Has anybody else read the book that this movie is based on? There is a whole series of books about Dortmunder. I've read "The Hot Rock", "Bank Shot", "Jimmy the Kid," and I have just started "Nobody's Perfect." I highly recommend them. I started reading them after I watched "What's the Worst that could happen," which is also based on a Dortmunder book.
The Art of Flying: Throw Yourself at the Ground and Miss
[deleted]
Finished Nobody's Perfect, started "Why Me?" which was also turned into a movie.
The Art of Flying: Throw Yourself at the Ground and Miss
I read 'Bank Shot' years after seeing 'The Hot Rock'. I loved the book 'Bank Shot'! I missed the flick 'Bank Shot' when it was in the theaters. So when it showed on TV, I cried; I wept! I almost became a catatonic from disappointment! It's like Paul Newman sings in 'Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid' and again in 'Sometimes a Great Notion': 'Never hit your mother inthe head with a shovel, it may leave a bad impression on her mind.' But, be still my heart, Joanna Cassidy's beauty and laugh is not enough get me to see that one all the way thru. Dortmunder *lisping* is like scratching a chalkboard.
But, Check out some old December(?) Playboy's there are short stories of Dortmunder's mis adventures with and without Kelp. He's always a step away from an ulcer and prison! They're a gassss!
I wonder if Hollywood went the other way and 'Bank Shot' was adapted by Walter Hill, and directed by the Master Mr. Sam Peckinpah, himself keeping Cassidy for sex appeal!
Silly Whyteboye
"Accept No Substitute!"
All those short stories from Playboy and other publications have recently been collected into a novel called Thieves Dozen, which you can find at just about any bookstore now.
share.....but for some reason, "Bank Shot" and several of the other Dortmunder series novels are still very difficult to find. I could only find used versions on Amazon.com. "Bank Shot" is out of print which is a TRAVESTY and a REAL CRIME since it is almost as funny as "The Hot Rock". I purchase and cherish every copy I find of a Dortmunder novel....
shareI could NOT agree more. See the post by thehotrock-1.
Also...making Dortmunder a black man was not how Donald E. Westlake the character to go either. Though funny, it was not the inherent hang dogged hapless character we have come to know and love and feel for.
Enjoy the Series of books. There are a dozen in all, the last one being, "Road to Ruin", where our gang poses as 'the help' in order to swindle a rich guy out of his classic car collection and whatever goodies they can get! Ha!
Dear AlohaJoeCool,
I read your post about "The Hot Rock", my favorite movie of all time ever since I was 11 years old when I first saw it. (I just dated myself).
I must say, I envy you in that you get to read ALL the Dortmunder Series novels for the first time. I first got into them a few years after I saw the film, when I discovered there WAS a book that the film was based on. That was 1975 or so. I checked the book out of my High School library repeatedly and typed up the whole thing because I could not find the book ANYwhere! Yes...I was desperate and on a mission. I didn't revisit Westlake until college in '79 when I made the wonderful discovery of "Bank Shot", "Jimmy the Kid", and "Nobody's Perfect", and the rest is history. I continued to wait every 3 or so years for each Dortmunder book to come out. I am totally in love with Dortmunder and Kelp. Each page is like candy.
You will enjoy ALL of them but the first two are the best. The latest one, "Raod to Ruin" had a few good chuckles in it that made me laugh out loud. Every Westlake/Dortmunder novel does that for me.
One word of warning however,....the books don't always translate to movies well. They have Stephen King's Disease. "The Hot Rock" is the BEST of the BEST. "Bank Shot" is an awful movie adaption but the inherent story is still hilarious. "What's the Worst That Can Happen" is a decent little flick. "Why Me" is a travesty as far as a film goes.
I'm still waiting for them to make a film of "Dancing Aztecs", which is on the vein of, "It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World". It's Not a Dortmunder Series novel but Very funny just the same.
Also----If you like Hardcore Crime, check out Westlake's Psuedonymns and his Parker Series novels. Like "Payback", the film. Westlake has also written and been nominated for an Oscar for his Screenplay to "The Grifters", from Thompson's novel. It's a GREAT movie too w/ John Cusak, Angelica Houston, and Annette Bening. Westlake is not a fan of Stephen King, but Stephen King has made several references to Westlake and his writing persona's in his novels and films. In "The Dark Half", Stephen King named his protaganist after a Westlake character.
When I asked Donald E. Westlake where he got the name for Dortmunder, he told me the German beer. There is a cute little anectdote about Westlake devising the character and the first three capers in "The Hot Rock", and then placing the manuscript aside because he just didn't know how to end it. Years later, he ran into it again in the closet and finished it. To think of how close we came to NEVER meeting Dortmunder. And Westy, as I am fond of calling him, practically INVENTED the new genre of Comedy/Crime/Caper. As you can tell, I am his biggest fan. NOT to be confused with the Kathy Bates character in MISERY.
One more interesting note, though I could go on for days about him....years ago after a Westlake film was made into yet another disappointing film, they film company tried to SUE Westlake for the names of Dortmunder and Kelp, if you can believe it, trying to maintain that they were a property of theirs now. Westlake, the never say die, hysterical, good natured fellow that he is, came out with a short story that he SWORE up and down had nothing to do with the characters named in the lawsuit. It was about two bungling crooks who were pals and did work together. The stoic quiet put upon one was named Rumsy and the chipper sidekick was named Algea. hahahahahhahahaha! That's Westy!!!
Right now I'm reading What's the Worst That Could Happen? and I'm, of course, loving it. For some reason I keep seeing Robert Redford as Max Fairbanks. And I keep picturing Dortmunder as a mix between Robert Redford and Christopher Lambert. By the way, I kinda liked the movie, Why Me?. It was closer to the book than some movies I've seen.
Deliverance- A Buttload of Fun!
You are so lucky to be reading ALL the Dortmunder Series novels for the first time. There are a dozen in all. "The Hot Rock" and "Bank Shot" are bar none the best books in the series.
The Hot Rock is 'Perfection in Print' and thankfully still In print. The one that started it all Once you are introduced to Dortmunder and Kelp, you never forget them. You're hooked. The only one in the Series where the film actually lived up to the book.
"Bank Shot" is an awsomely funny read, but fails miserably in the film translation department. Westlakes novels have some sort of Stephen King's disease when they try to translate them into the big screen. With a very few exceptions. "Bank Shot" is a gem. Why rob a bank when you can rob 'the' bank?! And the fun ensues as we return to Dortmunder's world and the gang's follies. The ending will have you laughing so hard, you'll cough up a lung.
Next in succession of order of publishing comes "Jimmy the Kid". This movie sucked out loud. It's about the gang heisting a kid and blackmailing a rich guy for the kid. But the kid is a 12 year old genious and it doesn't take a member of Mensa to figure out the outcome. However, whatever genious decided to cast Gary Coleman as the kid should be shot!
The 4th in the series is "Nobody's Perfect". This is a riot and brings back all of the characters from the first 3 novels whom you have met thus far into a lively fun romp. It delivers. Like fine aged wine, it's a fitting culmination. This is like the perfect recipe for chocolate cake.
The 5th is "WHY ME" which was also made into a film. It was mediocre but the book is funny. Our favorite hapless hanged dog recidivist strikes again.
The 6th is "Good Behavior". Rescue us from Laughter when Dortmunder's gang gets involved with Nuns. It's a riot! It is a good book but could never be a film.
The 7th is "Drowned Hopes". This one has film potential but it should really remain in theatre of the mind. It's fun and harrowing and hilarious all at once. 8th is "Don't Ask". The gang tried so steal a bone . Two countries. One bone. You do the math. T
he 9th book, "What's the Worst That Can Happen" is quite a good film. The moral to this story is....NEVER CROSS DORTMUNDER. There is a little bit of Parker in him. Parker is Westalke's HARD core crime character. This film is second best next to "The Hot Rock" in the series. But then, what movie isn't?!?!? "The Hot Rock" is the King of Comedy Capers.
The 10th book, "Bad News" is about Indians and Casinos and it's a sure bet that it will keep you guessing and giggling.
And lastly, the latest book, "Road to Ruin". The gang poses as servants in order to steal a rich guys cars and crud. Very funny and it made me laugh out loud more than a couple of times. All twelve books are GEMS and like CANDY ON CHRISTMAS MORNING.
And for extra fun reading, there is a compilation of short stories involving our hapless hero Dortmunder in "Thieves Dozen". It's wonderful. In fact, one of the stories has Westlake explaining how some movie studio tried to steal his characters of Dortmunder and Kelp by sueing him. When this happened, Westlake did not bat an eye. He simply wrote a story that has NOTHING to do with Dortmunder and Kelp. It's about these two habitual criminals on the make who work together but don't always succeed. Their names are Rumsy and Algea. Donald E. Westlake is a comic Genious...
Enjoy All of them. I did again and again and again...
Well, I've read all of them except for Bad News, Road to Ruin, and Thieves Dozen. And I'm in the middle of What's the Worst That Could Happen? I haven't seen Bank Shot or Jimmy the Kid. I've seen What's the Worst That Could Happen?, but it's been awhile and I can't remember much about it. I remember the Hot Rock and Why Me? and I prefer Why Me? over the Hot Rock. Mainly because the Hot Rock didn't have the train scene.
Deliverance- A Buttload of Fun!
I discovered the Dortmunder books with "The Hot Rock" and "Bank Shot" in my hometown library when I was in junior high. I've read most of the others, as well as some non-Dortmunder Westlake books.
I tend to picture actors in character as I read books. Even before seeing "The Hot Rock" movie, I always pictured George Seagal as Kelp. For Dortmunder, I thought of Judd Hirsch (who later was Alex on "Taxi"); he would be perfect -- well, 30 years ago anyway.
Whenever I read the books I too picture George Segal as Kelp, but for my money Walter Matthau is Dortmunder, he could ace the sad-sack that is Dortmunder and he could play smart criminals like in "Charley Varrick," I would have loved to watch him in "Bank Shot" or "The Hot Rock" back in the 70's. Though maybe Elliott Gould could have pulled it off too.
I read "Bank Shot" then "Why Me?" then "Thieves Dozen" and an I'm the middle of "Drowned Hopes," which so far would make a good movie, but I suspect they would all make great movies in the hands of good filmakers. "Dancing Aztecs" is Westlake's masterpiece, I'd really like to watch the French film based on it. I heard that Milos Foreman who directed "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" is directing a movie version of "Bad News" and he wants Russell Crowe for Dortmunder, of course that was a while ago.
Also I love "Hot Stuff" the movie with Dom DeLuise and Jerry Reed from a Westlake script, great funny movie often thought of as little more than a Burt Reynolds movie with Burt Reynolds, but its a real entertaining movie.
I've always pictured the late Jerry Orbach as Dortmunder; nowadays I think Bill Murray would be good. See if you find a copy of Good Behavior (the book; there's no movie) - Dortmunder & the gang get involved with a bunch of nuns who have taken a vow of silence.
shareI think Nathan Fillion of Firefly should play Dortmunder.
Deliverance- A Buttload of Fun!
Don't you love the casino heist in the book? I honestly think the movie could have been much better, but Ocean's 11 came out around that time and that had to change the ending b/c who cwould go see 2 "rob a Vegas Casino" caper films in one year?
Come to the think of it, tho, Soderbergh could do a rockin' job with a dortmunder story.
I've read all of the Dortmunder books, I think, and have just recently started chasing down the movies. "Hot Rock" is good, but I think my fave movie so far is "Why Me?" - it has a loopy, quirky humor that is very faithful to the books.
shareI love Donald Westlake. Keep in mind that he is also "Richard Stark," the author of the Parker novels, several of which were also made into movies (Point Blank, with Lee Marvin, and Payback, with Mel Gibson). His Dortmunder series is a lot of fun. I really liked Bank Shot and Good Behavior. Right now I'm reading Drowned Hopes, which so far is one of the best Dortmunder novels I've read.
Westlake is incredibly prolific. Beside writing something like 70 novels he's also responsible for the screeplays for The Grifters and The Stepfather, both of which I thought were great. His Dortmunder novels are pretty lighthearted, but I think he's best when he's completely merciless and cynical, like his novel The Ax, which I highly recommend.
I've read them all except for the latest one, "Watch Your Back!" I can't get enough of them. I love all the short stories in Thieves Dozen. Especially the one where Dortmunder breaks into the bank and becomes a hostage. I would love to make movies out of these books. Faithful adaptations. And they would have to be named Dortmunder and Kelp. I hate it when movies change the names.
Deliverance- A Buttload of Fun!
visit your local library. It's amazing.
Signed,
Donald Westlake
I've just finished reading Drowned Hopes and it's been a while since I've laughed so much over a book. I found it in our extensive book collection, my husband bought it when the local library sold off some of their books a while ago.
I had no idea there were so many titles in the series, I'll have to check out some of the second hand bookstores and the library. Living in Denmark, it's more likely that I'll find them translated into Danish, but I must say that the Danish version of Drowned Hopes was VERY well done.
I'll try and catch The Hot Rock on film but will probably give the others a wide berth. I hate having movies detroy a good book. And with different actors playing the parts from one film to the next - that makes it even worse.
Not having seen The Hot Rock, I'd say Redford is too good looking for Dortmunder, who I picture to be somewhat nondescript in his appearance. But George Seagal as Andy, well that's spot on.
Does Dortmunder ever pull it off and hit the jackpot? I'll just have to read on, I guess he must be one of the most hard-working criminals in literature.