first saw a gold mine in Vincent and thought he could actually teach the kid how to dump and they could make some money together. As Vincent's pride proved too hard to crack Eddie decided that maybe it was time he get back in the game. All the time spent in the pool halls while running around with Vincent gave him the fever again. Eddie thought Vincent will never be train-able so decided to use him to go around and check out the pool scene since he had been away from it for 25 years. He had no idea what was going on "in the streets" as evident by their first stop which turned out to be a clothing warehouse or some s&^t. So taking Vincent around turned into a "recon" mission of sorts to find out who's who in the zoo. Eddie then faked the "oh-my-god-I-can't-believe-I-just-got-hustled" by a lazy-eyed Forest Whitaker act to dump'em because by that time, he had saw where he can hustle and where he can't. Then what does he do? Immediately (after getting some new glasses of course) he goes back to the same exact places they were before and hustles up some money and more importantly self confidence and makes his way to Atlantic city.
When Vincent says, "You used me!" this is exactly what he was talking about. It couldn't have been about the money. He knew about that from the very beginning. Vincent was pissed because he dumped them in the middle of the road tour and quit staking him up to Atlantic city which was the agreed upon destination. Then he comes to find out that he just wanted to get a feel of the pool halls and used Vincent as a cover up to check it out.
If I could ask Scorsese 1 question it would be this.
My vote history link:http://imdb.com/mymovies/list?l=5504773
I think Vince felt that Eddie used him to get his competitve juices flowing again and eventually get himself back into the game. Eddie was like a crackhead for lack of a better term. Once he heard Vince's breaks he could not help himself but be drawn in even though he was in mid conversation. Once that happened Eddie started to get the itch for the action and used Vince to scratch that itch.
shareThis movie was inferior to "The Hustler" for sure. But still an OK movie, especially if you're a Newman fan.
I think that line of dialogue was described pretty well in some of the earlier replies....as to what it was supposed to mean.
But you could certainly make the case that although Eddie "used" Vince....Vince got the better end of the deal by far. He's not playing pool in little bars for a few bucks a game and working at "Toys R Us" or whatever.
He has learned how to hustle pool for big money. He has learned about a pool circuit where he can make good money if he doesn't want to hustle, or he can use some combo of both.
His girlfriend is digging him more too I think....she likes this lifestyle better than the one at the beginning.
Carmen also takes all of the money when Newman offers it & Vince doesn't take it...so he also ends up with that. And he was truly frustrating Eddie that he wouldn't "hustle" pool even when he knew for sure what he was expected to do. And then he hustles Eddie in the AC tourney.
When I first heard about this movie being made with Scorcese & Newman....as happens with movies at times....I was hoping for a great sequel....& got a decent movie. I guess Godfather 2's only happen once....still looking for a sequel to equal. My 2 cents.
Oh yeah....see "The Artist".
therock525 hit it on the nail. This was all about the action for Fast Eddie, he was addicted to it till it nearly killed him in The Hustler so he quit for many years. Then Vince came in with the skill the Eddie had and basically caused him to relapse. He relapsed so hard he nearly lost the girl he was seeing because of it, just like an addict.
shareding ding ding ding!!!!!! Winner!!!!
The line "you used us, you used me" had nothing to with gambling or laying off or any of the more commonplace aspects of the relationship between a hustler and his stakehorse. It had everything to do with Eddie's use of Vince as a catalyst to reignite his own fire for action. Before running into Vince at the bar, Eddie was a has-been mope selling repackaged counterfeit spirits and staking low-rent hustlers. Vince reminded him of the young man he once was and of the thrill of the action he walked away from. It put his boring life into perspective. Remember how excited Eddie was charging up the stairs of the first "poolhall" they went to? That's what Vince gave Eddie.
I think it's debatable whether a flake like Vince would have picked up on this fairly subtle psychological point, especially since he made a lot of money off of their relationship and money seemed to be all Vince was about. I think he was still stung that Eddie abandoned them mid-trip even though at that point neither one needed the other anymore.
good answers, appreciate it.
shareThere's also the chance that... it's just how Vince felt, but not that Eddie actually did use him.
Eddie could have started out the mentor, fully intending to stay in the background, but as time passed, got an itch to play... but got hustled bad, and -then- got the -need- to win back after the beating he took... whereupon they parted company, Eddie saying they didn't need him and giving them their stake... because staying would have been coasting on Vince and using him.
Later, the girlfriend says Eddie was right, they didn't need him back at that point. But when Eddie forfeits and returns the money, Vince gets all indignant and feels he was used because now Eddie's in it for real, for himself, to actually win... and not the dutiful mentor hustler. So he feels used that Eddie's in the game to win, not just to hustle. However, I don't think the movie portrays Eddie ever having the idea to use the kid to scope the pool scene... he just, midway, got the will to come back, instead of just mentor/profit.
Eddie used Vince to get back into pool. He thought he simply wanted to pass on his gift to a younger man, but deep down he was trying to live vicariously through Vince, and finally began to realize that he still had the skill to be the best. They went from being teacher and student to competitors, and Vince felt used because Eddie didn't make this clear from the start. However, the "using" was subconscious, not something done maliciously on Eddie's part. He had just given up the game for so long he figured he'd never be able to go back in himself.
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