MovieChat Forums > Grand Prix (1966) Discussion > Garner's cut scenes...

Garner's cut scenes...

posted 18 years ago by shyguy28081
16 replies | jump to latest

Frankenhiemer made an interesting comment on the recently re-aired interview he did with Bruce Dern back in the 1990's when the then named Speedvison (now called Speed) first aired Grand prix as part of the Lost Drive In series.
He said he felt that he had short changed Garner's performance in that during the hectic post production, he cut several scenes of Aron (Garner) that would have made the character much more likeable and sympathetic to the audience.
Since the recently released DVD did not include any outtakes or unused scenes, one is left to wonder what might have been had those cuts not been made.
What would have they been about?
Possibly more of a look at the implied friendship with Sarti?
Garner all but disappeared the second half of the movie, mainly having his fireball of a finish at Brands and then winning the final race.
On a related note, Frankenheimer hinted that if had it to do over again, he would not have had Sarti die at the end, although this would have left the questions open: Had he lived, would he have retired?..would he have went ahead and fought for a divorce from his estranged wife to be with the Louise character?
Points to ponder, but unless some film turns up at a later time, we will never know for sure.

[–] fleeing_american_neocons 18 years ago

Hopefully the cut scenes are still around maybe Garner and Bedford could put the scenes together since they're the ones still alive.

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[–] hollyvolley 17 years ago

I think Sarti would have retired- that's the irony of it. He already told Aaron that he feels very tired from it- I think he is just at the point of realizing that a brash young Nino will always be coming along, and he nothing else to accomplish.

His relationship with Eva Marie-Saint seems contingent upon whether he does or doesn't quit. I don't think she is trying to manipulate him, she doesn't seem to want to invest that much emotional stock in the risky business. I'm sure it's over anyway between John Pierre and his wife.

It's interesting that all the women in the film reject the racing eventually, although Walters remains with Stoddard out of love- she still doesn't like him racing-

and yet she poses for publicity photos and television, which makes her a hypocrite too.

I think the breakup of Nino and his girl is HILARIOUS! The look on his face- the big smile- as he tells her "I think you should go to hell!" just cracks me up!

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[–] pawtrax67 16 years ago

Nino spend the previous night before with two girls, what would he care if his girlfriend was walking away from him? But the cut scene in the middle of the race indicates he did care about her and there might have been some regret there.

I do wonder what Garner's scenes would have been?

[–] amanda317 16 years ago

!!!!!!!Contains spoilers!!!!!!!

I could be wrong, but I think one scene could have been when he and Pat Stoddard split up. We never saw the scene and it was only when she had the heart to heart with Scott that we knew the Pete and Pat relationship had run its course. I also agree with you about Nino. At one point I thought it was he who was going to get killed at Monza. I saw the end of the film when I was a child and only remember the infamous tree scene but did'nt know which driver it was. I found out 20 odd years later (this year and it was'nt Nino).

[–] marbleann 15 years ago

I just saw the movie I have it on DVD and decided to look at it again. I always thought that Sarti dying was very unrealistic. I just knew it was going to be Nino. I have seen many more young stars die in F1 then older racers. Not only that I felt we were being set up for Nino's death. He was all over the movie, even the uneasy scene when Sarti's wife and girlfriend are introduced. Plus he was very likable. It would of had a bigger impact if he had died. BTW I believe by the time the movie came out or shortly afterwards two of the drivers in the movie were killed in races. Jim Clark and Lorenzo Bandini who were only 32 and 31 years old.

I also do not think Garners part was unsympathetic. Aron knew that Scot was racing against a a ghost, his dead brother. The team owner finally noticed it when he went to his house and saw the trophy room filed with the brothers trophy. Garner knew no matter what he was not going to win against Bedford because of that. So under normal conditions was he going to let him pass. Not only that Aron did raise his arm and tell him he can go past him in the race that he got hurt in. The other people on the team was telling the owner that it was not Aron it was the cars he was driving, I do not know why the owner hated him. And I do believe Aron really did like Scot. Remember his new owner could not figure out why he could not beat him.

I believe it was a mental thing. He felt bad for him and he hated he messed around with his wife. Aron was well liked by the other drivers it seemed. I do not know what they could of done to make him more sympathetic.

Also I think the movie would of suffered if we had to go through Sarti fighting for a divorce or any of that stuff. I do not think that would of happened anyway.

[–] Sic Coyote 15 years ago

As always with films, Sarti was the one it would be the most wrong to kill off, so it's the perfect time to kill him off.

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[–] marbleann 15 years ago

I had Sarti being killed from the beginning. He always talked about retiring and was very hang dogged about the whole racing scene. And it would be typical. His death was the only flaw of the movie because it was predictable. That is why IMO if Nino got killed it would of been more shocking and realistic. Sarti would of finally retired, end of movie.

[–] Sic Coyote 15 years ago

Yeah but would you really care much if Nino died?

Didn't real life do it the way you wanted with the guy Nino was based on dying a couple of years later?

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[–] marbleann 15 years ago

Oh yes I liked him. He was very nice. I liked him better then Sarti. Nino was a very likable character. He could of been written as a arrogant young newcomer. But he was not.

[–] amanda317 15 years ago

I loved Nino's character!!!! young, handsome, larger than life and full of fun. He kind of reminded me of Francois Cevert who was killed in practise for the US. Grand Prix at Watkins Glen on the 6th of October 1973.

About the movie, I think it would have been kind of corny if they had killed off Nino as marbleann said we were kind of being set up for his death especially in the scene where Nino said to his girlfriend "I am immortal" so Sarti being killed off was kind of a shock for me. Jean Pierre Sarti was my favourite and Nino was my very close second favourite!!!!:-) You wouldn't think that I support Mc'Laren in real life LOL!!!!!!!!:-)

[–] ubercommando 15 years ago

Sarti is set up for death pretty much at the Spa race. He goes off the circuit, in pretty much the conditions he predicted would happen, and accidentally kills two teenage boys. From that point on, his season falls apart. His relationship with Il Commendatore deteriorates and his wife makes a rare visit to a race which puts him on edge for the race. Sarti is the ageing maestro, the lion in winter, call it what you will.

Nino not dying is a good thing and it works well in the script. Yes we know he's brash, cocky and totally self centred so when the team calls him in and retires him out of respect for Sarti, it's a humbling experience for him...his wings are clipped not by any errors, but because there's a greater power than him.

I'd like to know what the cut scenes were; Pete Aron isn't necessarily unlikeable but early on at the French GP, Pat Stoddard sums up his life in one sentence and it's a pretty bleak one. Pete has no personal life, nothing outside of racing and at that stage he doesn't even have that. He wins the championship but what comes afterwards? Scott loses the championship but saves his marriage and he's always got next season. Nino is now the Ferrari #1 and will have plenty more races in him but Pete has won the crown and is left alone. It's all "what price if you win a kingdom but lose your soul" stuff.

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[–] hka-3 13 years ago

I had Sarti being killed from the beginning. He always talked about retiring and was very hang dogged about the whole racing scene.

That was my thought, too. Since his heart wasn't completely in it, I figured his concentration wouldn't be, either, which most likely meant a disastrous outcome. However even with the predictability, his crash was still shocking (and morbidly spectacular). Since he wasn't in the car when it exploded, it seemed like there was a chance he might survive.

[–] amanda317 15 years ago

Plus maybe Scott is modled on Jackie Stewart as he wore a helmet like his:-)

[–] DeepFriedJello 13 years ago

I had a hard time feeling sympathy, empathy, or any real connection with any of the actors. They were all so self-centered. I could have done without half the soap opera relationship scenes, but I assume they needed that for the female viewers to survive a 3 hour movie.

[–] jondoe888 11 years ago

Not many drivers are not self-centered. They are at their best under the helmet.

Other thoughts on the comments...
Was Monique French or Italian? I don't think Italians could divorce back then. And like she told JP - 'I'll never divorce you'... I think JP would retire, tho that's much easier to say than do. And his relationship with Louise was doomed. Or not - I think she would have stayed with him, independently, unmarried. IF he stopped racing and found something to be passionate about again.
And the BRM owner hating Pete - his cars were destroyed. He was all emotion and lashed out. Not knowing the facts - or caring at the moment, it's understandable.
I thoroughly enjoyed the cast and characters. It was a soap opera that I bought into. Over the years, I've felt differently about some of them. And they put Francois Hardy in the film - just for me! The other women I liked, and understood better, when I got older.
Someone mentioned Pat posing with race cars - she was a model, being paid. Just like Pete had to eat it and put on the TV jacket.

I like that we can all speculate on this movie, 50 years later!
I saw the movie in Cinerama at 16, with the family. It was the perfect time to see it. Soon, those teen hormones would start tearing me away from the family, at least for a while. Sitting in the darkened theater, watching GP and How the West was won - even Mad mad world, are now treasured memories. How our memories change...

[–] intexor 13 years ago

This is interesting to me, because I really had a lot of problems with the main character being so unlikable.