Unfortunately, that particular incident was never explored further, which I felt was a missed opportunity: I don't recall any of them, not even Dr Markway, investigating this strange anomoly thereafter - which is odd because I thought this was exactly the kind of thing they were searching for?
It would have been interesting if someone had suggested a handwriting test, to see if there were any similarities; but this never happened. In fact even more oddly, Luke erased the message with a hankerchief - why would Markway allow him to do that if it could be used as evidence?
It is a little strange, now that you mention it, but parapsychology was in its infancy at that time, and I don't recall Markway having much with him in the way of equipment and technology. He could have asked for everyone to give samples of their writing and compare them, but he wasn't a handwriting expert, and how would he know for sure everyone was giving him real examples of their writing? Also, as I recall, the writing was done in printing, and if it were done as a prank, whomever did it would have probably tried to disguise their writing.
Did Markway even have a camera with him? If he did, it would have made sense to take photos of the writing, but I don't think he had a camera with him. Which in itself seems a bit strange, because that technology was readily available to him.
I've always thought it was left deliberately ambiguous -- the whole haunting of Hill House issue. Was it Theo or Luke who wrote that just to wind Eleanor up? But then, what about the cold spot, and the dog-like creature that gave Luke and Markway a run for their money down the halls? Who did that pounding, Luke and Markway were off chasing the phantom dog on other parts of the property and Theo was with Eleanor? What about the breathing door?
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Sonatine97
10 years ago
You make some salient points regarding Markway and his "half-baked" scientific studies of the House.
From memory the only things he took with him into Hill House, were clipboards, pens & mimeographed forms for everyone to make notes on. So you're right: no cameras, no recording machines, no microphones, nothing even remotely technological that could be used to record any supernatural or psychokinetic forces within the house.
The fact that he didn't bring any instrimentation to the house is at odds with the fact that near the beginning of the film, we're introduced to Markway as a respected professor in Anthropology & expert in psychic research. During that same scene we're told that people who have rented Hill House in the past have never stayed for more than a few nights because "the dead are not quiet in Hill House!"
So with all that build up, you would think he would have at least brought some basic recording equipment or a camera into the house! If he has spent most of his adult life doing this kind of research, surely he would've invested a lot of his time/money buying whatever gadget-of-the-time to record these incidents.
I know I'm making a mountain out of a mole-hill, but this has always bugged me about this wonderful film :)
...but what I know about is Texas; and down here, you're on your own!
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snickz
10 years ago
If I remember right, the only time the four of them were together while any questionable phenomenon was occuring was toward the end, when they were all downstairs, but heard the pounding upstairs. At that time, the servants were gone, so what was making the noises, if it wasn't any of them? Even the skeptical Luke, seemed to become a believer after this incident.
I always took from this movie, it was fate for Eleanor to come to Hill House, and to die there.
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AStrangeOldMan
10 years ago
I've probably sledged this point to death before, but there's mention of Eleanor's telekinetic ability previous to her stay at Hill House. It's a possibility that she herself is causing the phenomenon, (though not very likely), unconsciously. That would also include the writing.
I have, however, never doubted in 50 years that the place was haunted (and extREMEly so, I might add.)
No fate but what we make. -Terminator II
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Sonatine97
10 years ago
It did cross my mind that perhaps Eleanor herself had subconsciously done this; either as a means of attention-seeking, or as a proxy for the bad spirits within Hill House.
...but what I know about is Texas; and down here, you're on your own!
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catbookss
10 years ago
From memory the only things he took with him into Hill House, were clipboards, pens & mimeographed forms for everyone to make notes on. So you're right: no cameras, no recording machines, no microphones, nothing even remotely technological that could be used to record any supernatural or psychokinetic forces within the house.
[…]
If he has spent most of his adult life doing this kind of research, surely he would've invested a lot of his time/money buying whatever gadget-of-the-time to record these incidents.
That's my recollection as well, just pens, paper, and the forms. Right, in addition to cameras, you'd think he'd have brought along recording devices, seeing as he was an expert in psychic research at the time. He'd also gone to quite a lot of trouble to locate and screen the applicants, and arrange for access to Hill House for the length of his study.
I know I'm making a mountain out of a mole-hill, but this has always bugged me about this wonderful film :)
I don't know if I should thank you for pointing this out -- something that hadn't crossed my mind before -- or curse you
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turtletommy
10 years ago
Yes the idea that this "scientific experiment" in 1963 would not include any equipment beyond pen and paper is pretty amusing but I love the story anyway. How would Dr. Markway ever be able to publish let's say any findings from said experiment in a noted journal (or the local Hill House Times) with just verbal/written eyewitness accounts and no other documentation by sound recording, movie and/or still film or ectoplasm sealed in a mason jar? Let's get real folks!
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catbookss
10 years ago
He might be able to get it published in the Hill House Times. What was it the housekeeper kept saying? Something like "Alone. In the dark. In the night." . But no journal would publish it with next to no documentation, that's for sure.
Yes, we love it anyway, wart and all.
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AStrangeOldMan
10 years ago
Of course, they had no real idea of what they were in for.
A cold spot could be exaggerated, smells, sensations and the like can't really be recorded by anything, and filming or recording it would have required more people than Dr. Markway wanted to bring with him (sound men, cameramen), plus he couldn't be certain where (or if) the visible or aural manifestations would occur.
Markway had heard many rumors about Hill House, but I'm positive he had no inkling just how insanely haunted the building would be, and likely thought that many of the 'stories' would turn out to have logical explanations. (Unlike me, who would take one look at that place and say, "Unh Unh. Nope. Going home, NOW.")
No fate but what we make. -Terminator II
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turtletommy
10 years ago
Push "record" on a consumer tape/reel to reel recorder, bring a Kodak Instamatic (with cubed flash) etc etc. Basic stuff. No need for assistants.
Obviously AFTER the stay at Hill House, you'd think Dr. Markway would intellectually and professionally have been spurred on to investigate more deeply and thoroughly the goings-on there!
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catbookss
10 years ago
Of course, they had no real idea of what they were in for.
Well, Dr. Markway did. He's the one who researched which reputedly haunted house to conduct his experiment in, as well as advertising for and vetting the candidates, Eleanor and Theo. He may have thought some of the stories would turn out to have logical explanations for them, but he was after all a parapsychology researcher, so he was looking for evidence of legit hauntings.
A thermometer and pen and paper would have been all he needed to measure and record the cold spots, and he could have manned cameras and a tape recorder himself. Even if he couldn't be sure where or if aural or visual manifestations would occur, he'd be
sure to not capture anything if he didn't bring along any devices to record them.
(Unlike me, who would take one look at that place and say, "Unh Unh. Nope. Going home, NOW.")
That would be me, too. A fine pair of parapsychology researchers we'd make!
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Sonatine97
10 years ago
Well, Dr. Markway did. He's the one who researched which reputedly haunted house to conduct his experiment in, as well as advertising for and vetting the candidates, Eleanor and Theo. He may have thought some of the stories would turn out to have logical explanations for them, but he was after all a parapsychology researcher, so he was looking for evidence of legit hauntings.
...moreover, at the beginning of the film, the old lady who owned the house, told Markway that people who had rented the house only ever stayed a few nights before leaving due to too many strange things going on. So with this in mind, one would have thought Markway would have tried to track these tenants down and interviewed them about their experiences, and then bought some basic recording kit and rigged them in the various "hot spots" the tenants could have hinted at during their time there.
Not that any of this matters because it's all rather moot; but it does seem to be a weakness in the story that I know shouldn't bother me from the overall enjoyment of the film, but just imagine if he did take a camera and or tape recorder. It could have been used to spook us even more with ghostly photos and mysterious groans & haunting cries from the tape recordings.
Eeeek!!! :)
...but what I know about is Texas; and down here, you're on your own!
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10 years ago
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catbookss
10 years ago
The Blair Witch of Hill House?
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Sonatine97
10 years ago
Well anyway: I guess I'll get over it (especially the scene where Luke erases the chalked writing). It's just been bugging me for 30 odd years 😀
...but what I know about is Texas; and down here, you're on your own!
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10 years ago
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AStrangeOldMan
10 years ago
Probably Paranormal Activity would have had no effect on me...
had they not filmed it a few miles from my brother in law's house, where I saw it,
which looks exactly like the one in the film.
Not that it was that great a horror classic (though an amazing moneymaker!) but a little unnerving as it was not just close to home - it WAS home.
It's all in the context.
No fate but what we make. -Terminator II
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midnight_muse
10 years ago
A thermometer and pen and paper would have been all he needed to measure and record the cold spots, and he could have manned cameras and a tape recorder himself.
It's been years since I read the book, but I think the doctor (called Dr. Montague in the book) did bring some equipment. I want to say a thermometer was placed in the cold spot and registered a noticeable drop, if I'm remembering correctly, and there may have been more of the same.
Dr. Montague's wife was also a paranormal researcher, but less scientific and more occult. During her visit to the house (a bit of excellent dark comedy, totally changed for the film, alas) she had brought "planchette," which was some sort of spirit communication device, probably like the moving planchette of a Ouija board but I think this one may have had a pencil to facilitate ghostly writings, unless I am confusing it with another ghostly novel.
Maybe the idea of including research equipment (props) was regarded as too visually complicating for the film, too much of a distraction from the psychological interplay. Or maybe they didn't want to build the expectation (a la Chekhov's gun on the mantel) that some of ghostly recordings would be played back later in the film? Don't know. Just a couple guesses.
_____________
I don't come from hell. I came from the forest.
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goldenagefilmstv (178)
2 years ago
@catbookss
Parapsychological research dates from the latter half of the 19th century. It was hardly "in its infancy" when this movie was made! The first official parapsychological association, The Society for Psychical Research, was founded in England in 1882.
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