But why really did he


kill him?


Spoilers!Spoilers!Spoilers!Spoilers!Spoilers!Spoilers!Spoilers!

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Because Marlowe had been used and betrayed by someone he considered a friend.

Also, because Altman liked the shocking climax that the screenwriter had added to the story and decided to keep it in.

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>>> Because Marlowe had been used and betrayed by someone he considered a friend

This is actually the only post in the thread that attempts to answer my original question and I don't think it satisfactorily answers the question.


It should be against the law to use "LOL" unless you really did LOL!

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Having just watched the film again, it now strikes me that the answer is amazingly simple: his friend left him to the mob who damn nearly mutilated and/or killed him.

Yet another thread hijacked by a bunch of pseudo-intellectuals who mentally masturbate at length but are woefully inadequate to answer a simple question which turns out to have a simple answer. I'm beginning to really detest imdb forums.


It should be against the law to use "LOL" unless you really did LOL!

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Yup, it's not complicated. Marlowe has been put through the ringer and lied to by someone who he thought was a friend. He acted a little rashly, but given what he's been put through it's not at all irrational.

He also knows how corrupt the authorities are. If he just tried to bring Lennox in who knows what would've happened.

Lennox completely used him, killed his wife and caused tons of grief for lots of people. Complete piece of crap as a person, and in film noir justice is meted out with a gun.

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Because nothing says goodbye like a bullet...

It always irked me that the dame got off scot free though. She was just as manipulative and ruthless as her lover. And I blame her for Sterling Hayden's suicide - now that's unforgivable!

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Well, in a way, she didn't get totally away with it. You could argue that she manipulated her husband into killing himself but she also thought she'd be living out her days with her lover in a tropical paradise...the look on her face as she drives by Marlowe says that she's lost at least the lover and she'll also know that Marlowe "knows" what really happened.

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Ye-eeees... ah well, I'm not bloodthirsty or anything, but since I believe she's a coldhearted b* I'm sure she'll get over it all too soon and find another lover with whom to share the tropical paradise. I doubt that guilt, shame, or Marlowe's contempt are likely to weigh on her conscience much.
A typical flaw of Chandler's stories though. And it would have been really disturbing to watch Marlowe mete out the same kind of punishment to her - i.e., a bullet. He could never do it. (Good thing.)

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"A typical flaw of Chandler´s stories though".

What is? Going easy on female characters? In a sense, that might be somewhat true, but for starters, Eileen Wade´s destiny in film is significantly altered - in the book, she does not get away with it, even though the gentlemanly Marlowe does not turn her over to the police right away, instead giving her a day to contemplate an alternative "way out". Also, in The Big Sleep, he helps the mentally challenged/ill murderess to escape criminal justice on the condition she´ll receive treatment in a psychiatric facility; however, that´s not so much due to any particular sympathy for her, but rather out of consideration for her old, sick father. Also, Farewell, My Lovely, The High Window, Lady In The Lake and The Little Sister all feature female murderesses, all of whom - with the exception of the woman in The High Window - ultimately get what´s coming to them, one way or the other (in fact, Chandler has been accused of misogyny as indeed every one of his novels features some sort of a sociopathic female killer - at least the first 6 do, can´t remember Playback, by far his weakest outing that was finished by another writer after Chandler´s death).



"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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Thank you, franzkabuki for calling me out on this. On reading your comment, I realized immediately that you were quite correct as far as the facts go, which didn't seem to tally with the impression I had apparently taken away from the novels. Startling, that!

NB I know you won't need the following summary, but I wanted to get it clear for myself. Apologies for an (unnecessarily) lengthy post! I must confess I read Chandler for his prose, but am often bewildered and afterwards rather hazy on plot details, even significant ones...


spoilers for people who haven't read the books
I agree with you that he didn't expose Carmen Sternwood in The Big Sleep as a killer for the sake of her dying father. (She also was either genuinely soft in the head or possibly a drug addict.)

It's interesting that the ending of The Long Goodbye was indeed changed for the movie* - in fact, it plays out exactly the other way. In the novel Eileen Wade ends up dead, while Marlowe more or less just tells Terry Lennox their friendship is over:"I won't say goodbye. I said it to you when it meant something." Then Terry leaves.
Before, Marlowe has caught Eileen in a lie which confirms his suspicion that she killed Terry's wife and her own husband. But he refuses to inform the police, claiming there's no evidence to convict her. I suppose he knows she will think she hasn't got a way out though, and is fully aware that she will kill herself. She does, conveniently leaving a confession Marlowe makes public. His motivation is to restore Roger Wade's reputation.

Farewell, My Lovely has a similar ending inasmuch as Velma/Mrs. Grayle, after shooting Moose Malloy and failing to finish off Marlowe with the emptied gun, makes her getaway unhindered by him. When she's found three months later, she also ends her own life. In this case, it's unclear how Marlowe was able to predict this outcome. Or if he could actually be bothered one way or the other.

I believe what is commonly understood about Marlowe's character is that he has his own ideas of justice and how it is best served. Eileen and Velma certainly don't live to reap the benefits of their crimes. But after he has found them out, Marlowe takes a step back. They "get what's coming to them", but not at his hands.

This is even more pronounced in The Little Sister. In this story, at the end Marlowe identifies Dolores Gonzales as the murderess. He realizes that exposing her would mean destroying Mavis Weld's career. But he doesn't make it his business to prevent the murder of Dolores, which he 'knew' would likely take place.

Maybe he just doesn't want to get his hands dirty... In any case, in The Lady in the Lake, too, the murderess Mildred Havilland aka Muriel Chess is in turn killed by her ex, so everything's wrapped up quite nicely. (It should be noted that said ex, Degarmo, gets away, also with no interference by Marlowe, only to end up dead in an accident shortly after.)

Add Mrs Murdock and the set of ruthless females is complete, with five of them dead. I assume Marlowe would deem their sorry endings well deserved. Obviously I had the feeling that his passive role in helping them on their way to hell wasn't entirely satisfactorily. I now realize that, on reflection, that it's simply fitting his character.

Also well deserved seems to me Chandler's reputation for misogyny. His portrayal of the aforementioned ladies (and a few others, especially sisters) as pretty loathsome creatures might well have influenced my view that they weren't punished enough!




*By the way, which ending do you prefer?
After what I've written here, it seems to me the end of the movie is not at all in keeping with Chandler's Marlowe...

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Actually, I also only recognized this pattern regarding Chandler´s up-to-no-good female characters when I was composing the previous post above, as following the plot indeed tends to be of secondary importance when reading his stuff (and, of course, these plots are usually so convoluted that in a sense, this near-impenetrable web is like an end unto itself, reflecting the world of moral confusion or ambivalence and the covert ways in which the world works/is run and power exerted). So now we´re enlightened in these regards. Strange how I´ve read these novels several times over the years and still unable to recall certain important parts of the story; it´s always the other stuff that stays with me. Atmosphere, tone, some trivial - from the vantage point of the plot - passages or situations. Like the prison sequence in The Long Goodbye, for instance. Or Gimlet in a downtown bar around a sunny noontime.

As for the concrete cases... it does indeed seem to be "Marlowe´s way" to not get directly involved when comes to punishment, to mete out justice himself. Regarding Lady In The Lake, it must be noted, however, that it wasn´t his business to stop Degarmo in the first place as there, in the cabin by the lake, was also present a police chief who had juristiction over that area. Plus it´s easy to see Degarmo wasn´t going far either way.

And these female characters... he finally creates a truly strong, sympathetic and intelligent one in TLG, of course, in Linda Loring (one could probably argue that Chandler was getting old and soft... of course, TLG was written around the time when his wife was dying). As for which ending I prefer... I think both are good fits in their respective context. The book´s ending is far more poetic though (I think I read somewhere that Chandler had been desperately searching for this perfect ending for a long time & tried out several other ways, and these earlier "alternatives" had been preserved and printed there... wherever it was I read that article), but on the other hand, there´s a cool sense of relief and finality to the films end as Marlowe disappears down the road, back to his proper time period, one assumes, and the 1940´s music starts to blare - just as it did in the beginning of the film, before he woke up. Whether or not his final act in the 70´s had been an appropriate one for his character, has been debated long and hard, of course, and it´s also controversial that he lets Eileen go scot free. However, I´ll still go with this quote by Slant Magazine´s Eric Henderson (which I´ve already flaunted on this board before, but hey...): "For all the film´s revisionism, one tenet of the film noir genre remains a holdover, existing in Altman´s film without revision or irony. For a man to betrayed by another man, when the two held a previously honorable agreement, is a moral crime, punishable by death. However, when a man is betrayed by a woman, it´s so taken for granted and upsets his world view so little, that it´s hardly worth a whisteling tune on the harmonica".

The Long Goodbye remains both my favourite Chandler novel as well as my favourite Marlowe movie, btw.




"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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The Gimlets, yes, truly memorable. (CC and ginger, not quite the same thing...)

You're also right about the ending of The Lady in the Lake, of course.

I have to disagree though about Linda Loring. She is one of the rich, spoiled, dazzling beauties Marlowe so frequently encounters, with plenty of poise, capable of charm and her wits about her - and without them Chandler's novels wouldn't have that certain glamour. But when it comes to their tête-à-tête at Marlowe's apartment at the end of TLG, I find it impossible to like her at all. Her attempts at teasing and 'playing games' lack sophistication, but that doesn't mean she appears more natural. On the contrary. Her pretense at 'falling in love' with Marlowe is very transparently just another pose, and the worst are her tearful moments. Then she behaves just like an over-tired child. It's all very tiresome. I hope at least the sex was good... Marlowe isn't fooled by her, but she does appear to have that hard-to-define 'certain something' he had a soft spot for.
A likeable female character is Anne Riordan in Farewell... Marlowe says about her:"You could get to like that face a lot. Glamoured up blondes were a dime a dozen, but that was a face that would wear." But also:"'There's a nice little girl,' I told myself out loud, in the car, 'for a guy that's interested in a nice little girl.' Nobody said anything. 'But I'm not,' I said. Nobody said anything to that either." [He's of course alone in the car.]

I don't think I need to elaborate... As for Chandler getting 'soft', I think he always was. Marlowe was a romantic character underneath the cynical veneer all along. "Down these mean streets", etc. - "a hero [...] a man of honour."

The quote about Altman's TLG is perfect, well worth repeating. Terry Lennox' betrayal of Marlowe's friendship is at the core of the story. It's interesting that the film doesn't dwell on that friendship as the novel does, where Marlowe also tells us quite a lot about Terry. The final scene in the book is, as you said, more poetic. It implies that Marlowe doesn't hold Terry to the same code of honour because he has realized that Terry is so damaged - "I'm not judging you. [...] You're long gone." It's almost as if he pities him. Therefore there's no further punishment necessary, because honour doesn't apply to the empty shell of a man.

It does in the film. Stripped of his backstory, Terry doesn't appear as weak, but as coldly calculating. (He also did kill his wife, or am I confused again?) And Marlowe, whose attitude to most of the follies of his surroundings is summed up in his catchphrase, "It's ok with me", makes it unmistakably clear that there are some things that aren't. Yes, he's an anachronism...

Without going much further into debating this... The endings do fit their different contexts. More than that, I see the end of the film as paying homage to the original character. In the world of Chandler's novels it was a matter of honour not to stoop to committing murder. In the world of Altman's film, paradoxically, killing Terry Lennox drives home the point that Honour (as in, honouring friendship) still matters - at least it should. Or, as I'd rather put it: Marlowe, presented as a remnant of the past, is a reminder that what makes a man is his personal integrity.

It is impressive that this adaptation by its alterations actually succeeded in enhancing the original's 'message' in this regard.

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