MovieChat Forums > Chuka (1967) Discussion > Where was Fort Clenendin?

Where was Fort Clenendin?

posted 6 years ago by MAGolding (1240)
2 replies | jump to latest

In the wild west of the Imagination is one answer.

However, Col. Stuart Valois, the commander of Fort Clenendin, quotes a reply from his superior, a general stationed at Fort Wallace, that the Arapaho war chief Hanu would never dare attack Fort Clendendin because it was too close to other forts like Wallace, Dodge, Hays, Bascom, and Garland.

And those are the names of real forts in the real west.

Fort Wallace (c. 1865-1882) was in Wallace Country, Kansas, at coordinates 38°54′18″N 101°33′34″W

Fort Dodge (1865-1882) was near Dodge City, Kansas and at coordinates 37°43′50″N 99°56′5″W.

Fort Hays (1865-1889) was near Hays City, Kansas, at coordinates 38°51′42″N 99°20′32″W

Fort Bascom (1863-1870) in New Mexico was at coordinates Lat: 35.3178303 Long: -103.7032995

Fort Garland (1858-1883) was in Costillo County, Colorado, at coordinates 37°25′46″N 105°26′7″W

(it was strange that they didn't mention Fort Larned [1859-1878] and Fort Harker [1866-1872], between Fort Dodge and Fort Hays. Fort Larned was in Pawnee County, Kansas at 38°10′59″N 99°13′05″W. Fort Harker was at Kanopolis, Kansas at 38°42′35″N 98°9′25″W, but it was abandoned in 1872 before the date of Chuka.)

Fort Wallace was 1.483 degrees north of Fort Garland, and so about 102.3 miles north of it. Fort Hays was about 218 miles east of Fort Garland. The road distance from Fort Garland to Fort Hays is about 403.7 miles, longer than as the crow flies.

Dialog gives the impression that Fort Wallace was the closest fort to Fort Clenendin.

Sergeant "Slim" says he hasn't tried to desert, because it is 59 miles north to Granada and 63 miles south to Stone Creek. Granada, Colorado is east of Fort Garland, at coordinates 38°3′53″N 102°18′40″W,. 59 miles south of Granada would be at about 38 degrees 13 minutes north, in Colorado. 63 miles south of that should be near route 40 in the Texas Panhandle, near Amarillo & Tascosa.

Added 10-8/9-24. Actually 59 miles south of Granada should be at about 37 degrees 12.45 minutes north and about 102 degrees 18.6 minutes west. 63 miles south of there should be about 36 degrees 14 minutes north. So Fort Clenenden should be south of Walsh, Colorado, which is at 37°23′9.99″N 102°16′47.76″W, and the fictional Stone Creek should be near Stratford, Texas which is at 36°20′15″N 102°04′34″W.

So I guess the fictional fort Clenendin would would have been about 130 miles from Fort Wallace and slightly farther from Fort Doge.

[–] MAGolding (1240) 4 months ago

If different western movies happen in the same fictional universe, we can guess the possible identity of the general at Fort Wallace who told Col. Valois that Hanu and his Arapahos would never dare to attack Fort Clendendin because it was too close to other forts like Wallace, Doge, Hays, Bascom, and Garland.

In Buffalo Bill (1944) scout William "Buffalo Bill" Cody spends time near a fort. At one point he rides to the fort and says he saw a Cheyenne war party "on the left [North] bank of the Smokey" & "twenty miles from here". So the Fort must be on the Smoky Hills River that flows mostly eastward in Kansas or within 20 miles of it.

Fort Riley, Kansas, is at 39°06′N 96°49′W and at the Junction of the Republican and Smoky Hill Rivers. Fort Hays, Kansas was at 38°51′42″N 99°20′32″W and about 10 miles north of the Smoky Hill River. Fort Wallace, Kansas. was at 38°54′18″N 101°33′34″W and about a mile from the nearest bends of the Smoky Hill river.

Early in the movie, Sgt. Chips McGraw delivers mail around the fort. There is also a Colonel and a (brigadier) General Blazier. At least two years after the beginning the Great Sioux War of 1876-77 begins. At one point General Blazier tells Cody about the Battles of the Rosebud and Little Bighorn (17 and 25 June) and Cody guides the troops from the fort to reinforce General Crook, and they fight Cheyenne at Warbonnet Gorge, based on a real fight on July 17.

Cody and Sgt. McGraw Later return to the fort after 6 months away, & Cody gets a message to go East. The opening narration dates the trip east to 1877. Sgt. McGraw says the president is new to the job, making it after the inauguration of Hayes on March 5, 1877. Six months before March 4, 1877 would be about September 4, 1876, which doesn't add up. Maybe Cody & McGraw returned to the Fort sometime and then rejoined the campaign against the Sioux.

Continued

[–] MAGolding (1240) 4 months ago

Continued.

If the scriptwriters assumed a modern January 20 inauguration date, Cody & the troops could have left in July about 6 months earlier.

Possibly General Blazier returned to the fort with Cody & McGraw in January or March of 1877 or later. And possibly he was sent back to Kansas to "hold down the fort(s)" or something sometime the cavalry reinforcements reached General Crook.

So possibly Blazier was was the general in command at fort Wallace who told Colonel Valois that Hanu's Arapahos wouldn't attack Fort Clenendin some time in or before November 1876.