MovieChat Forums > One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975) Discussion > To those of you backing up Nurse Ratched...

To those of you backing up Nurse Ratched..

posted 10 years ago by DevelopmentHell92
24 replies | jump to latest

All I ask is why? "She was just doing her job", "she had to put up with childish belligerent patients", "McMurphy was the villain", etc. First off, she CHOSE to do this job and knew the requirements of the job, if it's too damn hard for her, she can just quit and find something else. She is nothing but a complete passive-aggressive borderline-sadistic bitch throughout the film. And who cares about McMurphy's aggressive history? He cared way more about the patients than she ever did. And he attacked her at the end out of respect for Billy; she caused him to commit suicide and acted like it was no big deal when she witnessed his dead body. If Billy were my friend, I would've strangled her too, are you kidding me?

[–] TVippy 10 years ago

" complete passive-aggressive borderline-sadistic bitch throughout the film"

O RLY? You can even give REAL examples of that? Oh, you can't.

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I own you.

[–] The_White_Hotel 10 years ago

Watch the first "group therapy" scene, in which McMurphy says and does nothing except observe. Watch how Ratched very deliberately asks certain questions of certain patients, and as everything escalates look at the shots that linger on Ratched's face as she does nothing to defuse the situation. Look at her placid expression as she surveys her kingdom.

And, more obviously, watch the vote as she changes the rules to include the chronics who can't possibly vote or even understand what is happening. Then watch as she declares the vote over when Mac gets the Chief to vote. I don't mean to break up the meeting here but she's something of a c\/nt, ain't she doc?

Reality is the new fiction they say, truth is truer these days, truth is man-made

[–] InherentlyYours 10 years ago

Mac should not be having orgies due to his self-entitlement and arrogance, and then wonder why the staff reacts negatively. A mental-hospital is not summer camp.

[–] chamohlamb 9 years ago

Ugh. Way to take the magic out of the film.

[–] I_Love_Hutch 8 years ago

Ugh. Way to take the magic out of the film.
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Exactly. Besides, if he didn't throw orgies, he wouldn't be much of a Mac.

I thought I was gonna die! - Roseanne Roseannadanna

[–] akenworthy87 8 years ago

Wouldn't really call having one woman distract the guard (who got thrown out before anything happened) and another having sex with a man-kid that really needed to get laid to get out from under the thumb of oppressive women (his mother and his mother's friend, Nurse Ratched) an 'orgy'.

[–] 8 years ago

[deleted]

[–] rascal67 8 years ago

Mac was a manipulator too; but Ratched's negativity was more to do with her own sense of entitlement and control over the men in her ward. She wasn't interested in them breaking free and having a sense of self-worth instilled in them. Perhaps she didn't know how, due to her own personal issues and even mental disorders—who is the real crazy here?—and she was unethical and cruel in the charade she played pitting her patients against each other and then sitting back and gloating at the chaos she had created. That is not duty of care. This b!tch had no soul.

Don't eat the whole ones! Those are for the guests. 🍪

[–] ida96 8 years ago

A mental hospital is supposedly there to help those in its care go back to their lives, if possible, and to shelter those who cannot live outside it. It is not supposed to administer electroshock therapy and brain surgery as punitive measures, or to make those in its care more docile, thereby making its job easier.

McMurphy is antisocial, a troublemaker who's spent time in prison, not educated or overly bright, but certainly not 'self entitled'. His 'arrogance' and swagger are simply the way he moves through the world and gets by. In some ways, he's likeable, charismatic and generous (or the other inmates wouldn't be drawn to him), and in other ways he's a loose cannon and a bit of a jerk.

[–] InherentlyYours 8 years ago

It is not supposed to administer electroshock therapy and brain surgery as punitive measures, or to make those in its care more docile, thereby making its job easier.

are you a doctor or nurse who has worked in one? If not, did you know that electroshock therapy and lobotomies were used as a last resort in that time era? The shock therapy was not to make the staff's job "easier", but to genuinely help the patient. It just was not to used properly in this hospital in this film.

A mental-hospital is also not some health-spa where they can all go back to their dysfunctional lives. Some are indefinitely debilitated due to schizophrenia, or will return to the hospital repeatedly.

Mac does not fit the typical patient because he's their being on the run, so he's left out of this equation. He's not mentally-ill.

Or are you another, another, another observer who runs their mouth mouth off about things they know nor of, or even cracked open a book to read about. And no, I don't' need to be polite about it.

[–] ida96 8 years ago

I see, so this is a scholarly thread, then?

[–] InherentlyYours 8 years ago

I see, so this is a scholarly thread, then?

Were you born in 1996? This is not a scholarly thread, it's a hooked-on-phonic-thread. Your blithe attitude towards the topic is why mental-illness is misunderstood. And far be it for people to self-educate; it's not exactly important to them.

[–] ida96 8 years ago

I guess it will surprise you to know that I was born in the 1950s, saw the film when it came out in the 70s, have seen the play, and read the book (oh, so long ago). Not sure why you're adopting this lecturing tone.

[–] InherentlyYours 8 years ago

I am "adopting" this lecturing tone due to what you wrote. Ok, you are middle-aged (that's great) but I asked if you ever worked in such a hospital in any capacity. Shall I tell you what you'll find there? (to keep them "docile")

[–] rascal67 8 years ago

IY, I don't read anything in ida96's post that was suggesting an argumentative, dissonant or smarty pants tone. They appear to have made honest and quite frankly on the mark brief insights about mental hospitals and how some aspects of the treatments can be abused. That is what happened in this film. You have mentioned about debilitated schizophrenics who won't cope, those would be the ones alluded to in the post about being sheltered. Everything he said about Mac was correct.

Don't eat the whole ones! Those are for the guests. 🍪

[–] I_Love_Hutch 8 years ago

O RLY? You can even give REAL examples of that? Oh, you can't.
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The whole movie is an example. Duh.

I thought I was gonna die! - Roseanne Roseannadanna

[–] mark-j-cassidy 10 years ago

I just don't see it as black and white as her being the villain, Mac being the hero etc etc. In the book she's definitely described as being a completely domineering, thoughtless bully... but the movie makes her slightly more sympathetic. For example, I think it's made clear that she genuinely wants to help and believes that she is helping her patients -- even Mac. She doesn't go about things the right way and is shown to be particularly antagonistic toward Billy who's Mother she's a friend of, but I don't think her intentions are necessarily bad. Now, towards the end it becomes a power struggle of sorts between her and Mac and she reacts appallingly after catching Billy with Candy, pretty much directly leading to his suicide., but by that stage Mac had all but tipped her to breaking point, and vice versa obviously. She's depicted as being a stubborn, cold, and ultimately cruel woman yes, but we're not talking about the Devil incarnate here.

"I love a coward!"

[–] The_White_Hotel 10 years ago

She's definitely the antagonist. I'm not saying that she's an out and out monster but the fact that it is more subtle than that is more fightening. Ultimately it is her calmness, her placid surface, her monotone voice (like Hal in 2001) that masks her lack of humanity. If she was a ranting, moustache twirling villian or a deranged psychopath a la Annie Wilkes the film would lose much of its power. But the fact that it's difficult to put your finger on it, that she almost seems reasonable, that maybe the problem is in fact with you, that makes her more effective.

Reality is the new fiction they say, truth is truer these days, truth is man-made

[–] forrykook 10 years ago

Absolutely spot on stupid_flanders.
I might just add that this movie is much more complex and beyond the view of having an obvious villain and a hero. In a way, (and completely different genre) it's a bit like Hard Candy. As the movie progresses you sway back and forth not knowing who the villain or the hero is.

[–] ida96 8 years ago

Hard Candy -- isn't that movie the balls? I was blown away, gripped, horrified, and rather glad I'd seen it despite its terrible darkness.

[–] jjk488-1 9 years ago

You know, the Nazi's sympathizers always defended them by saying they were "just doing their jobs."

Just because someone was "just doing their job" doesn't mean you aren't siding with evil.

[–] evanwilkinsonis 9 years ago

Well tbh there was probably a lot of nazis who were "just doing their job" in the same way as anyone fighting for the ally nations. Nazi Soldiers, I'm sure we're no worse people than any other soldiers. They were just forced to fight for the bad side.

[–] cheedo 9 years ago

She a jerk BUT not evil... up till she deliberately hurt Billy by threatening to tell her mother on him which led to him killing himself. Other than that she was almost mild to her book counterpart, who before the book even starts is already lobotomizing patients she's had enough of. But otherwise you have to admit Mac was deliberately causing trouble even if she was a cow. Not defending her, but as others have said, it's not supposed to be a black and white story. Ratched was technically right sometimes and Mac was wrong sometimes (like sneaking in hookers, making a racist joke to Chief, and having sex with a 15 year old girl- you think he's a saint?).

Is he gonna borrow a cup o' sugar from Satan?

[–] akenworthy87 8 years ago

15's not far off the legal age of most countries, or even most states of america.
And women are (physically) mature at that age, he could well have been telling the truth that she came on to him and he thought she was a couple of years older.