Buzz and Sonja DO still exist during the syndicated era! - Mama's Family (1983) Discussion

[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

It doesn't matter what you say, even if the producer HIMSELF stated that they do exist, you will never convince ppl who say they don't. I personally always felt like they did, in fact I never even THOUGHT of them not existing. Just b/c a character is not mentioned doesn't mean they cease existing. Ppl always refer to Vint saying if he has a boy he wants to name him Vinton and if he ha sa girl, Vintina... Honestly by now, I think we should realize we cannot but a lot of stock in what Vint says when he makes a dumb comment.

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] AdrianLePier 9 years ago

Other people have been arguing for years that Buzz and Sonja absolutely ceased to exist after the show left the network. Rick Hawkins could have easily went with that angle too, but didn't. He could have said something like "these two characters didn't work out, and in our pursuit to reboot the series into something fresh and new, we opted to clear them from the canvas so that the character of Vint wouldn't be bogged down with having to be a father." He could have said something along those lines, but didn't. Instead he confirms that in the writers mind, they were simply shuffled off to college -- which means that they continued to exist in MF's syndicated continuity, despite being almost never referred to. And I still fail to understand how Vint's two kids being mentioned - by name - in the first episode of the syndicated phase of the show is insignificant, when it absolutely acknowledges their actuality in this seeming brand new era for the show, despite their lack of physical presence. Also, as I said in another thread: in Bubba's home movie episode, Thelma mentions having more grandchildren than him. Gee, I wonder *who* they could've been? Miss me on the random comments about Dodge Ball and "Vintina." Vint has three kids: Sonja, Buzz and Tiffany. Meh. Whatever. It's like talking to a closed door.

That being said...next to nothing changed.

NBC = Syndicated. Same show. Same universe. Same tapestry. Different seasons.

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] GrumpyGuy 9 years ago

To honor the greatest tv characters since Mallory and Alex P. Keaton, course.

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[–] GrumpyGuy 9 years ago

THEY LIVE!!!!

After leaving Rayown, Buzz developed a personality and eloped with Tommy Boylan to San Francisco.

Sonja developed an interest in politics and became the governor of Alaska.

Now you know.

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[–] cd31989 9 years ago

Sending them to college is a great explanation, especially since the show lasted 4 years in syndication, and that's how long most people attend college. Unlike most shows who write off characters, every character from the NBC years of MF were accounted for during the first few episodes of syndication. Buzz and Sonya mentioned twice as not being there, Fran killed off, Eunice and Ed moved to Florida, and Ellen made one more appearance in syndication to wrap up her story.

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[–] AdrianLePier 9 years ago

True. Even Claude, Burt Wembly, Leonard Oats and Duke Reeves were mentioned during the syndicated run. This is why I balk at the idea that the 'NBC universe' and the 'syndicated universe' aren't one and the same. They absolutely are. The show simply moved on/progressed from its first two seasons, but doesn't discount any of what it established. It'd be like saying the the Eastland, Edna's Edibles and Over Our Heads eras of The Facts of Life weren't all in the same universe and conjoined. Yeah they were.

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

The only reason I have toyed with the idea of the 2 Mama's Family versions being in different universes is b/c the characters act SO DIFFERENT..If you watch the 1st episode of MF and the last episode back to back...Mama is hardly recognizable as the same character...her voice, personality, etc.. are so different.

At least in the versions of Facts Of Life, they all act pretty much the same.

ALSO even if the NBC universe is separate from the syndicated universe, that doesn't mean some of the same characters could not exist and even some of the same events.

For e.g. if, in a later syndicated episode, Vint's and Naomi's wedding was recalled, I get the feeling, from the perspective of the syndicated characters, the wedding would have been much more "syndicated style"....For e.g. I'm betting Iola would have been present at the wedding and probably been all jealous Vint was marrying Naomi...Eunice may or may NOT have been there, but I bet there would have been no conflict over the ring, or if there was, it would have been very little, major HEAVY drama was not a part of the syndicated era...so Mama would have probably just yelled, "SIT DOWN AND SHUT THE HELL UP!" to Eunice and Eunice probably would have and that would have been that, b/c syndicated Mama was ALL POWERFUL, always had the last word and no one ever really fought back with her.

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[–] AdrianLePier 9 years ago

If you watch the first and last episode of virtually any series that's been on the air for at least five years, you'll probably see a stark contrast in the characters personality. Watch the first and last episodes of Roseanne and you'll see a radical change in how she comes off. Facts of Life. Blair in season 1 compared to the final season is much different too. That's just what happens when a TV series - sitcom, especially - runs for a number of seasons. The writers, directors and the actors themselves find a groove that hadn't been yet developed during season one. It usually becomes campier and "brighter" in tone as time wears on. In season two, still on NBC, Mama's, Vint's and Naomi's personalities had all already started their shifts to what they'd ultimately be. Mama was more lighthearted, spirited and proactive...Vint and Naomi both became sillier. It just continued gravitate in that direction during the syndicated run. Even Sonja radically changed in persona and temperament towards the end of her run versus how she was initially presented, and this was while the show was still on the network. Again, that just happens.

Some people just like to draw a line in the sand where MF is concerned because of how the first two seasons aired versus the last four. In the grand scheme of things, though, the changes that happened at MF aren't unlike what happens at most sitcoms. The only difference is that Mama changed locations (channels).

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

The major difference I notice in Mama is that she goes from being a grouchy old woman that ppl dread being around who is a party-pooper and can rain on anyone's parade, to being COOL GRANNY who is the life of the party that everyone LOVES being around. I'm recalling the time Mama's night school teacher was telling about his late wife Rebecca describing her as a woman EVERYONE loved being around and Bubba chimes in and says, "Rebecca sounds a lot like you, Grandma!" Can you imagine someone saying that about the Thelma Harper of yore, most ppl on the NBC episode and on the Carol Burnett Sketches cringed at mention of Mama's name, she went from that to ppl in the syndicated episodes saying, "It's just not a party without Thelma!" I believe Iola said that once.

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[–] AdrianLePier 9 years ago

Mama on NBC:

- Saves Buzz and Sonja's school dance with her music and performing
- Taught herself to drive in one day and put the sarcastic guy at the DMV in his place.
- Turned Gert's depressing nursing home into a party atmosphere
- Humorously took over the courtroom when her and Naomi were suing each other
- Hilariously took down the crooked car salesman and street bandit
- Was the life of Food Circus when she worked there.

Mama was already becoming a cool, feisty granny while the show was still on the network. That more ancrid attitude you're thinking about was mostly on TCBS and maybe the first handful of MF episodes during season 1.

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

Another funny thing is that I and another poster noticed is on the EARLY Family Sketches Mama is much more feisty and comical more like in the syndicated episodes of Mama's Family.. I just wonder if that was the original concept for mama and mama's family just returned her to that?

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

The only reason I have toyed with the idea of the 2 Mama's Family versions being in different universes is b/c the characters act SO DIFFERENT..If you watch the 1st episode of MF and the last episode back to back...Mama is hardly recognizable as the same character...her voice, personality, etc.. are so different.

At least in the versions of Facts Of Life, they all act pretty much the same.

ALSO even if the NBC universe is separate from the syndicated universe, that doesn't mean some of the same characters could not exist and even some of the same events. Maybe the syndicated universe has it's own version of Buzz and Sonya.

For e.g. if, in a later syndicated episode, Vint's and Naomi's wedding was recalled, I get the feeling, from the perspective of the syndicated characters, the wedding would have been much more "syndicated style"....For e.g. I'm betting Iola would have been present at the wedding and probably been all jealous Vint was marrying Naomi...Eunice may or may NOT have been there, but I bet there would have been no conflict over the ring, or if there was, it would have been very little, major HEAVY drama was not a part of the syndicated era...so Mama would have probably just yelled, "SIT DOWN AND SHUT THE HELL UP!" to Eunice and Eunice probably would have and that would have been that, b/c syndicated Mama was ALL POWERFUL, always had the last word and no one ever really fought back with her.

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[–] renatom1 9 years ago

I wonder what actors Eric Brown and Karin Argoud have to say about Buzz and Sonya. Interestingly, neither one of them ever appeared in any reunions or DVD commentaries. So I'm guessing that Mama's Family would like us to believe they never existed.

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[–] stevenackerman69 9 years ago

Well, at least have them come home from college every now and then. Also, what about the fact that they were going to have a half-sibling?

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 9 years ago

They probably did, we just never saw it, you have to remember in the "sitcom universe" we are only seeing small snippets of the characters lives, I'm sure a lot happened when the "cameras were not on" lol

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] winstonsims431 8 years ago

when bubba first moves in with mama I remember her telling bubba "You can have Buzz's old room" so buzz is atleast mentioned in the first episode with bubba it would've been cool to see buzz and bubba together the two of them together would've drove mama insane

"Touchdoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooown Auburn"

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 8 years ago

Mama said, "You can have Frannie's old room." But yeah I have no problem believing Buzz and Sonya still exist.

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[–] deem_bastille 8 years ago

They were mentioned with: No Buzz and Sojna. that was it.

Oh God. Fortune vomits on my eiderdown once more.

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[–] 8 years ago

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[–] KlassickVideo 8 years ago

it would've been cool to see buzz and bubba together

Perhaps. However, I'm probably not the only one who suspects some sort of homoerotic interest in your tone. lol.

Not that there's nothing wrong with that! Such a scenario would be totally believable and likely-tolerated -- After all, Raytown is a fictional "Midwest Town" and not some primitive "Southern Town" in a bastion of bigoted, hate.

Somebody call Reverend Meechum! Times have-a-changed in Raytown. Not to say that such a wedding would be permitted at Mama's Church..but the "RayAlto Theater" might be a nice venue? Ya think? LOL.

-KlassickVideo

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[–] AdrianLePier 8 years ago

Perhaps. However, I'm probably not the only one who suspects some sort of homoerotic interest in your tone. lol.

You probably were...

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 8 years ago

The fact Buzz and Bubba are cousins would be a little bit odd, but other than that.... lol

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[–] deem_bastille 8 years ago

so then their mother was apparently making enough to cover the cost of 'college'.

srsly, we never hear from them again.

Oh God. Fortune vomits on my eiderdown once more.

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[–] tinkerbell_jonna 8 years ago

They could have worked and put themselves through college, OR maybe Mama paid for their college like she did for Bubba. Just b/c you don't hear from someone again, doesn't mean they stop existing... I'm not saying they do still exist, I'm just saying that's kinda a bad argument to say someone no longer exists.

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