MovieChat Forums > Auf Wiedersehen, Pet (1983) Discussion > The general assumption is (1st + 2nd ser...

The general assumption is (1st + 2nd series comparisons)

posted 15 years ago by LfcMotd73
14 replies | jump to latest

that the first series back in November 1983 was the best and I agree myself. It's still the GREATEST TV SHOW of all time bar none to me. Other TV has come close but nothing replaces it as no. 1 to me even after 26 years.
But the people who say series 2 wasn't as good and that to get the lads back together was always going to be contrived writing are missing the point; it WAS a great series and better than anything else on TV at the time.
The most horrible thing about the second series was that Gary died and I've said on other posts that how much I miss him and how gutted I was he died and still am.

I've heard even Dick & Ian saying that the second series was contrived but even if it was- it wasn't badly executed. Barry called up his mates who -at the time- were only 3 to 4 yrs into not seeing each other. They all had nothing going on due to unemployment and circumstances and all fancied a reunion anyway. From there the work rolled in, end of. How is that so contrived?
Also on Drama Connections Dick & Ian agreed that they'd never have burnt the hut down in the climax to series 1 and Allan McKeown agreed. Stan Hey wrote the last episode incidentally.
But if they -like they said- wanted to stay in the hut in Germany for years then they COULD have kept the hut in or at least resons for the lads to stay.
To me-it was a great ending and the only real way to end series 1; the lads all bar 1 (Wayne) returning home.

It would definitely have been interesting to see how a 2nd series in Dusseldorf would've progressed and to see more individual episodes in a second series as opposed to the "continuing" storyline in series 2.
I loved series 2 but- yeah, even I see flaws. The greatest tragedy is that Gary didn't live and - even if he did- would Jimmy Nail- who was getting a rep as having a big ego and being difficult at the time- have jepordised a series 3 in 1987-1988? We'll never know obviously.
But if the truth about Gary and Jimmy falling out before Gary's death are to be believed it seems that a series 3- with Gary- would've been delayed anyway.
Gary's death has long LONG cast a shadow over this classic series- much more than people realise. It was a 7-header and you take away one and it's not the same. But with Gary Holton- that bright shining geezer- it was even more gloomy for the demise of a great show.

Series 3 was ok but it just wasn't the same, no matter how muchDick & Ian say is was great ( Christ, in Drama Connections one of them even said that series 3 or 4 was the best so far!!!!..seems to me they just talked it up because of cost and location).
Anyway series 1 and 2, in summing up, go hand in hand. Series 1 is like having your first drink, getting a shag every weekend and havng the time of your young life and series 2 is still drinking,but being married and having a sensible car and mortgage).

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[–] pgreenfi 15 years ago

Just rewatching the show again and I'm on to season 2. I really like season 2 and always preferred it to season 1 as there is far more funny moments in it. My alltime favourite scene is when they are in a posh bar in Derbyshire and this guy says Neville was sitting on his stall which gets Oz to say so you come into the bar with that stall under your arm.

I have often wondered how the original season 3 would have panned out. If rumours are to be believed they were all set to do a 3rd season ut with Gary Holton's death and Jimmy Nail becoming a realy pain that was cancelled.

[–] SteveResin 15 years ago

I agree with the OP about series one being the greatest tv show ever, it's certainly mine. The beauty of AWP, the genius writing aside, is the fact there are 7 lead characters so it never gets really stale or boring. I really rate series 3 too, Barry was fantastic in it and tho it greatly missed Holton I found it a joy to be catching up with all the lads in middle age. They should have left it at that, because everything after series 3 was just pure pantomime.

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God Hates Fangs!

[–] Howlin Wolf 15 years ago

Why were Gary and Jimmy supposed to have fallen out?

I've been in love! Just 'cos I've never been to Zimbabwe to buy someone a cake!

[–] LfcMotd73 14 years ago

Howlin Wolf,
a late reply but only just saw your question after all these months away.
It appeared to be the case at the time that Jimmy was getting a bit of an ego and basically hijacking the scripts and making life difficult on set.
Since the first series aired he knew he'd become quite a star and this was in it's infancy really. He became a star in late 1983 through the whole of 1984 and here they were in early to mid 1985 with Jimmy riding on the crest of a wave.
But apparentley he started taking himself too seriously and thinking himself more important.
Gary was having a lot of trouble with the press trying to expose his drug and sex life and do exclusives on him.
Jimmy apparentley was getting envious that Gary was getting more press and also because Gary was still dealing with a drug addiction there were problems on set resulting in them falling out.
Everyone was surprised because the 7 actors had been such good friends during the first series and Gary and Jimmy particularly so, probably due to their background in music too.
They were friends and they had fallen out.
With hindsight I suppose Nail must regret it happening (it could be a case of petty squabbles that would have got resolved) and maybe the two would have made up.
There was a lot of bad luck on the shoot of the 2nd series. Kevin Whateley once said he felt the show was jinxed by bad luck.#
The biggest blow to the show was also the most saddest- Gary dying.
We'll never know the truth totally unless Jimmy talks about it properly (he skirted over it in his autobiography) but it happened and it can't be changed.

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[–] Howlin Wolf 14 years ago

Thanks for the info. I suppose you could call me a bit of a newcomer to the show, because I only first saw it properly this year.

My grandparents used to have it on in the background all of the time when I was little, but only being young then, I never paid it much attention... However, recently a new family friend told me how great it was, so I got all four series on DVD. I watched the first series earlier this year and thought it was brilliant; the second series is currently cued up in my player, ready to go.

"I've been turned down more times than the beds at the Holiday Inn; I still try"

[–] nephihaha 13 years ago

Series 2 is definitely weaker, but there's still some great moments in it. I've been rewatching it recently.

Bits that stick out for me, include Oz trying to tickle trout, Barry kicking someone in, the barman being exposed as a "tiger", Oz turning out to be banging Fraser's girlfriend, or the finale, which is also quite funny. I think the Spanish episodes are stronger though.

There's a couple of great lines between Fraser and his bird (something like this): -
"This is made from organic cotton, whatever that means."
"It means the worms were free range love."

I thought Bill Paterson was miscast as Fraser. He's too nice, but he makes a good fist of it.

Kenny Ames is great, I thought he was well played.

Lowlights of series 2, for me, include the upper class stereotypes near Thornley Manor and the couple in Marbella. Considering how well the rest of the series was written, they could have been turned into rounded characters. (Although Mr Pringle *was* funny)

I liked Wayne, but he was a bit two dimensional (the two dimensions being sex and music)

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It's not "sci-fi", it's SF!

[–] 13 years ago

[deleted]

[–] nephihaha 13 years ago

"The majority of the series, he's more a hard-nosed businessman than the 'most feared man on Tyneside'."

To be fair, though, as Dennis himself says, Fraser is mostly legit these days. His strategy, like the Mafia, was presumably to build up money, and turn it into real business. He still cuts corners though, and dodges tax, so now he's more shady than criminal.

I'm not sure the English viewers would pick up on this, but Ally Fraser has quite a posh accent (west central Scotland). Not extremely posh, but posh enough to have gone to one of the Glasgow merchant schools. I don't know what to make of this. At some points, he's a hard nosed keelie who's risen up from the bottom, and at certain others, he can quote Rupert Brooke and there are hints that he is middle class gone bad. At another point, when he tries to be too clever, he's picked up by the architect (when he says Thornely Manor was built by coal workers).

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It's not "sci-fi", it's SF!

[–] alexlarge 13 years ago

God I can't believe they considered setting series 2 in Germany - it would quickly have turned into a soap opera if they'd done that. Reuniting the lads in the UK was a brave decision and one that worked, in my opinion. I consider series 2 no weaker than series 1, it's just different. I love them both equally.

[–] nephihaha 13 years ago

Series 2 had those annoying scenes with them meeting posh folk. Didn't work, as almost all the posh folk were cardboard cut out stereotypes.

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It's not "sci-fi", it's SF!

[–] richie_wilkie 12 years ago

The problem with series two was that series one had set the bar so high.
It had to be watched every week you made sure you were in for it.
It didn't build up slowly say for instance like Only Fools and horses it was getting attention from the first episode.
Bare in mind back then we only had 4 channels(?) at most so it was massive.
I know my mates and I talked about it at school.
No matter what they did with the second series it was always going to struggle slightly.
They admit burning the hut down was a mistake but after introducing the labour law thread into it as well, where could they have gone?
If they didn't burn the hut down and introduce the new labour law plot then we'd have had a second series in Germany.
Dennis and Wayne were already spending time with their girls so the magnificent 7 would likely have drifted apart I'm not sure another "hut" series would have worked.

I liked series 2 it gave us the chance to fill out a bit of lads backstories.
We get a glimpse of what they are up to and introduce their famillies abit more.
Apart from that it's famillier stuff replace Herr Grunwold "camp commandant" with Ally Fraser local gangster either way he's still ordering Dennis about.

The Gary / Wyane death did cast a shadow over the filming I think everyone admits that.
At least they tried to work round it sensitively now a days he'd have gone to the toilet and came back completely different.

I would personally have liked the funeral to have been Waynes at the opening of series three.
Barry and Wayne could have stayed in contact and Barry could have brought them together for it.
Then OZ could have mentioned he was putting a team together and away we went.
It would have gave everyone he chance to say goodbye to Wayne properly.

I enjoyed 3 & 4 I don't think they took themselves seriously and it bennifited from that.
Also I'm not sure how Jimmy Nail was on that shoot but I guess he wasn't the biggest hotshot actor amongst that crew anymore so probably wasn't calling as many shots.

[–] Robbjedi 10 years ago

I remember thinking that series 2 was actually series 2 and 3, with Thornley Manor being S2 and Spain being S3. I was very young at the time though!

Because of that, I always considered S2 as my favourite (as in the Thornley Manor part). I liked the way that Dennis is re-introduced where it looks as though he is well off and Vicky is his hot young girlfriend when he is picking her up from the salon only for it to transpire that he is just the chauffeur.

I loved all the UK episodes and consider the 'Magnificent 7' scene in the motorway cafe as one of the greatest scenes of all time. Brilliantly written and brilliantly acted. I also love the fact that the classic riff from the Magnificent 7 score was incorporated into one of the songs as well. Pure genius.

[–] alwaysannoying 8 years ago

The Spain episodes were by far the weakest of those first two series. I always try thought the whole series should have been set in the UK.

[–] liberius 8 years ago

Huge fan here, but series 3 and 4 are pale shadows of 1 and 2 which have a grittiness and sharpness that can never be matched.

Yes, series 2 has a few rough edges but there's so much packed into it you never get a chance to worry about it.