MovieChat Forums > The Green Hornet (1966) Discussion > Green Hornet Case Files coming out from ...

Green Hornet Case Files coming out from Moonstone


Moonstone Books will release a short story anthology for the Green Hornet, hewing to the 1960's version. Whether they will do a follow-up volume based on the 1936 to 1952 remains unclear. They had earlier released Green Hornet Chronicles, also based on the 1960's version.

Just to clarify, on the remote chance that some people think that since the same production company handled the Green Hornet as handled the Adam West Batman, that both shows had the same camp style or if anyone thinks (as one person here once said in an exchange with SRB-3), that "Batman was always dark and brooding", that does not represent the case.

Not to defend the Adam West film and TV show, but it did not stray that far from the feel of the comic books from 1944-to-1964. As the poster Count Karnstein pointed out, those comic books:
http://monsterkidclassichorrorforum.yuku.com/search/topic/topic/14587
“had giant pennies and stuffed dinosaurs, was wearing caveman, zebra, and rainbow costumes, teamed up with Bat-Mite, split in two, melded with Superman, fought a living #2 pencil, drowned in giant gravy boats and menaced by giant sized water pistols, tennis rackets, and all sorts of insane absurdities long before the Batman movie or tv show were released….Dozier was bringing the characters to the screen in the manner in which they had been portrayed in the comics. Was there ever a silly, absurd, ridiculous Green Hornet comic book? If so, it’s escaped my attention for the better part of 40 years. Did we ever see a Caveman Green Hornet or a Green Hornet in a rainbox/zebra/dayglo red suit? Did we ever see Green Hornet being drowned in a giant gravy boat or being chased by aliens and dinosaurs? Was there ever an Ace the Green Hornet Dog? How about a Hornet-Mite?
No? I didn’t think so. There’s your answer. It’s literally that simple. Dozier was taking characters and putting them on the screen. Green Hornet was always played straight and serious in the comics/strips/radio, so he was done that way for tv. Batman was as absurd, silly, goofy, and ridiculous as anything else that has ever appeared in comics, and so that’s how he appeared on-screen”.

reply

Actually, Count Karnstein is off the beam. If Green Hornet comic books had run throughout the 1950s as Batman's did, we would have probably seen goofiness similar to the stuff in Batman in those days. But The Green Hornet was a radio series; when the radio show died, the comic book people stopped being interested. Furthermore, it must be pointed out that most of what the count describes was eliminated by Julius Schwartz when he became editor of Batman and Detective Comics as of the May (maybe April) cover dated issues. It got pretty serious under him until he was obligated by the businessmen to make the comics more like the incredibly popular TV show. Admittedly, Dozier and co. are known to hgave used a pair of reprint collections/"Annuals" filled with pre-Schwartz material.

As for "...melded with Superman" I think Karnstein is talking about "The Composite Superman" of a couple of World's Finest Comics stories of the Superman/Batman team. His visual appearance was like that but he definitely was a completely separate person, and first appeared in the summer of 1964. Way off, unless I'm mistaken.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

Schwartz still kept the boy sidekick in a skimpy mask, yellow cape, red tunic, green pixie shoes and bare legs.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CommonKnowledge

Once upon a time, this was uncommon knowledge, but nowadays, it's common knowledge that Batman, at the time of his creation in The Golden Age of Comic Books, was a much "darker" character than he became in the '50s and '60s. Which is true to a point, but it wasn't long at all before the character was made Lighter And Softer. As Eisner-nominated comics journalist and professional Batmanologist Chris Sims noted, "Sure, he might’ve fought vampires and carried a gun for like three issues, but by the end of that first year, it was pretty much all cat-wrestling and trips to Storybook Land."

The 1940's tales had extraterrestrials, Tweedledee and Tweedledum, etc.

reply

"...[T]he boy sidekick..." was too generally known and too central in the merchandising for Schwartz to be given any choice by the policy makers but to keep him. He did unveil a more reasonable costume in the 1967 JLA-JSA crossover (the Robin of a frequently visited parallel space-time continuum, Earth 2).

I've never heard of Chris Sims, Eisner-award nomination notwithstanding. Batman fighting genuine vampires and carrying a conventional firearm seem to have been limited to the same very early two-parter, but the forties remained dark, violent, etc. The Joker, introduced the same month as Robin, was a dangerous killer, and not only was there the original and sporadically published Two-Face trilogy, but the early fifties saw a direct and faithful (including tone) sequel to it. I don't even know what Sims might mean by "cat-wrestling" (unless it's a reference to the early Catwoman stories, none of which I've ever had the opportunity to read), but it definitely sounds sarcastically disparaging rather than objectively critical. I could make a very long list of irrefutably factually inaccurate statements from respected sources. You'd be surprised (unless you just happen to already be aware of it) how many reference works list "Lee Ann Meriwether" among the actresses who played Catwoman on the 60s Batman series; not only did she take that role only on the big-screen feature spin-off, but while Ann is her legal middle name it disappeared from her on-screen billing very early in her post-Miss America acting career, specifically in the mid 50s. That's according to her IMDb listings, but I guarantee from first-hand observation that there's no "Ann" for her on The 4D Man (1959). Hence, I reserve the right to doubt Sims' credibility despite the implied reputation.

If your own claim in your last sentence is true ("extraterrestrials" in 1940s Batman stories? not that I've ever heard of, but if so, you can bet they came to Earth, rather than B&R going into space as seen in many mid 50s-early 60s stories), these were rare. Furthermore, I've seen a reprint of one of the "Tweedles" story from the forties, and the characters were not in line with the ludicrous stuff of later.

I am somewhat surprised at your challenging my post as you yourself put Kronstein's described era as "1944-1964" (I apologize for having failed to notice that previously) as the former contradicts Sims and the latter is when Schwartz took over editing the two main Bat-titles, well before work began on the TV series. 1954 is a more accurate starting date, but a couple of years earlier might be better. In any event, the CCA's Comics Code was undoubtedly a factor in the loss of the "darkness."

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

The oddities started in the 1940's. I doubt that on radio or in print the Green Hornet had adventures in the 1940's such as:

http://www.cosmicteams.com/jsa/batman/index.htm
http://www.cosmicteams.com/jsa/batman/batman.htm

A 21st century lab worker named Rob Callendar is transported to the 20th century by a space-time warp created by a laboratory accident. He attempts to make himself wealthy by stealing a series of objects that are destined to become part of Batman's famous trophy collection, but he is ultimately returned to his own time empty-handed when the time warp wears off. BF/JR/FR World's Finest #11 Fall 1943

Batman and Robin visit the hidden undersea kingdom of Atlantis, where they discover that the kingdom's naive rulers, Princess Lanya and Emperor Taro (a look-alike for Dick Grayson), have been persuaded by Nazi U-boat commander Hauptman Kurt Fritzl to allow him to use Atlantis as a secret base to attack Allied shipping. Batman and Robin persuade Taro and Lanya of Fritzl's treachery and drive the Nazis out, but the Atlantean emperor decides that Atlantis must remain cut off from the surface world. DC/DS
NOTES: This version of Atlantis bears no resemblance to the ruins of Atlantis that figured in the origin of the Golden Age Aquaman (who, unlike his Silver Age counterpart, was not a native of Atlantis), as told in More Fun Comics #73 (11/41), or to the versions of Atlantis that appeared in the Superman or Wonder Woman stories of this period. It is possible that on Earth-Two, as on Earth-One, there was more than one undersea civilization called Atlantis. Batman #19 [2] 10-11/43

Using the system of time travel by hypnosis developed by their friend, Professor Carter Nichols, Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson make their first trip back in time to visit ancient Rome. JSa/DS/JR NOTES: Carter Nichols also appeared in a number of stories set on Earth-One (e.g., Brave and the Bold#171 (2/81)), but it is unclear how many of Batman's Golden Age time travel stories also occurred on Earth-One. Batman #24 [1] 8-9/44



Batman and Robin battle Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum, who have become the mayors of the small town of Yonville. Although stymied by their foes' ostensible legal authority, Batman and Robin ultimately defeat the two villains, and Batman is elected mayor of Yonville long enough to charge the Tweeds with fraud, grand larceny, and attempted murder. DC/DS
NOTES: This was the final Golden Age appearance of Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum. Their Earth-One counterparts, whose early history was similar, appeared next in Batman #291 (9/77). This story demonstrated how far Batman and Robin had come from their early days as outlaws. Even after they have been arrested and jailed by the Tweeds, Batman remarks, "Whatever their game, Robin, they've got the law on behind them--and we never fight the law!" Batman #24 [3] 8-9/44


rofessor Carter Nichols sends Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson back in time to the early 17th century, where, as Batman and Robin, they meet the Three Musketeers. DC/DS NOTES: This story treats the Three Musketeers as real historical personages, rather than fictional characters. While Alexandre Dumas, author of the immortal 1844 novel The Three Musketeers, based his heroes very loosely on real people (Athos on Armand de Sillègue d'Athos d'Autevielle (1615-1644); Porthos on Isaac de Portau (dates unknown); Aramis on Henri d'Aramitz (?-1674); and, most famously, D'Artagnan on Charles de Batz (1618-1673)); those historical figures had little resemblance to the colorful figures of the novel. The Musketeers in this story are clearly Dumas' Musketeers. Batman #32 [3] 12/45-1/46


tman helps Superman rescue his friend Poco, an alien from the planet Utopia, who has become trapped in a refrigerated freight car. NOTES: Batman appeared only briefly in this radio storyline, entitled "Phony Song Publishing Racket." Superman's friend Poco first appeared on the radio series in February 1945. Superman radio 12/46


prank by Lois Lane accidentally results in a national newspaper story identifying Clark Kent as Superman. Among the many readers of the story are Bruce Wayne and Dick Grayson. Bruce remarks, "To think he even had me fooled!" Dick replies, "And it's no cinch to fool the Batman!" The paper later prints a retraction indicating that the story was a hoax. JSi/Ed Dobrotka/John Sikela
NOTES: This cameo was the first time Batman and Robin appeared in the Superman series. Bruce and Dick's hair was incorrectly colored brown. Superman #20 1-2/43


atman fills in for the Atom in a Justice Society mission, helping the JSA solve the mystery of the Koehaha, the Stream of Ruthlessness.
NOTES: This adventure indicated that at this time most of the regular JSA members were not aware of Batman's true identity, although Bruce Wayne knew theirs. This was the only time during the Golden Age that Batman and Superman actively participated in a JSA adventure, and the first time Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman appeared together in the same story. The authorship of this story is unclear; it was apparently written, or at least rewritten, by Robert Kanigher, but may have originally been written by either John Broome or Gardner Fox. The artist of the Batman chapter is also uncertain, but was probably either Irwin Hasen or Win Mortimer. All-Star Comics #36 8-9/47



reply

Do you really believe that an appearance on the Superman radio series is relevant to our discussion of the Batman comics? ("Phony Song Publishing Racket"? sounds a lot like a Green Hornet radio episode that I have, and the title fits the "...Racket" structure often used there.) Similarly, the JSA/All Star Comics story is irrelevant; it's like citing what was going on in Justice League of America, World's Finest and Brave and the Bold to claim that Batman wasn't depicted dark and grim in the 1970s. This is especially so if the deduction of Roy Thomas and the late Jerry Bails that it was originally written to be the Atom himself is true; this was outlined by Thomas in his book The All Star Companion, and cited evidence included a caption referring to Batman by a nickname far more applicable to Atom than he. What sounds like a cameo in a Superman story is hardly relevant either. The "Tweedles" story doesn't sound at all on the level of the pre-Schwartz material we're talking about. For the other few, I remind you of my prior statement, "These were rare."

I'd now like to go a bit OT and discuss a few other things you mentioned.

Time travel via Carter Nichols (the specific means long since changed from hypnosis to physical technology) was in fact another then-current aspect of the Bat-feature that Julie dropped abruptly in his 1964 revamp. I read something that implied that there was quite a gap between a handful of hypnosis-based stories with Nichols and his reappearance with the more familiar chair-devices in many stories, which were seen well into the 60s. I believe the eventual official position (pre-Crisis, of course) was that hypnosis was used on Earth 2 and tech on E 1. It's interesting to note just how many characters and such jettisoned by Schwartz continued to appear in Batman stories produced outside his office. The only thing he actually had specifically written out was Alfred, and the TV show forced his resurrection! Nichols & his time travel device, Batwoman, Bathound, Bat-Mite and even the Whirlybats (one-man helicopters) would be seen in the Superman/Batman team feature in World's Finest and to a much lesser extent in JLA, and then given greater revival in the 70s by writers who had been fans.

Your statements about Atlantis are particularly interesting. Didn't know there was an Atlantis in Superman's stories until Lori Lemaris arrived in the 50s. I felt that the Wonder Woman Atlantis (firmly established as that of Earth 2 in the 1976 JLA/JSA crossover) was completely incompatible with the sunken and abandoned ruins of the initial Aquaman origin and Roy Thomas was therefore wrong to put the Golden Age Aquaman on Earth 2 in his All Star Squadron series. This wasn't too problematical, since the character made only one or two brief appearances near the end there, while Roy lifted another character called Neptune Perkins out of (IIRC) the GA Hawkman feature as an Aquaman equivalent. (There were a lot of others equally indefensible and too prominent to be similarly ignored, but I won't go into that here.) However, when I pointed this out in an online discussion of that comic's continuity lapses elsewhere, I was told comments in that JLA/JSA story had stated that its Atlantis had recently resurfaced. With a seemingly full population? Everywhere I go, I find jerks who will say just about anything to stand by the position they've committed themselves to, regardless of the facts. Oh, I don't mean you; what you've said doesn't come across as that sort of desperate straw-grasping and I see it all as made in good faith. Caught that in proofreading, fortunately.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

http://books.google.com/books?id=VydBDR_aTgoC&pg=PA131&lpg=PA131&dq=%22brane+taylor%22&source=bl&ots=GigpW3dNWU&sig=7AEy6hC1uxWoJtrnAfEfhv29ozQ&hl=en&ei=HOucTeePA8LegQegqJyLBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBQQ6AEwADgo#v=onepage&q=%22brane%20taylor%22&f=false

Mike Barr wrote an article which covered the other odd adventures.

#5 witches

#26

#41

#42 t travel

#59

#67

mike barr article

Just wondering; in the Green Hornet radio show and comic books, did he ever encounter extraterrestrials?

reply

Given all the Batman stories of the 1940s, that still leaves it at a pretty small proportion and my point stands.

Just wondering; in the Green Hornet radio show and comic books, did he ever encounter extraterrestrials?
While only a very few (I'd guess around 200) of the more than one thousand episodes broadcast are now available for listening, it does not appear so. As for the comics, somebody somewhere (perhaps on the Green Hornet Discussion Group at Yahoo Groups) posted the claim that the Golden Age GH comic books were pretty faithful to the radio show. However, the only sample I've ever had the opportunity to read--a two page "U-Solve-it Mystery"--had the Hornet openly investigating the case, even in front of the police. On the other hand, the Harvey Comics staff did not have the freedom to do almost anything they wanted to with that licensed property as DC's people had with the company-owned Batman, and they in turn faced similar limitations doing properties which that publisher licensed. Also note some of the plots on the TV version:

"The Silent Gun"--A firearm with no muzzle flash or any report whatsoever (no slight "phut" or anything, still impossible and this were ostensibly made during World War II!) falls into the hands of racketeers.
"Programmed For Death" (the pilot, no less)--A leopard is trained to kill anyone from whom a certain supersonic tone emits via a very small transmitter planted on them; this is done to conceal the discovery and criminal misuse of a method of synthesizing perfect diamonds (that's two science fictional points here).
"Crime Wave"--A computer program to predict crimes, specifically those of the Green Hornet, is unveiled; admittedly it turns out to be a hoax, but a respected computer expert vouches for it honestly and innocently, which invalidates that as an excuse.
"Beautiful Dreamer" (two parts)--People are brainwashed into commiting crimes and having no memory of what they've done; one victim "remembers" being in her home at the time.
"Invasion From Outer Space" (two parts)--Admittedly, the "extra-terrestrials" are almost immediately revealed as phonies, but even so, some of the villain's technology (henchwoman Vama's lightning-like stun blasts, for one blatant example off the top of my head) remain unreal 44 years later.

That's seven storylines out 23, slightly less than one-third (albeit much less outrageous than the Batman stuff under discussion, but the logistical limitations of 1960s TV would make that sort of material quite difficult). Given these, who can be certain just what happened on those unavailable radio episodes? Many of those are post-1947, surprisingly. See the Green Hornet listings of "Jerry Haendiges Vintage Radio Logs" at http://www.otrsite.com/logs/logg1005.htm.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

I find Jerry Haendiges list surprisingly incomplete to what is currently available on line.You just have to hunt for it.I found one site that has over 250 downloadable shows he doesn't even mention. My own personal shows taped off the radio from over thirty years ago,though listed,don't seem to be in his collection. Surfing the net,I estimate there might actually be close to 700 or more episodes in current circulation. Of the about 100 episodes I've listened to,the technology stays in the realm of actual reality,and the very few with seeming supernatural themes are written off as just superstition. the fantastic elements seem to have been introduced by the television series. Because of this,I've always been annoyed when people call the Green Hornet a Super Hero when all he really is a flesh and blood vigilant who wears a mask not to be recognized.

reply

At the top of his Green Hornet page, Haendiges has a note stating that the last update of it was in January 2004! If you want to see a true atrocity, check his Lone Ranger logs.

...the fantastic elements seem to have been introduced by the television series
Well, we got somewhat OT. What I originally disputed was the claim that the Batman comics were predominantly featuring ridiculous stuff by 1944 or even earlier, rather than getting heavy only in the 50s, and nothing you've presented genuinely contradicts that. Admittedly, I started off by asserting,
If Green Hornet comic books had run throughout the 1950s as Batman's did, we probably would have seen goofiness similar to the stuff in Batman....But...when the radio show died, the comic book people stopped being interested.
And I stand by that as well. Actually, I feel if Harvey (who ended their ongoing series in 1949) or Dell (who put out a one-shot in 1953) had continued publishing Hornet comics after cessation of radio production, they probably would have attained a freedom similar to the way DC's Bob Hope and Jerry Lewis comic series became essentially unrelated to their respective movie star inspirations. Remember, Van Williams told Will Murray (in Starlog #135, October 1988) that George Trendle visited the Hornet TV set and stated that he felt the series should be played more like Batman, meaning campy. Unless Williams was lying or delusional (sadly, distinct possibilities given some demonstrably false assertions he makes in the same interview), Trendle was not as controlling as his successors (heirs?) running The Green Hornet, Inc. at the time of the NOW Comics version (and look at what they just let Seth Rogen do!). This was a reboot on its own terms rather than a direct adaptation of the radio program (as the three Big Little Books, the two Universal serials and the Helnit/Harvey/Dell comics were) or of the TV series (as the Gold Key Comics and two novels of that era were).

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

If you are talking about a site I recently found, http://www.myexistenz.com/OTR/article4/Greenhornet.html, less than 30 of their titles actually have links to click on for "Download/play," all but two of those episodes have titles recognizable by me as being/having-been available elsewhere, and none of the links work. That's all highly suspicious on its own terms. If you're talking about some other site (your numbers don't quite jibe with that one, as they list only slightly more than 200 episodes total and Haendiges mentions quite a few of their titles, so I'm definitely open to that idea), I'd like to know just what one you did mean.

UPDATE: At least one Green Hornet link at the site discussed above does work. My apologies for that error, but everything else is true and the bottom line request stands.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

Yes,that MyExistenz site is one of the sites I was referring to.It's actually been around for several years,and at some point in the past when I did listen to quite a bit of it,it did have far more functional links than it does now.Highly suspicious is the availabilty of CBC's Nightfall series,which has basically been locked in a vault since it's original run and not been legally available since. The 700 figure was a rough estimate of what I came up with after seeing the recent movie and trolling through the internet to see what else was available,and I have to concede that it might,and probably is,multiple titles for the same episodes. My impression that there were far more episodes is from the sporadic old time radio rebroadcasts over the years. It's highly likely that some were taken from archival sources unique to Canada,and not available in the states. I find it interesting that you only speculate that Oliver Perry turns villainous,when I absolutely swear I heard an episode in which he breaks out of jail then tortures and ultimately kills Lenore case over a phone to get back at the Greenhornet. It's one of the most galvanizing old time radio moments I've ever heard,and not easy to forget. I'm almost sure I heard it on a Canadian radio series years ago called Nightcamp,or it's precurser Summercamp.The host David Lennick had a vast personal collection of all sorts of fascinating mayhem from yesteryear.Sadly,the CBC has all but abandonned this type of programming and has reduced it's inhouse radio drama production to a miserable half an hour a week.If you are unfamiliar with David Lennick,he was a self confessed CBC radio brat whose mother was a regular on both the radio and television versions of Wayne and Shuster's program. I'm not sure what ever became of him,or if he's still alive.

reply

Only after I did that last post did I go back to check on the Myexistenz post.I'm truly astonished how eviscerated that site has become.I guess the copywrite holders went after it,or something.

reply

I did not "only speculate" about Oliver Perry turning truly villainous, but merely indicated I was unsure whether I should believe my third-hand source's claim to that effect, having heard no such episode nor read it anywhere else myself. The episode you describe I suspect had not Casey but private detective Linda Travis being murdered, as that same source made such a claim.

Let me discuss another site that streams old time radio shows, freeotrshows.com. They list 27 Green Hornet shows/links, but actually have a much smaller quantity of different episodes. Eight do not contain titles, but 7 of these are duplicates of others that do, "Trouble Hits the Trolleys," "Not One Cent for Tribute" (a.k.a. "The Gas Station Protection Racket" in my collection), "Justice Wears a Blindfold," "Money Talks Too Loud," "The Sales Tax Racket" and "The Political Racket." The latter is definitely a mistake as the two are consecutive, not just on the site's list but in their given original airdates and episode numbers. I know that's only six, but another titleless link yields an extremely scrambled version of "Political...." Anther titled link, "The Robertson Gas[oline] Racket" (the bracketed part reflects an undated Haendiges listing), is actually "...Tribute" yet again, but the name Robertson is nowhere to be heard in it; I suspect that Haerndiges' "Robertson..." is an actually different episode. Freeotrshows' one titleless link that does not duplicate a titled one is an episode labeled in my collection as "The Needy Family Racket." It bears the date July 17, 1940, which yet another site, otr.net, gives the title "Poor Substitutes for a Prison." I've been unable to make that one, or any of theirs, stream and determine if it's the same episode, and an email reporting the situation to them is currently pending a response (ditto myexistenz, BTW). One other point about freeotrshows is that one episode, which they number 406 and date December 28, 1940, is called "Crandall and the Murder Ring." It contains a passing reference to Mr. Big, whose story arc was dated by the Wikipedia passage alleged to have been cribbed from the Grams/Salomonson book to August 21 - September 2, 1940! It's getting to the point that I doubt if I can trust any source (online ones, anyway) about this radio series.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

This Oliver Perry episode might be in my personal collection,and I'll try and hunt it down and verify it. I totally agree with you about the internet being a disorganized mess of conflicting information and disappointing sites.I've got to find this book you mentioned.From his Youtube clip,Salomonson leaves the impression that he's the only one who really knows what's what in the Green Hornet universe.Have you actually read this book? Is it any good?

reply

Unfortunately, I live 35 miles from the nearest town large enough to have its own Wal-Mart, let alone a library or bookstore of respectable size, and am short on disposable cash as well. So no, I have yet to obtain a copy of it, but it has been highly recommended by other members of a Green Hornet discussion group (Yahoo Groups).

I have received a reply from Mark Swain of Myexistenz, who says "I'm in the process of moving my website from one hosting company to another," hence the playback problems there. I await improvements anxiously (as well as a response from otr.net).

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

I'm glad to read an explanation for the problems at the Myexistenz site.I look forward to revisiting it. I've relistened to about thirty of my Green Hornet tapes but still haven't found the episode I mentioned. My personal collection is a bit of a mess. Tracing down Salomonson on the internet, I rediscovered the site AudioClassicsArchive.com. It provides some excerpts from the book,how to order the book,as a book,or on Kindle!! Looking a bit farther,the site supplys a COMPLETE Green Hornet episode guide in it's Archive Holdings link !!Salomonson has updated it and provided all the new revisions. They also sell some Green Hornet,Lone Ranger and Sgt.Preston C.d.s and how to order from the archive itself. They have the whole shebang! Some of the excerpts are fascinating. Who knew there was a 1950s pilot for the tv series? Axford was introduced in an earlier series called Warner Lester,Manhunter? The premise might have been inspired by Frank Packard's Jimmy Dale storys that had a movie serial,The Gray Seal based on it? Cool beyond belief! There is even a link to a Portuguese language version of The Shadow!!!

reply

Putting "AudioClassicsArchive.com" in my address window got an error message and "Did you mean 'audio_classics_archive.com'?" That led me to a search result page where the only plausible option was "audio-classics.com." This had links to info about the Grams-Salomonson book--including the Kindle version--on its home page, but did not have "The Green Hornet" on its list of series titles as links to logs! The site was nevertheless indicated to be owned by Terry Salomonson. I'm lost.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

My fault. My hand written note got really mixed up. I went back and retraced how I found it. The proper address is http:www.audio-classics.com. Then click "Enter Archives Here". Next,look for "Archive Holdings" in the list on the left. This presents an A to Z guide. Press "G" and then scroll down to Green Hornet,and click and the list to the entire series appears.
Salomonson must have completed it since my visit back in february,when I made my initial search after seeing the new movie,which,I have to admit I enjoyed. Before going to it I had watched my videos of the first serial,the first Bruce Lee compilation movie and some of the radio episode I'm relistening to now. By that point I was totally open to it being spoofed.
One thing that really puzzles me is that Salomonson is,as far as I know,the only person who has had access to the entire run in years,perhaps decades. So why does the list he give match the list on a floppy disc I copied from the internet over 15 years ago? This mystery list doesn't have an address on it anymore.Who compiled that one?

reply

I've got it, and I've got it bookmarked. However, it is far from complete. He goes through Novembver 1936, lists one episode for October 31, 1939, jumps to April 4, 1944, then to May 16, '44. Seems pretty consistent after that, but I haven't run all the way down, except to find that he does agree with Haendiges that there were no new episodes between September 1950 and September 1952.

I know absolutely nothing about the internet prior to early 2000, my introduction to it, so I can't help you on that "mystery list."

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

In comparing Salomonson's list to Haendiges', I've found something. Radio Spirits has had "Bait for a Two-Timer" in two different Green Hornet box sets. One was their very first GH collection, containing 18 episodes on six 90-minute audio cassettes. While most of the shows there had specific original airdates of the more-or-less mid-1940s, two or three, including "Bait...," were simply attributed to the 1930s. The other was the recent CD box, "The Biggest Game," wherein "Bait..." was given a specific date in 1939. However, Haendiges puts that title to June 6, 1950 and nowhere else, while Salomonson has "The Baiter Baited" for that date. If no actual title was read on the air by the narrator, they could easily be talking about the same episode--and notice that Haendiges does claim to have this "Bait..." in his catalog. What follows is a less comprehensible conumdrum. Both agree that the next episode of 1950 was "Clicker Clicks," but that's where the agreement ends. Terry dates it June 16, after indicating GH to have been preempted on the 9th, while Jerry reverses these, that is he says "Clicker..." aired on the 9th and the preemption was on the 16th. The airdates given by both before and after this indicate a one-episode-a-week frequency at this time, but note that the 6th and the 9th are just three days apart, not a full week. Haendiges specifically states a switch from Tuesdays to Fridays here, while Salomonson does not deal with specifics of scheduling beyond giving dates. Since "Bait..." aired within one calendar week and "Clicker...," according to Terry, aired within the next, why consider the 9th an intended but preempted airdate? If he has specific documentation--and Haendiges has no less than three episodes airing within one week, September 16, 18 & 20, 1940, without directly acknowledging it; he states that this eight-episode return to Mutual began on Mondays, moved to Fridays as of the fifth then to Thursdays for the last two, but he doesn't mention that the 20th would have been a Wednesday; assuming he knows what he's talking about here (and Salomonson's list, I repeat, jumps from 1936 to 1944 with the exception of one episode in October 1939, so he tells us nothing about this period) then it is possible that the June 1950 move from one day of the week to another happened in the same calendar week--of a scheduled episode "Clicker..."?) and special news coverage preemption, why does Haendeges say it aired then and the 16th saw GH preempted? Oh well....

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

I have read that the foes stopped taking lives just a few years after their introduction.

Incidentally, on radio, as I understand it, the Hornet had few recurring foes, right? The pulps such as the Shadow did not have too many recurring foes either, other than G-8.

reply

There were two mystery villains, "Mr. X" and "Mr. Big." Detailed information about both, limiting each to a short-run story arc of about four consecutive episodes each (off the top of my head), was added to Wikipedia's GH article without source citations. Someone else later complained that this and more added at the same time were lifted verbatim from the recent GH book by Martin Grams, Jr., and Terry Salomonson. Certainly both villains can be found on episodes in my personal collection, as can a handful with unsavory private investigator Oliver Perry. His heart was in the right place, however, because he like most people in the Hornet's world believed the masked man to be a big-time criminal, and Perry was trying to bring him in. He became convinced of a connection between the Hornet and Reid, eventually that they were the same man. Perry once tracked through the maze of front companies to prove that Reid owned the "supposedly abandoned warehouse" but failed to connect it to the Hornet. The aforementioned Wikipedia info indirectly attributed to Grams and Salomonson also discussed Perry, and claimed that in his last few episodes he turned genuine criminal. That's three more-or-less recurring foes that I know of, and with so many episodes not available (I seriously doubt as537's claim that there are "close to 700 or more" out there), there might be one or two others.
Speaking of that poster, I must suggest an alternate interpretation to his, "...one site that has over 250 downloadable shows [which Jerry Haendiges's site] doesn't even mention." Haendiges lists some episodes by titles that are not the ones read on the air by the announcer/narrator, because he saw his on some script draft (he told me this in an exchange of emails in early '07). Barring direct evidence that one way or another the narrator said on air a title he was not supposed to, we have to assume that he was reading the final selected title (when I included this reasoning in one email to Jerry, his reply completely ignored that part of it). Furthermore, many episodes do not have an on-air title at all and are issued by different companies under different titles. For example, what Haendiges and Radio Spirits both call "Man Wanted For What?" has also been available as "Amnesia Witness." I'd be very surprised if these two titling factors don't reduce that "250" number significantly.

The GREEN HORNET Strikes Again!

reply

Thanks for that concise, if not completely compendious, discourse on the oft-times confusing activities and machinations of the Green Hornet et al.

reply