MovieChat Forums > The Godfather (1972) Discussion > Why Michael failed the Corleone empire.

Why Michael failed the Corleone empire.

posted 8 years ago by Mr_Recchia
32 replies | jump to latest

In the opening of the Godfather Vito scolds Buonasera for equating justice with revenge, and thinking like a Sicilian after living in America and reaping its benefits. In this way he gives insight as to why he managed the empire, and why Michael failed. Even though Vito isnt a homegrown American and his son is, Vito knew the customs. He grew the empire as a Sicilian at its offset when he thought talked and breathed like a Sicilian, but managed it as the strong and silent respectable type when he got older.

Michael started off Steve Rogers, your all American boy who fights for apple pie, before he left for Italy. But a year was enough for him to assimilate ever so slightly. He now knows Italian, demands an arranged marriage old school Sicilian style, and vowed vengeance on all who opposed him. Things the old Captain America-Corleone would never do.

To quote Archie Bunker, there's only two things on a Sicilian's mind, spaghetti and REVENGE! Michael was not the strong silent type. He was vindictive and emotional, and obssesed with revenge. He was showing power but not strength. That's why his empire failed. The Italian mafia got away with this for so long because Italy as a country had a legal system that was both corrupt an diluted. The Italian-American mafia are under stricter conditions. You canèt possibly get away with what he did here. He only managed to beat the five families because his quick attack was so unheard of that no one could unbound, no one could get away with it. And Michael ended up paying for it anyways when the feds caught on. What is this ItalyÉ Michael so desperately wanted his family to behave as a real Sicilian one, to justify his thirst for crushing all those who appose him in any way. He forgot that his father raised him as an American with an Italian soul, and not the other way around. Michael is denying how much hes lost his way, when he opted to super-Americanize the opening party in Part 2 in contrast to the wedding of the first, what with no Italian musician in sight, but it was fleeting.

What does an Italian say when he moves to Canada? I use to live in a boot.

[–] Pinkdaisy678 8 years ago

Or we can say he succeeded in that he lived and kept it going beyond the years Sonny or Fredo could have accomplished. Remember the times were changing. The family was getting weaker until he took them all out and regained power.

[–] Noir-It-All 8 years ago

Then, the RICO law was passed.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

I disagree. Vito was just as emotional and vindictive as Michael, but what makes both of them different from others is they were patient, they hid their true nature and intentions, and they were long-term planners. Both Vito and Michael hatched up that revenge plan against the Tattaglias and the Barzinis, they had to wait because Vito had to keep his owrd and they needed the surprise attack. Revenge is a dish best served cold afterall.

Michael already knew Sicilian before leaving for Sicily, he was simply rusty at it. You could see that during the meeting with Sollozzo, he understood the Turk, he simply couldn't express himself in the language.

If Michael failed, it was as a father, a son, and as a brother. He failed his personal family but not the larger Corleone Family. Because by the time Andy Garcia took over, the Corleone were even more powerful than any of the old-mustache Petes could've dreamed of.

[–] TexasJack (12516) 7 years ago

Vito had a warmth that Michael never did. His friendship inspired a brand of loyalty that Michael could only approximate.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Hmm...food for thought Tex...
I prefer Michael...always did though Don Vito was a big baller...
I respected Michael's 'kill everybody at the same time' approach...
I feel he was more bloodthirsty than his pop...hes a better 'war Don' imo

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

I think Vito had a warmth because the terrible events that happened to him (murder of his Father and his Mother shot in front of him), happened at such a young age, and it gave him a little time to get adapted to his situation.
Michael however was at that critical stage of life where he's essentially a grown up and looking forwards to the rest of his life, forming a family, having a career. His new young wife is killed in an explosion meant for him and his older Brother's death changes his course of life forever.

His brother is then responsible for an attack that almost killed his wife and children.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Nice post...all true
Michael came home a WWII hero...he probably should have avoided his crazy family and just bought a little house on Long Island with his girl...
Then he did that shooting...ran off to the bucolic Italian countryside...fell in love with sweet Appolonia...fate sealed:(

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Think he did his best to avoid his crazy family then he sees the newspaper article about his Father being Gunned Down.

His humanity and warmth then kicks in and he wants to protect his Father and stick around, likely because he knew Sonny was such a hot head and would make things a lot worse before they got better.

For instance, had Michael not had to flee, he might have been a good barrier between Carlo and Sonny and prevented a course of events that led to his brothers massacre.

The shooting was obviously essential. Pacino acted that scene perfectly. When he's in the bathroom you can tell he knows he's now "one of the family".

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Incredible movie...pure brilliance
Wonderful scenes you mention...
You know your stuff
Much respect:)

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Couldn't agree more about the movie being a work of pure brilliance.

The Godfather trilogy is my Star Wars. I love all three films. Although the first is my favourite.

Read the books, played the games. The Godfather universe is vast and I can't get enough of it. I could discuss it for days without getting board.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Did you feel that the original novel ended a bit abruptly..?
I liked it quite a lot but felt shortchanged...i honestly compare this novel to Benchley's Jaws...rare case of the movie being much better imo

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Definitely agree. Shortchanged is a great way of putting it. I don't know how else to describe it to be honest.

Don't know if you've seen Francis Ford Coppola's views on the novel?

He says he thought it was a bit of a "pot boiler" when he first read it. He has massive respect for Mario Puzo obviously but says the part about Lucy Mancini's personal parts, and how Sonny way the only man who could satisfy her, seemed disconnected from the rest of the story.

Would have to agree with him. There's a fair bit of the book devoted to it as I recall.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Hells bells i totally forgot the 'Personal parts' portion of the book lol!!!
Yeah...that was so stupid and out of place...just weird!!
If you recall in the movie Sonnys mistress does that 'size' thing with her hands in front of the other girls during the wedding...funny stuff

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Lol, yeah I think I glossed over most of the talk about a Doctor helping her out, can't remember his name but I think he ended up marrying Lucy Mancini. Also was connected to Michael when they were in Nevada I think.

It was so needless. They could have spent more time detailing so many other interesting parts of the world.

The size thing was great until she turns round and realises Sonny's disappeared and seems to know who he's disappeared with lol.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

That Sonny!
He was always ready to go...until he crossed that causeway:(

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Carlo was scum.

Was it a mistake on Don Vito's part to not give Carlo more responsibility earlier on?

Maybe could've avoided so much bloodshed. Was usually very shrewd about these types of things.

[–] ShogunofYonkers (78545) 7 years ago

Ive always been confused as to why that creep was allowed into 'the family' to begin with...seems like a violent and domineering big brother like Sonny would have punched out or at least scared the hell out of any guy that went near Connie...

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Shown at the end of Godfather II that Sonny introduced Carlo to Connie.

Seemed as if everything went a bit sour at a point. Remember the dinner scene Sonny tells Carlo "never tell my sister to shut up", mama says not to interfere. Suppose they allowed Connie to learn from her mistakes.

[–] TexasJack (12516) 7 years ago

I think the mistake was allowing Carlo to marry his daughter in the first place. He obviously knew Carlo was a weak reed.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

In the book, the Don disliked Carlo and didn't want him for a son in law however, Connie was rather spoiled and the Don could not say no to her when she insisted on Carlo. This also explains his seemingly cold brush off of Connie's suffering under Carlo's hands, she chose him and as a husband and wife, the Don could no longer interfere.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

QUOTE:
---------------
"The Godfather trilogy is my Star Wars. I love all three films. Although the first is my favourite."
---------------

^^^I've never heard that analogy before but I guess it's an apt analogy for me too. I like Star Wars well enough but nowhere near TGF Trilogy. And I too like the 3rd film as well despite its flaws.

Do you enjoy TGF books not by Puzo?

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

I love The Godfather books. Looking through my collection, was surprised to see I have all of them. Thought there were more TBH, lol.

The Godfather, The Godfather Returns, The Godfather's Revenge, The Family Corleone (most recently read).

Also loved The Sicilian but that's not really about the Corleone family.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

How would you rate these books from 1-10?

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Would rate them all 10 since I'm a fan of everything Gdofather lol.

But seriously, I'd give The Godfather 10/10 because it's the one I've read over and over again.

The Family Corleone I read a while ago but it was the most recent I've read. I'd give an 8/10, because I liked the fact it went back in time and showed more of Vitos earlier exploits, although there was a lot more Luca Brasi than I was expecting.

I really enjoyed returns as I recall, I'd give it an 8/10.

Sicilian was my favourite apart from the original, 9/10.

Godfathers Revenge, I can't really remember a lot of it but have it in my cupboard.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

Thanks for the ratings! It gives me an idea on what to expect from the succeeding books! :)

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

QUOTE:
-------------------
"I think Vito had a warmth because the terrible events that happened to him (murder of his Father and his Mother shot in front of him), happened at such a young age, and it gave him a little time to get adapted to his situation.
Michael however was at that critical stage of life where he's essentially a grown up and looking forwards to the rest of his life, forming a family, having a career. His new young wife is killed in an explosion meant for him and his older Brother's death changes his course of life forever.

His brother is then responsible for an attack that almost killed his wife and children."
------------------

^^^I really love your explanation for the differences between Vito and Michael Damien. I like it enough to believe in it!

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Thanks Vicky, I also loved your explanation as to why Don Vito would let Carlo treat his only daughter the way he did. It never really occurred to me, "you've made your own bed, now you have to sleep in it". You explain it better than I ever could.

I honestly felt a little sorry for Michael. It's very easy to feel like an outsider in a large family where there are a lot of bigger personalities.

Vito had it tough as well though, having to leave his home at such a young age because of such horrible events. However he was taken in by a warm, caring family in his consiglieri Genco Abandando. They would have cherished him and taken care of him maybe more than Vito and Mama did with Michael.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

People always expound on the differences between Michael and Vito but out of all the brothers, it is Michael that is so much like Vito not only in intelligence but even in their initial instincts and personality traits.

I enjoy reading your posts actually and get so many insights from them. I sometimes wonder if my thoughts are my own or an amalgamation of everyone else's that I've read, lol!

I always come back here because The Godfather world and the Corleones, particularly Michael are so compelling and mysterious. I wonder are there people who are like him or who were once like him? He seems so human yet so extraordinary at the same time no?

I felt sorry for him too, both in TGF2 & more so in TGF3. I feel like he deserved more than what he got in the end.

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

I totally agree, the Corleone family are really mysterious. Michael is the most interesting of the bunch as you say.
So much so that anyone who goes from sweet to evil in TV or Film now is seen as going in the "Michael Corleone character arc".

Suppose the only family that could come close in America are the Kennedy's. A lot of mystery surrounds that family and I never feel their story has ever been told that well on TV or Film.

I also remember Coppola saying Brando and Olivier were his choices for Vito. He liked Olivier because he felt he resembled Vito Genovese.

I really get a lot of insightful information from reading your posts. You clearly have a lot of knowledge of The Godfather universe which is amazing.

[–] vicky_lc2001 (1907) 7 years ago

Thanks Damien. I have a lot to thank the former IMDB board for that actually, lol!

[–] DamienThorn1976 (74) 7 years ago

Lol, me too.

[–] shuhel360 (72) 6 years ago

I agree it's hard to find someone who went from good to evil so smoothly as Michael did in any other film. From TV shows I think Walter White from Breaking Bad was the closest.