MovieChat Forums > Hawaii (1966) Discussion > Making the case for Abner...

Making the case for Abner...

posted 12 years ago by kevin-bergin
13 replies | jump to latest

...okay, here I go:
1. Keeping the Hawaiian maidens away from the sailors-who had evil on their minds-was going to take scaring them about the after life.
2. That girl who went abroad the ship, with Richard Harris, may have married well, but could also have been dumped off and had to work as a hooker.
3. Abner was not going to line his pockets like the other ministers felt they had the right to do-he kept fighting the sugar plantations.
4. Those "royal" families intermarry (Keoki) only to keep the blood (and power) in a very narrow inbred group-not out of love. Abner knew the history of kings and queens from Europe.
How did I do?

[–] godfreye 12 years ago

"inbred" not "in bread"

[–] 12 years ago

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[–] rcdf 12 years ago

While it's true that most of Abner's actions may have been beneficial in the long run, they are in no way, apart from 3, inspired by goodness and make him any less of a creep. The destruction of all Native American civilizations [Aztec, Inca, Caribbean, etc.] can actually be placed in that category. Coming back to Abner, other than his refusal to become corrupt, all his actions [1. specifically] are inspired by fanaticism, rather than a genuine concern for the population.

1. It didn't seem like Abner was the one who got the the women to stop hooking but Jerusha. She's the one who give the queen a logical reason (they're bringing diseases to the island) for it which seems to turn the queen around. The only reason Abner gives for anything, until his unbelievable epiphany in the end, is that they face hell if they don't obey him/Abner.

2. Considering that one of the mixed-race relationships, the one the guy got excommunicated for, worked out well, I don't know whether Abner can really be given any credit for this. Like his condemnation of the island's prostitution racket all he cares about is protecting the community from outside/ anything-other-than-his-own influence as opposed to real concern for the population.

If Abner had been more focused on reason--siting disease rather than morality for condemning prostitution, loss of productivity for prohibition, encouraging literacy along with faith teaching, ordaining Keoki/ making an active effort to assimilate the Hawaiians, respecting their experience in building design, etc.--and not blind faith he could have been a great leader as his refusal of corruption demonstrates.

Abner's parish really comes across more as a Jones Town operation rather than anything holy.

[–] kevin-bergin 11 years ago

If you didn't believe in heaven and hell, or have a strong religious "fanaticism" would you have mixed it up with those sailors? Gotten your church burnt down, etc.

It takes more than the average do-on-to-others to really get someone to risk their own safety.

I doubt I would have had the guts?

[–] Madeline5 10 years ago

It's as Jerusha told him many times: Abner wasn't doing any of those things from basic Christian love for one another, but out of pride.

When one has contempt for others, it is built out of pride and lack of self esteem so there is little room for love.

[–] Fingaroo 12 years ago

2. That girl who went abroad the ship, with Richard Harris, may have married well, but could also have been dumped off and had to work as a hooker.

I think the odds of her having "married well" are pretty much nonexistant, in spite of what Rafer said. What was she, 13 years old, and on a ship full of sailors? Rather, the odds are pretty good that she became a child prostitute and died of VD at a very young age. Abner certaintly would have known this, yet he continued to ask disembarking sailors about her for years afterwards. I found that quite touching.

Your other points are well taken.

[–] milliedil 12 years ago

She WAS married off to a Vice Consul in Santiago, Chile--a privileged life she could never have had in her native land (which may not justify the taking of her, but there it is). Abner asking about her for years afterward is certainly out of concern for her soul--she was his first convert to Christianity and present at the birth of his first child--but he is also confused, growing feeble and cannot remember (we might today ascribe such behavior to Alzheimers disease) the past from the present.

Thank you, thank you--you're most kind. In fact you're every kind.

[–] kevin-bergin 11 years ago

Vice Consuls marry native girls?

[–] Fingaroo 11 years ago

Only if the girls are 13 years old and kidnapped. Apparently such a marriage is supposed to be some sort of "privilege" for the hapless victim.

[–] angelosdaughter 11 years ago

If I remember correctly from the book, Abner's feebleness and difficulty remembering are the result of injuries from the beating Captain Hoxworth gave him upon learning that Jerusha had died from years of overwork and neglect by Abner.
Hoxworth had been in love with Jerusha first.

"..sure you won't change your mind? Why, is there something wrong with the one I have?"

[–] lorrainearmstrongfl 11 years ago

She wasn't kidnapped. She went with him willing. Naively, but willingly.

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] 11 years ago

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