surfing actors????


I've just finished watching the film for the second time. And i still can't decide if in the big swell sequence at the end its actually the actors doing the surfing. The cuts are just a bit too quick. can anyone help me out?

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[deleted]

I think that was a marketing ploy. In the commentary, Milius makes it clear that although Vincent and Ross were pretty good recreational surfers (Busey apparently was just a beginner), they still exhibited nowhere near the skill level required to adequately tackle the big 10-15 footers seen at the end of the film. And if you watch the swell scenes carefully, it's pretty clear since you never really see any of the principles in action from the waist up, it's always either the upper body or the lower body which is in frame. Obviously, doubles were being used.

But hey, it's a fair trade as far I'm concerned. Actors do the acting and focus on the story, and the surfers do the surfing. Everybody wins.

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I remember reading in a Surfing magazine from the late '70s that the heavy-duty surfing shots were done by professional surfers ...
Take a look at http://www.surfline.com/surfaz/bigwednesday.cfm

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What about the scene where William Katt is out surfing by himself before heading over to Vietnam? The swell looks pretty good, although not nearly as big as what we see at the end of the film. Sure looks like Katt was doing his own surfing in this scene.

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J. Riddle rode for JMV, and Peter Townend rode for William Katt. Not sure who did the stunt riding for Gary Busey, it might have been Bill Hamilton. I'm sure that Jan-Michael did a good amount of his own surfing on the smaller swells, he was quite the athlete make in his day!

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Ian Cairns doubled for Busey. There were others who doubled for Katt and Vincent, too. This was in the days before CGI, mind you. Both Katt and Vincent were relatively competent surfers, and actually surf in some of the small-wave scenes.

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Billy Hamilton also rode for someone in there- he's in the credits along with Cairns, Townend, J Riddle, Gerry Lopez and Jackie Dunn. Wipeouts were Bruce Raymond and the Water Unit Liaison was none other than Fred Hemmings.

I also have wondered whether Katt surfed that wave himself, and have to guess no.

Only the dead stay seventeen forever.

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If William Katt was a "good recreational surfer" for more than a year or so, he could probably manage all the maneuvers displayed in "Jack's Lonesome Ride" scene. It's just a bunch of top turns and bottom turns on a wave that, at it's biggest, is MAYBE two feet overhead. And it's not an incredibly hollow or powerful-looking wave, so I'd say he could have pulled it off.

The surfer displayed quite a bit of style in that scene, though, so in addition to being able to pull off those moves, Katt would have had to pull them off and link them in a way that makes the ride into a masterpiece. An intermediate surfer (like me) could do this sort of ride on that kind of wave, but it's doubtful that he could do it consistently enough for them to film it.

So my opinion is that it's not him. Katt could probably do those maneuvers, but not on film.

In the Great Swell scene at the end, it's PAINFULLY OBVIOUS that a stunt double is surfing for Busey. There's one shot from the shoulder of the wave that's pretty close to him, and he's doing sort of a top-carve, and you can totally see that it's not him. Doesn't even look anything like him lol

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Bear in mind also that the film's producers probably would not want their highly paid actors risking injury in big dumping surf. The insurers would be against it too. Hence the stunt doubles.

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In the Great Swell scene at the end, it's PAINFULLY OBVIOUS that a stunt double is surfing for Busey. There's one shot from the shoulder of the wave that's pretty close to him, and he's doing sort of a top-carve, and you can totally see that it's not him. Doesn't even look anything like him lol


Billy Hamilton (doing a busey impression) at Sunset (looking kinda like Blacks on steroids.)\

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I was wrong.

http://thisdistractedglobe.com/2008/05/15/big-wednesday-1978/

To substitute the actors for the big wave sequences, Jay Riddle & Billy Hamilton, Peter Townsend and Ian Cairns doubled for Vincent, Katt and Busey respectively, while Jalama and Cojo Bay – both near Point Concepcion in Santa Barbara County – stood in for Malibu.


I think I read in Surfer's Journal that the Big Wave stuff is Sunset. I think the preceding quote is a little ambiguous- Townsend, Hamilton and Cairns stunt doubles in the big wave sequences, and Jalama and Cojo doubled for the Bu- but the big wave stuff was pretty much iconic Sunset.


Other tidbits I just found:

Production history
John Milius had scored a critical and commercial hit with a movie he wrote and directed – The Wind and the Lion – while an adaptation of Joseph Conrad’s Heart of Darkness he’d written in the late ‘60s – as Apocalypse Now – was set to start shooting in the Philippines under the direction of Francis Coppola. With the success to make nearly any movie he wanted, Milius turned to a subject he considered the most important in his life; his days surfing and growing up in Malibu.

Milius had at one time envisioned Big Wednesday as something he might write as a novel. Realizing the visual magnificence inherent to surfing, he brought in childhood friend and surfer Dennis Aaberg to remember everything they could about their youth and to write a screenplay together. Warner Bros. agreed to produce the memoir to the tune of $12 million. With an eye on casting actors who “all looked kind of heroic,” recreational surfers Jan-Michael Vincent and William Katt were selected, as was Gary Busey.


"Milius sums up the film’s appeal on the DVD audio commentary: “Surfing is a sport you do alone. You judge yourself alone. The only competition you have is yourself. You don’t bring anything back. There are no trophies, no antlers. You ride the biggest wave and the wave just dissipates on the beach. And so, it is a thing that’s internal. But what is strange about surfing is that the thing you remember most are the relationships. So really, it is something that is best done alone, but it is also something that builds incredible camaraderie and friendship. It is a brotherhood.”"

Big Wednesday practically defines the category “cult classic.” There may be little political material, and the coming of age story is tame by today’s standards, but there’s not much middle ground to occupy here. Moviegoers have either dismissed Big Wednesday for its flat characters, its melodrama or its inaccuracies – like a twenty-foot swell in Malibu – or been struck by the beauty of its mythos and its atmosphere, which capture the feeling of old time surfing better than any movie ever made.

Borrowing a page from Sam Peckinpah, Milius is less interested in exposing reality and more interested in exploring archetypes; larger than life characters achieving some sense of destiny against adverse forces. Instead of a plot, the story unfolds as any memoir would, as a series of loosely knit recollections. The characters aren’t as important as the memories: a house party smashed up by crashers, a dangerous excursion into Mexico, civil disobedience against the Draft Board. Milius and cinematographer Bruce Surtees capture these moments with real visual panache.

Milius sums up the film’s appeal on the DVD audio commentary: “Surfing is a sport you do alone. You judge yourself alone. The only competition you have is yourself. You don’t bring anything back. There are no trophies, no antlers. You ride the biggest wave and the wave just dissipates on the beach. And so, it is a thing that’s internal. But what is strange about surfing is that the thing you remember most are the relationships. So really, it is something that is best done alone, but it is also something that builds incredible camaraderie and friendship. It is a brotherhood.”

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I've read in that Miki Dora also was used as a stuntman, and he stole some boards during the behind the scenes. I just don't know whose character Dora did the stunts for.

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I just rewatched, it's clear in the end that is Peter Thoushnend playing Jack, Ian Cairns playing Leroy and Bill Hamilton playing Matt

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As noted, stand-ins used for the end scene.

But it was clearly the actors surfing in most of the earlier scenes. And I was impressed by their abilities.

(Just the way they could catch waves so easily, with a parallel paddle, was impressive to me.)

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