Robbie Robbertson's Microphone Off???? - The Last Waltz (1978) Discussion

[–] Boogie_Knight 19 years ago

I don't believe his mike was turned off, but it was much lower in the mix. The turned off assertion comes from Levon Helm's ghostwriter which may not be the most reliable source.

I do not own (yet) the Complete Last Waltz, which is the unvarnished and complete concert, but I have heard it, and I swear I can hear Robbie in there. He was used in live concerts to augment Richard' high vocal harmonies, after Richard was physically unable to keep it going for a whole show. Robbie's high end voice sounds alot like Richard's, except raspier, and, well, not as good.

The music you hear on the released album and the film is so cleaned up and overdubbed that it is hard to tell who is singing what in the background, at least between Richard and Robbie. But I'm pretty sure he was turned on and actually singing.

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[–] 19 years ago

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[–] clint16s 19 years ago

I'd say that it was probably just mixed out or down. I can't hear him myself, but he was a working musician for almost 20 years at that point. If he couldn't hear himself in the live mix, then why would he have been singing at all up there? If I was backing somebody up and couldn't hear myself in the monitors, I'd probably quit trying to sing after hours and hours on stage. And while I agree that Robbie has a serviceable voice, it isn't a familiar thing to hear in the Band's recordings. If you're intent on giving the audience the best possible sendoff show, you give them a cranked up version of what they know, not a whole new vocal sound to try and appreciate in one performance. I recently saw video of Robbie doing "The Weight" at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame opening ceremony with Sheryl Crow and Dr. John backing up. I love the guy, but that was crap.

You're spending too much time in the water, Bruce!

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[–] starmarker 19 years ago

I tend to believe what Levon Helm says. I think the mike was turned off, certainly there's no indication of Robbie's voice in the mix. I can pick out the distinct sounds of The Band's vocalists (Levon, Rick, Richard) and there ain't no Robbie in there. I think Robbie made a point of appearing to sing intentionally and did it because he was on his own major ego trip throughout that movie. He wanted to be the leader on-stage, and simply being the guitarist meant surrendering some of the spotlight to the other band members. Speaking of fakes, if you play guitar or bass, take a good look at Danko's fingers on some of the tunes. The bass lines we're hearing don't match up with what his fingers are doing on the fretboard. Obviously, the bass was overdubbed/fixed latter.

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[–] aaron_aaron31 18 years ago

As far as the overdubbing goes, you're right. The only thing which remained untouched was Levon's drums and vocals and that was because he refused to be a part of the overdubbing process due to his objections to the film in general.
Robbie's mic was accidentally left on during their Woodstock performance. Their sound guys were under strict orders to keep the mic off because his voice didn't work within the sound of the band. Whomever made the mistake at Woodstock was fired.

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[–] twobitkevin 18 years ago

Okay we ALL know Robbie's voice sucks. Saying it is weak is a disturbing understatement and clearly you have not listened to the live perfomances on the Festival Express DVD. So please...leave the singing to Levon, Richard, and Danko...after all there is a good reason you can't hear Robbie...

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[–] wanna_b_anarchy 18 years ago

Certainly Robbie was not a vocal contributor to the band, but his singing on his solo work is good in my opionion. It wouldn't have fit in with the band and its sound, but he can sing. To me all these posts, along with all the posts that want to make Robbie into some villain and egomaniac, are just conspiracy theorists. This happens with all fans, they think they know the artists, or they've got the inside scoop on what really went down and try to blame someone for a band breaking up. As far as Robbie's mike being off, I doubt it, it was likely turned down, as he was never singing lead, just augmenting the other vocalists. Even if in some alternate universe, Robbie's mike was off, then who cares if he was singing? Maybe he just wanted to sing along, why does he have to be heard? Can't he just sing for singings sake? I sing along to The Band's music when I hear it, not because I'm an egomaniac, but because the music is moving, I feel a connection just like Robbie and I want to sing along to it.

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[–] TimmyAnn 17 years ago

That's exactly what I was thinking, wanna_b_anarchy. Just because no one can hear him doesn't mean he can't sing along. I've seen at least one band in which one person doesn't even have a microphone and yet he is singing along. I don't claim to know Robbie Robertson (or any of the other band members) so I don't know if he is or isn't as arrogant as people make him out ot be, but I find it interesting that so many others who don't know him any more than I do are willing and eager to accept the word of Levon (whom I also do not know and neither do the people who take his word for this).

I do not have attention deficit disor...Ooh, look at the bunny!

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[–] 17 years ago

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[–] jgroub 10 years ago

There's singing along, and there's singing along. When you're not supposed to be singing along, you can sing along all you want - away from the microphone. Watch Sheryl Crow singing along with Levon in the first 30 seconds of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSzMVKjlFdM

Notice how she does so AWAY from the microphone? She's singing along for herself. Sure she's allowed to do that. But she's away from the mike so she doesn't get picked up. You've seen plenty of people do this in videos - drummers, bassists, everyone likes to sing along.

But the only reason to sing along and specifically go to the microphone when you do so is that you somehow think the mike is on and that you're contributing to the sound of the band. Yet in the end, when we watch The Last Waltz and listen to the music, they don't match up. He's singing along, but his voice is nowhere to be found.

I want the doctor to take your picture so I can look at you from inside as well.

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[–] El Guapo-2 17 years ago

Re: Robbie Robbertson's Microphone Off????
by - twobitkevin on Wed Sep 13 2006 22:37:02
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay we ALL know Robbie's voice sucks. Saying it is weak is a disturbing understatement and clearly you have not listened to the live perfomances on the Festival Express DVD. So please...leave the singing to Levon, Richard, and Danko...after all there is a good reason you can't hear Robbie...

Me:

I think Levon said "Turn Robbie's microphone off!" offstage to someone unseen after the first verse of "the weight" right before "I picked up my bag..."

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[–] mjdick77 11 years ago

It's pretty obvious that Jaco Pastorius was playing his distinctive bass lines on Joni Mitchell's songs. Very few bass players are or were in Jaco's league, including Danko.

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[–] JohnKoliba 17 years ago

After Van Morrison's performance Robbie Robertson goes up to the mic and says "Van the man". Maybe that was someone else's mic.
PS Compared to Manuel, Danko and Levon Robbie's voice stinks.

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[–] CaulfieldHolden 16 years ago

I think his voice was taken out after, cause what about all the times he sang into someone elses mic, like in the Neil Young song.

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[–] e_brunton 15 years ago

Robbie never sang into a live mic. He also only sang one song on all the studio albums, "To Kingdom Come". To say he had a great voice is a bit of an overstatement. Its gravelly and unique, but not great. Besides he never fit into the harmonies that helm, danko, and manuel could create.

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[–] Boogie_Knight 15 years ago

Three songs actually, also "Knockin Lost John" and "Out of the Blue".

And he is clearly on mike on the Festival Express show.

He was an middling to adequate singer in a band with three great singers. Live, he did sing into a real, live mike, albeit one that was mixed lower, and was used to augment the high end harmonies that Richard Manuel did, giving Richard a chance to lay back and rest for his lead vocals.

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[–] bradford-1 14 years ago

Non-singing members of groups can often be seen mouthing lyrics, if only to keep their place and to remember cues. I did that when I played in groups. Never sang on mike, but always sang along. In old videos, one can see folks like Bill Wyman mouthing the words to songs.

"We're fighting for this woman's honor, which is more than she ever did."

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[–] Loomis_Orange 14 years ago

If you've seen The Last Waltz you wll surely remember the soundstage piece where The Band does The Weight with a lot of help from The Staple Singers. The main argument Levon was making when he said Robbie "strained his neck muscles and all while singing into a turned off microphone" was mainly that one instance when it was obvious to everyone Robbie was "playing" it for the camera. If you listen to that Festival Express thing you can kinda tell that having Robbie's vocals mixed iup with the other guys screwed the guys up in their harmonies. Robbie is a subtle singer. The song sketch of "Twilight" is wonderful, and no one could ever do "Out of the Blue" with the soul Robbie put into it becuase "Out of the Blue" is a very personal song, and he done a wonderful job on Between Trains also. It's more than apparent that Robertson can get a vocal across and pull out your heart with it. To me that's what a singer is. Lots of songwriters "can't sing" but that doesn't mean they don't get their message across in a very pungent way. Levon Helm is a singer. he can't write worth a crap, but he can interpret other's songs. Everyone's got their gift. Of course, Robbie has found his "nitch" now and sings in almost a spoken word which I'm sure he finds easier and less taxing on the muscles. His first solo had songs so strong that in every piece he uses everything he can muster. His voice is thin and fragile but dang, it can project through steel walls at times.

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[–] bradford-1 13 years ago

Somebody like Jimmy Durante had no "voice" whatsoever, but whenever I hear Durante croaking an old ballad like "Count Your Blessings," I'm reduced to tears. Interpretation is a large part of singing, eh?

"May I bone your kipper, Mademoiselle?"

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[–] Loomis_Orange 13 years ago

I wouldn't consider Bob Dylan a "singer" in the classic sense of the word but there's no one I would rather hear sing a Bob Dylan sing than Dylan himself.
Levon never considered himself to be a singer. He would always sorta say well, shucks, The Band was in need of another voice and I was nominated. Levon loved playing the drums. Don't think there was EVER a drummer in the history of the instrument that put as massive amount of soul, depth and pure magic into drums than Levon Helm. He was just made of music from the soles of his feet to the top of his head. Pure Music!

It's ironic to me that we have lost the three most authentic modern southern voices this year. I don't believe can EVER be replaced. William Gay, Harry Crews and Levon Helm, lost them all in the last two months, and before that Barry Hannah. My three fevorite writers and my favorite musician... Bang

2012 has been very sad for us.. very sad indeed.

Accept Loss ~ Jack Kerouac

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[–] kristinaknight 12 years ago

This is ridiculously old at this point but I just wanted to say well said.

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[–] zappalover 10 years ago

The golden rule is at play here -- those who own the gold make the rules. Robbie produced the film and is hence the owner of this worthwhile effort, and unfortunately pumps up his perceived musical importance with Scorsese's direction, whether intentional or not. Compared to Helm, Manuel and Danko, Robertson is a weak singer yet the amount of time the cameras spend on his "singing" out front deceives the viewer as to his importance to the excellent sound. Helm's drumming and Manuel's voice are not showcased sufficiently in the film, and the viewer is hardly aware Hudson exists. But without Robertson's business acumen and writing talents, this film and much of The Band's output after their second album would not exist. Some may say The Band should have ended it sooner than they did -- perhaps Rick and Richard would have been better off -- but of course no one really knows. I am pleased this documentary was made, but remain angry of the lingering perception that Robbie was not only the leader of the group, but more important musically than he was. RIP, Levon.

Life is a state of mind.

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[–] Loomis_Orange 10 years ago

I believe Robbie was the ONLY one who wanted the 1976 Thanksgiving Winterland show to happen. Everyone else was as sour and pissed off as they could be. And no wonder. They wanted The Band to go on.. Nothing Wrong with that. It was Their Life too.

Just watch the Dylan set. No one can tell me there was not EXTREME intense animosity on that stage. The camera people were almost FORCED to keep the cameras on Robbie for he was the only one who went out of his way to fake having a good time. Levon, when Neil Young came out and said that "it was one of the pleasures of his life to be able to be on this stage with these people tonite " and then went onto say "They got it now Robbie.." check out Levon in the background. If those sticks had been knives Robbie would have been a dead man. The entire release of the film depended on whether or not Dylan decided to sing more than one or two songs. That show was a total nightmare for those guys. Joni Mitchell's face during the last song was another dead giveaway.. sad sad sad

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[–] 11 years ago

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